Santa Monica is in trouble

Unfortunately USA has always used slave or fresh [cheap] immigrants to do the dirty/dangerous jobs, from Africans, to Irish, to Chinese, to the Italians, now to the Hispanics.
This is true for many counties. The Brits are having slaughter house staffing problems because of a lack immigrant labor post Brexit, the ME nations are notorious for using Philippine and Malaysian labor and basically imprisoning them in the country, and many German factories are staffed by Turks. When I was sent to Germany set up large installation of mainframe computers the local German team refused to help my American team and me pull underfloor cables. Instead, they got on the phone and brought in Turkish labor.

Scott
 
That's a loaded statement. Most young working age human are military aged male and potential jihadists. This kind of statement is like calling the equivalent aged white male in the US potential school mass shooters.
That's a silly analogy. Why would young Chinese males (rather than both males and females) come here when China is doing so well? Is it silly to think that many could be spies, sleepers etc....apparently so among our 'elites' who are profiting from China.
 
This is true for many counties. The Brits are having slaughter house staffing problems because of a lack immigrant labor post Brexit, the ME nations are notorious for using Philippine and Malaysian labor and basically imprisoning them in the country, and many German factories are staffed by Turks. When I was sent to Germany set up large installation of mainframe computers the local German team refused to help my American team and me pull underfloor cables. Instead, they got on the phone and brought in Turkish labor.

Scott
Maybe if governments weren't so generous with taxpayer funded 'benefits' the locals would be more inclined to do some of those
less desirable jobs.
 
The homeless problem will never get fixed.

1) Treating the root of the problem (crime/addiction/etc.) is expensive and would take literally decades to break the cycle.
2) The problem will outlive any elected politician faced with it so they have no incentive to deal with it when it can just be passed on to the next guy, however long that takes.
3) No one can agree on how to do it, either with hippie hand-holding free care and housing all the way to the Soylent Green grinder, and anything in between.
4) But ultimately, there's no way to make money doing it, and that's how America rolls.

It will never be fixed as long as politicians have the unending financial spigot flowing. CA is a prime example of how gov't "wastes" tax dollars at best and a more cynical view would conjure the word fraud. The amount of $$$ funneled through NGO's in CA to address homelessness is a cash cow for all involved, except the actual homeless. NGO's at the US border are also raking in the cash in a similar manner.
 
It will never be fixed as long as politicians have the unending financial spigot flowing. CA is a prime example of how gov't "wastes" tax dollars at best and a more cynical view would conjure the word fraud. The amount of $$$ funneled through NGO's in CA to address homelessness is a cash cow for all involved, except the actual homeless. NGO's at the US border are also raking in the cash in a similar manner.
California spent 1.3% of its budget on homelessness last year (~$4B per year from a $290Bish budget). Much like the current "outrage" over federal spending on foreign aid, which also averages somewhere around 1% of the federal budget even though polls show Americans estimate foreign aid on average to be somewhere around 25% of the federal budget, this problem is overexaggerated as far as the magnitude of the "irresponsible spending". These "cash cows" are receiving peanuts in the overall scheme of things.
 
California spent 1.3% of its budget on homelessness last year (~$4B per year from a $290Bish budget). Much like the current "outrage" over federal spending on foreign aid, which also averages somewhere around 1% of the federal budget even though polls show Americans estimate foreign aid on average to be somewhere around 25% of the federal budget, this problem is overexaggerated as far as the magnitude of the "irresponsible spending". These "cash cows" are receiving peanuts in the overall scheme of things.
OK sure.

$4,000,000,000 for one state. With the problem getting worse. You made a point about people (in general). But you swamped your own salami.

Seattle relatively spends even more. Problem is worse than ever.

Money is not fixing the problem!! It has created worse problems. Homeless industry. Moochers at all levels. Leeches sucking millions off at every level. Deep dependency.

Just STOP. People will starve, sure. Then we feed the starving. People will die, but we make sure the truly innocent don't die and let the moochers - able bodied men who chose drugs and loafing - go in the desert.

Remember: "there will always be poor people"

No I am NOT cold hearted. I am a realist and know people will never be motivated if everything is just given to them. Time to grow up. Will it be ugly? Face facts, grow up.
 
California spent 1.3% of its budget on homelessness last year (~$4B per year from a $290Bish budget). Much like the current "outrage" over federal spending on foreign aid, which also averages somewhere around 1% of the federal budget even though polls show Americans estimate foreign aid on average to be somewhere around 25% of the federal budget, this problem is overexaggerated as far as the magnitude of the "irresponsible spending". These "cash cows" are receiving peanuts in the overall scheme of thing

$4 Billion, brotha! And still an epic failure. And you call it "peanuts." Some do not have a grasp of just how much money a billion actually is. Amazing how caviler some are when it ain't their money! Some reason you went off on a tangent with the fed gov't that has zero to do with what I posted.
 
OK sure.

$4,000,000,000 for one state. With the problem getting worse. You made a point about people (in general). But you swamped your own salami.

Seattle relatively spends even more. Problem is worse than ever.

Money is not fixing the problem!! It has created worse problems. Homeless industry. Moochers at all levels. Leeches sucking millions off at every level. Deep dependency.

Just STOP. People will starve, sure. Then we feed the starving. People will die, but we make sure the truly innocent don't die and let the moochers - able bodied men who chose drugs and loafing - go in the desert.

Remember: "there will always be poor people"

No I am NOT cold hearted. I am a realist and know people will never be motivated if everything is just given to them. Time to grow up. Will it be ugly? Face facts, grow up.
Settle down Pablo, let's keep it in first gear, Bud. Nowhere did I say this spending solves anything. Nowhere did I say this spending is good or bad. I merely pointed out that the magnitude of the actual spending is greatly exaggerated. Take from that what you will but put words or ideas in my mouth.

Also, understand that California has 43% more homeless people than NYS which has the second most homeless people in the US, so let's stop pretending California is just the tip of the iceberg, when it's most of the iceberg.
 
$4 Billion, brotha! And still an epic failure. And you call it "peanuts." Some do not have a grasp of just how much money a billion actually is. Amazing how caviler some are when it ain't their money! Some reason you went off on a tangent with the fed gov't that has zero to do with what I posted.
It has everything to do with what you posted. People lack an understanding of the number line and of magnitude and will go nuts over expenditures that make up <1% of the budget and ignore the expenditures that make up 20% of the budget. There are bigger fish to fry but this one and foreign aid get more traction than they deserve because people believe more is being spent than there is.
 
Settle down Pablo, let's keep it in first gear, Bud. Nowhere did I say this spending solves anything. Nowhere did I say this spending is good or bad. I merely pointed out that the magnitude of the actual spending is greatly exaggerated. Take from that what you will but put words or ideas in my mouth.

Also, understand that California has 43% more homeless people than NYS which has the second most homeless people in the US, so let's stop pretending California is just the tip of the iceberg, when it's most of the iceberg.
Not directed at you personally
 
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It has everything to do with what you posted. People lack an understanding of the number line and of magnitude and will go nuts over expenditures that make up <1% of the budget and ignore the expenditures that make up 20% of the budget. There are bigger fish to fry but this one and foreign aid get more traction than they deserve because people believe more is being spent than there is.

Your assumption is singularly pointed to a perception of the masses and rather antiseptic. And back to foreign aid. Foreign aid has zero to do with CA homeless. Regardless of what percentage 4 Billion represents in CA budget terms it is still a massive and EPIC fail with a massive sum of coin. 4 Billion is 4 Billion no matter the utopia illuded to. Despite that clear failure in addressing homelessness in CA the state continues to pay the very same NGO's for the very same services that are by all accounts, fruitless.

Who is largely benefiting from this billion dollar industry in CA? Sure isn't the homeless. Maybe if CA spent 5% of its budget the issue would miraculously be fixed. We all know it wouldn't yet that is the premise being espoused.
 
Your assumption is singularly pointed to a perception of the masses and rather antiseptic. And back to foreign aid. Foreign aid has zero to do with CA homeless. Regardless of what percentage 4 Billion represents in CA budget terms it is still a massive and EPIC fail with a massive sum of coin. 4 Billion is 4 Billion no matter the utopia illuded to. Despite that clear failure in addressing homelessness in CA the state continues to pay the very same NGO's for the very same services that are by all accounts, fruitless.

Who is largely benefiting from this billion dollar industry in CA? Sure isn't the homeless. Maybe if CA spent 5% of its budget the issue would miraculously be fixed. We all know it wouldn't yet that is the premise being espoused.
Let's also stop pretending all $4B was a total waste of those funds. Inevitably, some of those funds fed some homeless kids and there was some real ROI, even if it didn't "solve homelessness". If the taxpayers of California don't want to spend 1.4% of their taxpayer dollars, they can vote.
 
Maybe if governments weren't so generous with taxpayer funded 'benefits' the locals would be more inclined to do some of those
less desirable jobs.

According to history, no the 'locals' won't.
 
OK sure.

$4,000,000,000 for one state. With the problem getting worse. You made a point about people (in general). But you swamped your own salami.

Seattle relatively spends even more. Problem is worse than ever.

Money is not fixing the problem!! It has created worse problems. Homeless industry. Moochers at all levels. Leeches sucking millions off at every level. Deep dependency.

Just STOP. People will starve, sure. Then we feed the starving. People will die, but we make sure the truly innocent don't die and let the moochers - able bodied men who chose drugs and loafing - go in the desert.

Remember: "there will always be poor people"

No I am NOT cold hearted. I am a realist and know people will never be motivated if everything is just given to them. Time to grow up. Will it be ugly? Face facts, grow up.
This resonates.

Locally, we have safe injection sites, multiple shelters, needle exchange programs, clean needle dispensaries, methadone clinics...etc. It's an industry, and a thriving one, as we continue to throw money this city doesn't have at a problem it can't solve.

"Back in the day" we operated a (large) facility adjacent to the hospital, which was a dedicated mental health facility. It treated everything, had considerable inpatient space, but had staff that could handle outpatient as well. When we built the new hospital, we shrunk, pruned and condensed that facility's role into a ward. No longer accessible as a standalone, no longer a considerable resource with its own staff. The bar is set very high to get admitted. Of course this was part of the Western push to get away from inpatient mental health treatment and download that onto families, parents and social workers as outpatient because it was "more humane"; more "progressive".

There's a dedicated mental health facility in Toronto called "CAMH" (Centre for Addiction and Mental Health) that's a sprawling complex with considerable resources, like a jumbo version of the facility we had adjacent to our hospital, with separate buildings for different patient and treatment types. The facility is very successful with the work it does, because it is able to offer all levels of necessary care, including housing those who cannot properly function outside its walls.

I've been told our city can't afford to build or operate a facility like CAMH. But then I look at how much money we are pumping into this addiction and homelessness industry through all these private organizations that do nothing to solve the problem and I think, if all those functions were condensed into a single large treatment facility, that could also offer inpatient care and real treatment, I suspect that per client, it would be considerably cheaper. The problem is that with all these private parties hitched to the public trough, and with considerable political influence, getting something passed that would enable this; that would enable effective care, would be nary impossible.
 
We have plenty of homeless here in Charleston - but they run them off from the public places. Panhandling is illegal. Urinating in a public place is illegal, drugs are illegal. No one is going to prosecute, but they can toss them in the drunk tank for a day - make sure they get roughed up a bunch so they don't want to come back, then kick them loose.

You wont find them on the street corner, but they will approach you for money in parking lots and the gas station more discreetly. In the winter when we loose some of the leaves you see there tents and such in the woods, and places like under over passes, etc.

There not the problem you have in the West, but the problem exists. Most has to do with drugs, because we have plenty of places they can go, but they don't want to go there because there drugs aren't allowed.

No idea what the solution is. Prison isn't it likely. Take a drug addict, turn them into a real criminal in prison then let them out doesn't seem productive. There not going to change unless they want to, and it seems none want to.
Supreme Court has ruled that panhandling is legal. Protected under the 1st amendment.
 
Supreme Court has ruled that panhandling is legal. Protected under the 1st amendment.
Unless something has changed, that is incorrect.

The supreme court has ruled asking for money in a public place is not illegal. If I want to sit in a park during normal hours with a can in front of me asking for money, I can do so. But that isn't panhandling. Its akin to the salvation army's red bucket at Christmas. The ruling was designed to protect that sort of activity.

  • I can't solicit money from people in cars (public safety)
  • I can't solicit money aggressively. The aggressive part is public nuisance.
  • I can't solicit money at the curtilage to a public building or private business - thats the definition of loitering - your obstructing people with legitimate business there.

Panhandling is different.
 
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