Red Line 5W30 vs. 10W30 and shearing

[mf150]

Hi!

Just wanted to know which oil was more shear stable for all rpms, cold start-ups, and all ambient temps. (RED LINE 5w30 or Red Line 10w30).

I will be running this oil in a 03 Mustang 4.6L SOHC GT that sees occasional track use (drag strip). The car is also driven occasionally on the street.

Maybe we can start a poll:

Red Line 5w30 = 1
Red Line 10w30 = 2
other (please specify) = 3


Thanks!

 

[427Z06]

This reminds me of Monty Python's "Search for the Holy Grail".

One...no two...Argghhhhhhhhhh..........

 

[Bill Morris]

WOuldn't the 10w30 be more shear stable. Haven't used redline...

 

[Idrinkmotoroil]

since cold temp operation isnt a concern in your area , it would be an easy decision to go with 10w30. In any brand of oil a 10w30 has got to be more stable just by it's very make-up I would have to say. You might not be able to tell the difference between the two grades when it comes down to it, but I'd always go with the 10w for that extra bit of insurance.

 

[Patman]

Flip a coin, because you'll probably get equal results from either choice. If you drove in any kind of cold weather the 5w30 would obviously be superior. But at the same time, the 5w30 could handle the heat just as well as the 10w30. They both have the same HTHS number of 3.8.

 

[mf150]

The coolest it gets here in San Francisco is a drizzley 45*F. Well above frozen.

Flowability at start-up (Red Line 5w30) vs. high temp./long OCI stability (Red Line 10w30)

any comments?

 

[harrydog]

10w30 for me please.

 

[Idrinkmotoroil]

quote:

---

Originally posted by mf150:
The coolest it gets here in San Francisco is a drizzley 45*F. Well above frozen.

Flowability at start-up (Red Line 5w30) vs. high temp./long OCI stability (Red Line 10w30)

any comments?

---

you're well within the flowing capabilities of a 10w30, I dont see any advantage for a 5w30 at those temps. If it got below freezing on a regular basis I would say the 5w30 , but your location is fine for the 10w30 without any sacrifices.

 

[Whimsey]

If you engage in a fair amount of "enthusiastic" or "spirited" driving then in most cases 10w30 would be preferred over 5w30. I think you said that you are currently running Redline 5w30. Have you done any used oil analysis to see how it's held up? The only way to answer your question is to do a run and used oil analysis with the Red Line 5w30 and then one with Red Line 10w30. And post the results for all us "addicts" to see

. Besides, you'd be doing a great service in answering the age old question of "do the Ford Modular engines really need a thin oil".

.

Whimsey

 

[satterfi]

I like the 10w30 since it meets CH-4/CI-4 specs according to RL.

 

[Schmoe]

I'd go with 10w30, numbers are closer together which is usually the rule of thumb when determining shear rates.

 

[Bruce T]

TallPaul, I like your theory. Red Line 10W30 is still an excellent oil, but their 5W30 makes it redundant. The old rules don't always apply to new technology. Red Line must keep it in their lineup to satisfy old school customers.

 

[mf150]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Whimsey:
If you engage in a fair amount of "enthusiastic" or "spirited" driving then in most cases 10w30 would be preferred over 5w30. I think you said that you are currently running Redline 5w30. Have you done any used oil analysis to see how it's held up? The only way to answer your question is to do a run and used oil analysis with the Red Line 5w30 and then one with Red Line 10w30. And post the results for all us "addicts" to see

. Besides, you'd be doing a great service in answering the age old question of "do the Ford Modular engines really need a thin oil".

.

Whimsey

---

can you recommend a website? I am doing OCIs at 5,000 miles while still under warranty, but I have been running Red Line 5w30 since the first change at 500 miles.

right on!

 

[dropitby]

I think 10/30 if it were 10/40 as opposed to 5w40 without VII it just makes sence.

Do they make a 0/30

 

[Patman]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bruce T:
TallPaul, I like your theory. Red Line 10W30 is still an excellent oil, but their 5W30 makes it redundant. The old rules don't always apply to new technology. Red Line must keep it in their lineup to satisfy old school customers.

---

I think that's why so many 10w30 synthetics still exist. It's not like they are necessary, it's just that a lot of people continue to run them out of habit. But nowadays a good 5w30 synthetic is just as good as a 10w30 in hot weather, but it's better than the 10w30 in cold weather, so it's truly the better choice. And in some cases such as with GC 0w30, this choice is even better over a 5w30 (althought it's hard to compare GC 0w30 to a 5w30 or 10w30 since there is no 5w30 or 10w30 version of this oil made by Castrol Germany)

 

[Bruce T]

mf150, I would listen to Patman's advice. I recently asked Dave at Red Line, "which oil would perform better in hot Southern climates, Red Line 5W30 or 10W30." He said they were equivalent, neither oil was superior.

Look at the specs. They both have the same shear rate of 3.8. Unlike 5W30 conventional oils, Dave said Red Line 5W30 doesn't contain ANY viscosity index improvers (plastic chains) that can be sheared down. It's a totally different ballgame when dealing with the viscosity range of a high-end synthetic oil.

The 5W30 has a slighter higher viscosity at 100 C (10.9 vs 10.7), so it's not thinner when it's hot. The 5W30 has a slightly higher flash point (486 vs 480 F). The 5W30 has slightly better flow during cold starts (less engine wear), but since both oils contain polarized esters that cling to metal, this advantage may be negated.

Even in the Bay Area, I'd personally choose the Red Line 5W30 by the tiniest of margins.

[ August 30, 2004, 01:40 PM: Message edited by: Bruce T ]

 

[TallPaul]

From what BruceT reports, it seems the 10w30 is unnecessary as the 5w30 does everything the 10w30 does and more. Maybe it is there for those who just can't stomach the idea of running a 5wXX oil.

As for the 5w30 having a higher viscosity than the 10w30, I notice the Valvoline tech sheets show Maxlife 5w30 at 10.6 and Maxlife 10w30 at 10.5, maybe not significant, but wonder what is going on there.

 

[mf150]

Patman, I have a good feeling about Red Line 5w30 after reading your last post.

better old flowability and the same protection at running temp. Since Red Line doesn't use polymers (I assume...even though I'm ignorant, the oil is more shear stable.

Thanks for your clear imput!

Thanks to all.

 

[TheFuror]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Patman:
[I think that's why so many 10w30 synthetics still exist. It's not like they are necessary, it's just that a lot of people continue to run them out of habit. But nowadays a good 5w30 synthetic is just as good as a 10w30 in hot weather, but it's better than the 10w30 in cold weather, so it's truly the better choice.

---

Well, this raises an interesting question, because some 10w30's seem superior (at least to this old cowboy), than their 5w30 counterparts:

Example 1: Mobil 1 10w30 has a higher flash point than Mobil 1 5w30 (471.2 to 435.2) and a higher HT/HS rate (3.17 to 3.08). Both have identical pour points (minus 45 degrees)

Example 2: Syntec 10w30 compared to 5w30, also has a similar trend (flash points of 450 to 435 and HT/HS of 3.1 to 2.92). Similar pour points of minus 36 to minus 39 degrees.

Both of these oils, regardless of viscosity, meet the GM 6094M standard, which I understand is low temp pumpability.

Conversely, some oils seem much closer, such as 5w30 Redline to it's 10w30 counterpart. Kendall GT-1 synthetic is also very close between these viscosities (flash points of 455 to 446, and HT/HS of 3.2 to 3.1). Pour points are identical (minus 39 degrees).

The above info taken from published specs/company web sites. I have some published cold cranking viscosities for Castrol and Kendall but not Mobil 1. However, these figures are for minus 25 (10w) and minus 30 (5w) degrees.

So if the ambient temp is way above that (like in Calif.) does the 10w30 win out because of what appears to be better wear protection (for some oils)

So, this is why I think some people still want to run 10w30. I dunno, I am still confused...

Bob W.

 

[harrydog]

I'm not so sure that Redline 5w30 contains no VII. Can anyone verify that? If it doesn't, then I agree that there is no compelling reason to use 10w30.