Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: KenO
Where did all of the T6 hate come from for the BMW engines? M50/S52's call for LL-01 as well, don't they? There's absolutely no way in [censored] you'd catch me dead running ANY 5W-30 oil in a BMW, LL-01 or not. We've run T6 for years and years in LOTS of NA & turbo'd track cars. I've never, ever seen or heard of an oil related failure on any of them, and road course racing is probably one of the highest levels of abuse on these engines in this part of the US, especially when they oil starve in high-G cornering!
Hold your pants on, nobody is "hating" on T6, they are simply saying that M1 0w-40 is more appropriate for an LL-01 application. That doesn't equate to hatred of the non-approved product.
Your point about 5w-30 doesn't really make sense to me though. The LL-01 5w-30 lubricants all have an HTHS >=3.5cP, which puts them in basically the same league as the 40-weights here. Mobil Delvac 1 5w-40 has the same HTHS as M1 0w-40 at 3.8cP, which isn't a whole heck of a lot higher than the minimum for the Euro specs of 3.5cP, and if D1 is similar, you can bet your pants that T6 is as well, since it and D1 have the same target market and meet most of the same performance requirements and carry the same approvals.
And I'm sorry but your anecdotes about lack of failure with T6 don't mean that it is a better choice here. Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Audi....etc I'm sure do far, FAR more track engine testing than any of us and when validating approved lubricants, they've probably done more of it in the last year than the cumulation of everybody on here has participated in during their lifetimes.
Again, I'm not saying T6 is in any way a bad lubricant. But I fail to see any compelling reason to use it over the readily available approved lubricant for this application.
Oh, and no, both of those engines (M50/S52) pre-date LL-01. It was the M52TU that would have spec'd it.
Well, the way both of OP's threads have gone seems to put a lot of fear mongering in NOT using an LL-01 approved oil. While yes, LL-01 approved oils are quite robust - he's NOT going to do damage in a daily driver by not using something thats not LL-01. Thats like telling everfybody that uses Redline that they're going to have issues simply because Redline doesn't bother with most OEM approvals.
OP's question, however, wasn't whats best - it was if he can run 1 lube for all 3 applications, and yes, yes he can. And I didn't state anything about any lubricant being a BETTER choice. However, 'better choice' doens't answer OP's question. Is T6 safe to use in both of his other engines, to only stock 1 oil on the shelf? Absolutely, without a doubt, I foresee 0 ill effects. Maybe OP wants to be able to buy something in bulk, and in that case, a single lubricant also absolutely makes sense. [censored], I know fo a number of local indy's that don't put anything other than GTX 20W-50 in most BMW or Merc engines, and I don't see them going out of business due to failed engines either.
Originally Posted By: KenO
Where did all of the T6 hate come from for the BMW engines? M50/S52's call for LL-01 as well, don't they? There's absolutely no way in [censored] you'd catch me dead running ANY 5W-30 oil in a BMW, LL-01 or not. We've run T6 for years and years in LOTS of NA & turbo'd track cars. I've never, ever seen or heard of an oil related failure on any of them, and road course racing is probably one of the highest levels of abuse on these engines in this part of the US, especially when they oil starve in high-G cornering!
Hold your pants on, nobody is "hating" on T6, they are simply saying that M1 0w-40 is more appropriate for an LL-01 application. That doesn't equate to hatred of the non-approved product.
Your point about 5w-30 doesn't really make sense to me though. The LL-01 5w-30 lubricants all have an HTHS >=3.5cP, which puts them in basically the same league as the 40-weights here. Mobil Delvac 1 5w-40 has the same HTHS as M1 0w-40 at 3.8cP, which isn't a whole heck of a lot higher than the minimum for the Euro specs of 3.5cP, and if D1 is similar, you can bet your pants that T6 is as well, since it and D1 have the same target market and meet most of the same performance requirements and carry the same approvals.
And I'm sorry but your anecdotes about lack of failure with T6 don't mean that it is a better choice here. Porsche, Mercedes, BMW, Audi....etc I'm sure do far, FAR more track engine testing than any of us and when validating approved lubricants, they've probably done more of it in the last year than the cumulation of everybody on here has participated in during their lifetimes.
Again, I'm not saying T6 is in any way a bad lubricant. But I fail to see any compelling reason to use it over the readily available approved lubricant for this application.
Oh, and no, both of those engines (M50/S52) pre-date LL-01. It was the M52TU that would have spec'd it.
Well, the way both of OP's threads have gone seems to put a lot of fear mongering in NOT using an LL-01 approved oil. While yes, LL-01 approved oils are quite robust - he's NOT going to do damage in a daily driver by not using something thats not LL-01. Thats like telling everfybody that uses Redline that they're going to have issues simply because Redline doesn't bother with most OEM approvals.
OP's question, however, wasn't whats best - it was if he can run 1 lube for all 3 applications, and yes, yes he can. And I didn't state anything about any lubricant being a BETTER choice. However, 'better choice' doens't answer OP's question. Is T6 safe to use in both of his other engines, to only stock 1 oil on the shelf? Absolutely, without a doubt, I foresee 0 ill effects. Maybe OP wants to be able to buy something in bulk, and in that case, a single lubricant also absolutely makes sense. [censored], I know fo a number of local indy's that don't put anything other than GTX 20W-50 in most BMW or Merc engines, and I don't see them going out of business due to failed engines either.
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