S2000 - Will 9000 rpm and M1 0W30 AFE be ok?

[david_ES2]

Like stated above, the car was specd to run 10w30 conventional , im sure shear stability had to do with it, so i wouldnt sweat using a fully synthetic in a 0w30 5w30

 

[demarpaint]

How about Mobil 1 0W40? That would be my pick.

 

[pbm]

Originally Posted By: david_ES2

Like stated above, the car was specd to run 10w30 conventional , im sure shear stability had to do with it, so i wouldnt sweat using a fully synthetic in a 0w30 5w30

I agree. If you're worried you could always buy a 5 qt. jug of M1 0w40 at WM and mix with your 0w30 at a 60/40 or 70/30 rate...see Catherham blend...

 

[Turk]

In that scenario, I would go with Mobil 1 0w-40 or similar offer from Amsoil.

 

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: 3311

I would think m1 hm 10w30 would work nicely. Hths of 3.5 and boosted add pack.

^^^ This. The OP is in Louisiana and doesn't need a 0w30. Honda recommended an SJ 10w30 for the S2000 engine, and M1 HM 10w30 is SL.

 

[cpayne5]

I run Mobil1 0w-40 in mine. Relatively cheap at WalMart in the 5qt jugs.

 

[Dallas69]

When is this engine going to hit 9000rpm? This car was owned by an older gent for 100,000 miles and now you want to over rev it ? Do what you want it's your car,but it is spec'd for 10-30 so why not use that? You will get many opinions on here so this is mine. Use 10-30.

 

[Swifty]

Originally Posted By: Dallas69

When is this engine going to hit 9000rpm? This car was owned by an older gent for 100,000 miles and now you want to over rev it ? Do what you want it's your car,but it is spec'd for 10-30 so why not use that? You will get many opinions on here so this is mine. Use 10-30.

9000 rpms on a daily basis! Drive it like you stole it. The 2.0 F20C(1999-2003) redline is 9000rpms and these cars are meant to rev the F22C(2004/2009) 2.2L 8000rpms. One of the best normally aspirated 4 cylinders ever built IMO. Having owned a 2006, as long as it is stock I see no need to change from what Honda recommends. A 10/30 will do you fine.

 

[BrennanF]

Originally Posted By: Swifty

Originally Posted By: Dallas69

When is this engine going to hit 9000rpm? This car was owned by an older gent for 100,000 miles and now you want to over rev it ? Do what you want it's your car,but it is spec'd for 10-30 so why not use that? You will get many opinions on here so this is mine. Use 10-30.

9000 rpms on a daily basis! Drive it like you stole it. The 2.0 F20C(1999-2003) redline is 9000rpms and these cars are meant to rev the F22C(2004/2009) 2.2L 8000rpms. One of the best normally aspirated 4 cylinders ever built IMO. Having owned a 2006, as long as it is stock I see no need to change from what Honda recommends. A 10/30 will do you fine.

Right. I'm not abusing the car by any means just using it as designed. I'm going to steer clear of the 0W30 for now and fill with M1 HM 10W30 for the next OCI. My understanding was Honda chose the 10W30 at the time due to it being the best sheer stable option. I'll keep this in mind as I move forward with ownership.

 

[aquariuscsm]

I too would stay with the 10W. I'd go with black bottle Edge 10W30.

 

[Swifty]

Originally Posted By: BrennanF

Originally Posted By: Swifty

Originally Posted By: Dallas69

When is this engine going to hit 9000rpm? This car was owned by an older gent for 100,000 miles and now you want to over rev it ? Do what you want it's your car,but it is spec'd for 10-30 so why not use that? You will get many opinions on here so this is mine. Use 10-30.

9000 rpms on a daily basis! Drive it like you stole it. The 2.0 F20C(1999-2003) redline is 9000rpms and these cars are meant to rev the F22C(2004/2009) 2.2L 8000rpms. One of the best normally aspirated 4 cylinders ever built IMO. Having owned a 2006, as long as it is stock I see no need to change from what Honda recommends. A 10/30 will do you fine.

Right. I'm not abusing the car by any means just using it as designed. I'm going to steer clear of the 0W30 for now and fill with M1 HM 10W30 for the next OCI. My understanding was Honda chose the 10W30 at the time due to it being the best sheer stable option. I'll keep this in mind as I move forward with ownership.

Smart man. I miss mine everyday...Enjoy the car, lots of fun.

 

[weasley]

Originally Posted By: ExMachina

Since higher RPMs means the S2000 is operating to the far right on the Stribeck curve, your 0w-30 is perfect for this engine. 6 month oil changes, don't even count miles, time is better.

So the WHOLE engine is operating "to the far right of the Stribeck curve" because the crankshaft is rotating (briefly) at 9,000 rpm?! Even at 9,000 rpm, the pistons still come to a complete stop twice per stroke and the camshaft is only turning at 4,500 rpm. The Stribeck curve is a theoretical model to model friction at a given moment under known conditions. At any given moment in a running engine, there are a number of different surfaces being put under different conditions and so the whole engine is all over the Stribeck curve at the same time. It can not be used as an oil selection tool.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Don't use a current ILSAC oil. This is not a "fuel economy focused" passenger car engine The M1 is not synthetic - not that this would help in ANY way. I would stick with the Edge or a nice 5w40 ACEA A3,B4. I woupd worry more about the trans - and good luck with the trans - every used one I test drove had trashed blockers. Have you tried any 8k 2-3 shifts yet?

 

[Phishin]

You live in Louisiana. It's hot there. I'd go with a more shear stable oil than a 0w30, like you've already said you were going to do. If it was my car and I live where you live, I'd run a 10w30 HM oil, or a 10w40 HM oil. M1 or Maxlife. Also, since the engine has 100k on it, and you think it was mostly serviced with dino, I'd consider running multiple short OCI's with a good HDEO, like Rotella 15w40 or Delo or Delvac for 2k mile OCI's. Then go to M1 or Maxlife or anything else synthetic in a 10w30 or 10w40 flavor.

 

[BrennanF]

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite

Don't use a current ILSAC oil. This is not a "fuel economy focused" passenger car engine The M1 is not synthetic - not that this would help in ANY way. I would stick with the Edge or a nice 5w40 ACEA A3,B4. I woupd worry more about the trans - and good luck with the trans - every used one I test drove had trashed blockers. Have you tried any 8k 2-3 shifts yet?

Transmission is slightly notchy but no grinds. Using Honda MTF III but have considered switching to Torco MTF which from what I've read is more geared towards the older Honda transmissions with brass syncros.

 

[Swifty]

Originally Posted By: BrennanF

Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite

Don't use a current ILSAC oil. This is not a "fuel economy focused" passenger car engine The M1 is not synthetic - not that this would help in ANY way. I would stick with the Edge or a nice 5w40 ACEA A3,B4. I woupd worry more about the trans - and good luck with the trans - every used one I test drove had trashed blockers. Have you tried any 8k 2-3 shifts yet?

Transmission is slightly notchy but no grinds. Using Honda MTF III but have considered switching to Torco MTF which from what I've read is more geared towards the older Honda transmissions with brass syncros.

I tried several fluids Amsoil MTF, Redline MTL but always came back to the Honda MTFII fluid it shifted the best overall. When cold it wasn't as smooth with the other fluids.

 

[ExMachina]

Originally Posted By: Shannow

[quote=ExMachina]Since higher RPMs means the S2000 is operating to the far right on the Stribeck curve, your 0w-30 is perfect for this engine. 6 month oil changes, don't even count miles, time is better.

Got to be careful with using "the curve" like that in that the other factor is the load...while the RHS rises with RPM, the loads vary as well.

Originally Posted By: Shannow

Inertial loads on the bearings rise with speed squared.

OK, I see it now, omegasquared x r , yes, where omega is RPM in radians/sec units.

Originally Posted By: Shannow

So a doubling of the speed over a similarly designed engine should double your Stribeck number for constant load, the four fold inertial load increase could reduce your Stribeck number by a factor of 4. So load = constant, an 8 may be a 16 on the X axis due to speed, the 16 could become 4 when inertial loads come in.

Not quite that simple though, since TotalLoadForce = CombustionForce + InertiaForce, only the Inertia part of that gets a lot bigger. I haven't calculated what percentage consists of the Inertia component, but it may overwhelm the CombustionForce at some high RPM.

Originally Posted By: Shannow

Honda chose a shear stable grade initially in 10W30, and a higher HTHS but potentially more shear prone 5W40 if the 5W is needed, so I think 0W30 is going counter to their thinking on the engine's needs.

If the M1 0w-30 makes one queasy to use, then I like the suggestions above to mix about half-half the stash of 0w-30 with M1 0w-40 or use 100% M1 HighMile 10w-30 good choices all. (The M1 0w-40 is used for some serious endurance racing, so its got what it takes.)

 

[aquariuscsm]

What about the regular M1 10W30 (not the hm version)?

 

[ExMachina]

Originally Posted By: weasley

Originally Posted By: ExMachina

Since higher RPMs means the S2000 is operating to the far right on the Stribeck curve, your 0w-30 is perfect for this engine. 6 month oil changes, don't even count miles, time is better.

So the WHOLE engine is operating "to the far right of the Stribeck curve" because the crankshaft is rotating (briefly) at 9,000 rpm?! Even at 9,000 rpm, the pistons still come to a complete stop twice per stroke and the camshaft is only turning at 4,500 rpm. The Stribeck curve is a theoretical model to model friction at a given moment under known conditions. At any given moment in a running engine, there are a number of different surfaces being put under different conditions and so the whole engine is all over the Stribeck curve at the same time. It can not be used as an oil selection tool.

It can and should be used as an oil selection tool. Engineers do it all the time. Its not theoretical, as the friction is actual engine run measurements, or whatever physical cam/lobe interface device you might have for it. Corresponds with oil film thickness, which, again, isn't theoretical but REAL. I do agree with your statements about some parts of the engine are always on the left side of the Stribeck no matter what, like wrist (gudgeon) pins at times, TDC & BDC cylinder walls and rings, sure. Understand thats in all engines all the time, so no news there. It goes without saying. Like Shannow pointed out, it does make sense to consider the inertia loading. Thats a valid discussion. Hard to say how the torque (combustion) part of journal bearing loads compares to the inertia loads, but in high rpm engines, it could be way up there.

 

[BrennanF]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm

What about the regular M1 10W30 (not the hm version)?

According to the S2000 web boards this particular engine tends to consume regular M1 but I've yet to experience this myself. My example appears to be in better shape then most with similar mileage so perhaps it would work fine. Reading over on the M1 site the AFE appears to actually be ticker than regular at the 100C test spec than regular M1. It also has a similar HTHS which lead me to believe perhaps it would suitable but I'm not willing to experiment with it. It runs great and I'd like to keep it that way long as possible.