RLI Biosyn, 5w20, 7731 miles, 2004 honda pilot

[Gilberttribe]

This was our first use of RLI Biosyn after switching from M1. Driving was similar to pervious posts with 70/30 highway/city where this included the second half of winter. Fuel came down some, but would of course like to see it lower. Our next UOA will have less idling in the car pool line.

2004 Honda Pilot 3.5L

Code:


Oil Lab Dyson Dyson BlkStn BlkStn

Oil Brand RLI Bio M1 M1 M1

Oil Weight 5w20 5w20 0w20 0w20

Oil Filter AmsOil M1 K&N Honda

Sampe Date 5/31/08 1/8/08 8/8/04 4/7/04

Miles Oil 7731 7637 7992 3774

Miles unit 83221 75490 15556 7564



aluminum 5 6 5 8

chromium 1 1 2 2

iron 14 16 17 18

copper 25 22 54 61

lead 1 0 3 2

tin 0 0 2 2

moly 14 90 57 97

nickel 0 1 0 0

manganese 13 17 1 2

silver 0 0 0 0

titanium 0 0 0 0

potassium 0 0 1 1

boron 18 56 104 141

silicon 17 8 8 16

sodium 17 13 6 6

calcium 0 1976 2886 2725

magnesium 13 17 13 14

phosphorus 851 749 738 708

zinc 1092 884 923 888

barium 0 0 0 0



Visc 50.0 49.6 56.3

Fuel 1.2 1.46 < 0.5



flash 330 300

oxid 151 26

nit 16 14

tbn 2.2 3.3

tan 2.61 2.28

sulfate 115 26

 

[buster]

Tbn looks better with the M1.

 

[addyguy]

Yeah, when you can most likely get M1 easier and cheaper (sales, etc..) and get slightly better results (TBN), seems pointless to switch. Just an opinion.

If you 'really like' RLI, and what they do, then this won't matter - use what you want.

 

[RI_RS4]

You might want to change your air filter and check for leaks. Looks to me like you're picking up sand and road salts that are prevalent in Colorado.

I predict that once you have the residual [censored] cleaned out of your engine, that your metal numbers will drop.

22 ppm of copper from the previous M1 at 75K miles seems high. That it continues to stay up is something to watch out for. You seem to have had high copper since day one.

Manganese is coming down and tracks your fuel dilution decrease.

 

[Taylor]

no antimony?

 

[Pablo]

Looks like standard copper for this engine. Typical Honda 3.5 V6 wear to some extent. TBN retention is not superior...is your crankcase ventilation 100% in good order? I can't judge the ox. number - no point of reference for this oil.

I'm also running a noncompliant oil in my Honda 3.5. (Amsoil Racing 5W-20), it'll be interesting to see how it compares.

 

[buster]

No calcium for the RLI?

 

[benjamming]

Remember folks that the 1st 2 UOAs were from several years ago. Also, you can't really compare the wear #s from Blackstone to Terry's lab since they use different machines with different particle detection sizes. Terry's lab will detect much higher.

I agree with RSI, when was the last air filter change? Standard filter?

Nitration is high. When were the plugs last changed? What type?

 

[Gilberttribe]

I agree that the silicon number looked out of place. I replace the air filter when I change the oil, so the air filter was in use for less than 7731 miles. I use Fram air filters. OK, I believe I did change the plugs during this oil analysis period, which I had forgotten about until Benjamming inquired about them (thank you). The old plugs were 100K OEM (still in great condition), and were replaced with Bosch Platium IR fusion. It is such a pain to take the plugs out to examine them that I changed them anyway. The extra silicon is likely from the plug change since the plugs sit in a deep, dirt collecting hole. I am extremely careful, but it is impossible to keep all the dirt out during the change even with compressed air. I don't like working on cars, but I like paying someone to do the easy stuff even less.

Thank you for the replies.

Does looking down the plug holes or the oil fill hole give you an indication of how clean the inside of the motor is? I think I can see a rocker down the motor oil hole, and it looks very clean.

 

[DCRamsey]

I've had six or so UOA's done by Terry Dyson on a Honda Accord V-6 and each report has shown high silicon. I have been very diligent and keeping a clean paper filter in the car. Terry has come to the conclusion that my car (that V-6) has a lot of assembly silicon. "residual silicon in this engine is AMAZINGLY resilient to whatever oil is used." I might offer that it can be an issue with Honda's and not as it might appear dirt.

 

[GimpyMR2]

Is it possible that over-servcing your air filters could be hurting your silicon number?

I was doing the same thing on my Volvo S70 (changing filter every oil change almost), until I was told that the filters ability to... filter.. dramaticly increases as the "dust cake" forms. I haven't done a UOA since stopping the practice though :\

 

[Gilberttribe]

Originally Posted By: GimpyMR2
Is it possible that over-servcing your air filters could be hurting your silicon number?

I was doing the same thing on my Volvo S70 (changing filter every oil change almost), until I was told that the filters ability to... filter.. dramaticly increases as the "dust cake" forms. I haven't done a UOA since stopping the practice though :\


That is a good question. I thought the same way, but read other information, so I decided to try this approach. I'll be interested to see how this works over time.

 

[JoeFromPA]

I agree with Gimpy's thought....filters flow decreases is filtering increases....which occurs over time as more dirt is caught. I don't think replacing an air filter every 5k miles is a good idea.....you need it to average out over time.

Joe

 

[benjamming]

I believe that a freely flowing air filter is what you are after when changing frequently like the OP is doing. But, you do have to be extra careful that everything is sealed back up perfectly every time which increases the possibilities of human error (including dusty ambient conditions).