Just give you a little background:
I've owned a 2002 4cyl Auto accord since new in in May '02, and started to Autocross it on a monthly/bi-weekly basis when it had roughly 7k miles on the odometer. At around 10k miles, I installed an auxiliary plate+fin ATF cooler in line with the factory radiator-based cooler. At the same time, I did 3 ATF-Z1 drain+refills over a 100 mile span, and have performed one drain+refill every 10k miles until now.
I have only used Honda ATF-Z1 until now, the car has 45k miles, and have not had a single issue with the transmission until recently. Autocross (for this car), consists of a launch with the transmission locked in '1', and shift into the '2' locked position, and that's it. Clearly, my transmission has held up fairly well, and has not "worn" out as a direct result of Auto-X. In fact, my 1-2 upshifts and downshifts occur smoothly, without any slip/flare at all (like new).
Now, here's where it gets complicated. For a 2 month period, my dad and I swapped cars. My dad only drove my car for 1k miles, and as far as I can tell, didn't do anything weird/special to the Accord. When I got it back, I didn't notice anything weird/wrong, perhaps I wasn't looking closely enough. When the first cold front came through (about a month ago), I noticed that the transmission did not shift the way it used to shift. On some random occasions I'd notice slipping, but I cannot remember between which gears the slip occured. I assumed that the auxiliary transmission cooler could be overcooling the fluid, and the fluid may have broken down earlier than normal. The ATF on the dipstick did not smell funny, but it looked "watered" down and thinner than usual.
As soon as I had the chance, I did one drain+refill of Honda ATF-Z1 and purchased a transmission temp gauge.
Yeah, it's about to get more complicated, timing is a #@$%!
I attended my first ever open track event, shortly after doing the above-mentioned ATF-Z1 drain+refill. I did a good amount of maintenance to prep for this event (oil/filter change, flush brakes for higher boiling point fluid, regrease/inspect front/rear brakes, change the ATF, etc.).
Unfortunately, I ran out of time and was only able to install the temp sending unit, along with the appropriate brass fittings in the outgoing cooler line (directly out the trans; no suitable locations on the transmission case to install the sending unit).
Unlike Auto-X, the open track event consisted of 42 laps around a 2.8 mile course at much higher speeds, broken down into 20 minutes sessions spread over the entire day. On the the long straight part of the course, I was doing a max of 100-105 mph.
I noticed that coming off the course, pulling into the pits, the transmission would take slightly longer than normal to shift in/out of D4/N, which I've noticed in the past when I've autocrossed in 100* weather (Texas). No big deal, I assumed it would be normal to get a little hot.
During my last two sessions, for which I made the mistake of running back-to-back, the transmission had serious trouble upshifting down the pit lane (slipping in excess of 1-2k RPMs). As soon as I got back up to speed, the transmission presumeably cooled off, and went back to normal.
After the weekend was over, I drove home to Houston, and noticed the transmission was back to it's unusual behavior from when the cold front first hit. I noticed that there was a very small amount of slip/flair on the 2-3 upshift/downshift, while the 1-2 and 3-4 upshift/downshifts were OK.
A couple of days ago, I drained the transmission and did not find a noticeable amount of metal shavings on the drain plug. I relocated the cooler so that it gets a siginifcantly higher amount of air flow, as it was blocked by a large portion of the front bumper. At the same time, I decided it would be a good idea to run a mix of Honda ATF-Z1, and a higher quality synthetic ATF. I settled on Mobil1 ATF given it's local availability, and the fact that would run it with the Z1 to make the transmission function properly.
Since the transmission holds 6.4 quarts, and a drain+refill is 2.6 quarts, I added ~2.6 quarts of Mobil 1 ATF to obtain a 40/60 ratio. I noticed absolutely no change in shift quality at all. I then drove 50 miles, noticed a slight improvement in shift quality, and drained the ATF again. This time I removed various solenoids, and the 3rd clutch pressure switch from the transmission, and cleaned them. THey were fairly clean, but I noticed that the mesh screen on the A/B pressure switch were a tad dirty. I reinstalled the solenoids, and refilled with 1qt+8oz of Mobil1 ATF, and the rest with Z1, to refresh the Z1 that was still in there. This made for a 45/55 ratio of M1 and Z1, or 2.9 total quarts of M1, and ~3.5 quarts of Z1.
I noticed a good improvement in shift quality, and noticed that it got better over the 10 mile trip. I have not driven the car again (yet), but am convinced that the shift quality will continue to improve. As of now my 1-2 and 3-4 up/down shifts are perfect, while the 2-3 shift still has a small amount of flare/slip left.
Looking around here, I found that adding 2-3 oz of Lubegard may help, especially since the M1 ATF does not have the FMs required by my transmission.
Should I run out to the store and try the Lubegard, or wait until I've driven 200+ miles and see if it continues to get better?
Depending one whether or not I run the Lubegard, and if the shift quality continues to improve, I am considering switching changing my maintenance routine so that the AT contains 60% M1 ATF, 40% Z1 ATF, along with the appropriate amount of Lubegard black to match the amount of M1 ATF in the transmission.
I'm awaiting for more advice on the matter before I decide to start running Lubegard, and/or change the ratio of M1/Z1 in my transmission. Currently, I still plan on attending another track event, with the transmission temp gauge installed, along with the newly relocated cooler. Hopefully the transmisson gauge should tell me when I am dumping the most heat into the fluid (at idle or at speed?).
So, Lubegard Black? Yes or no?
I've owned a 2002 4cyl Auto accord since new in in May '02, and started to Autocross it on a monthly/bi-weekly basis when it had roughly 7k miles on the odometer. At around 10k miles, I installed an auxiliary plate+fin ATF cooler in line with the factory radiator-based cooler. At the same time, I did 3 ATF-Z1 drain+refills over a 100 mile span, and have performed one drain+refill every 10k miles until now.
I have only used Honda ATF-Z1 until now, the car has 45k miles, and have not had a single issue with the transmission until recently. Autocross (for this car), consists of a launch with the transmission locked in '1', and shift into the '2' locked position, and that's it. Clearly, my transmission has held up fairly well, and has not "worn" out as a direct result of Auto-X. In fact, my 1-2 upshifts and downshifts occur smoothly, without any slip/flare at all (like new).
Now, here's where it gets complicated. For a 2 month period, my dad and I swapped cars. My dad only drove my car for 1k miles, and as far as I can tell, didn't do anything weird/special to the Accord. When I got it back, I didn't notice anything weird/wrong, perhaps I wasn't looking closely enough. When the first cold front came through (about a month ago), I noticed that the transmission did not shift the way it used to shift. On some random occasions I'd notice slipping, but I cannot remember between which gears the slip occured. I assumed that the auxiliary transmission cooler could be overcooling the fluid, and the fluid may have broken down earlier than normal. The ATF on the dipstick did not smell funny, but it looked "watered" down and thinner than usual.
As soon as I had the chance, I did one drain+refill of Honda ATF-Z1 and purchased a transmission temp gauge.
Yeah, it's about to get more complicated, timing is a #@$%!
I attended my first ever open track event, shortly after doing the above-mentioned ATF-Z1 drain+refill. I did a good amount of maintenance to prep for this event (oil/filter change, flush brakes for higher boiling point fluid, regrease/inspect front/rear brakes, change the ATF, etc.).
Unfortunately, I ran out of time and was only able to install the temp sending unit, along with the appropriate brass fittings in the outgoing cooler line (directly out the trans; no suitable locations on the transmission case to install the sending unit).
Unlike Auto-X, the open track event consisted of 42 laps around a 2.8 mile course at much higher speeds, broken down into 20 minutes sessions spread over the entire day. On the the long straight part of the course, I was doing a max of 100-105 mph.
I noticed that coming off the course, pulling into the pits, the transmission would take slightly longer than normal to shift in/out of D4/N, which I've noticed in the past when I've autocrossed in 100* weather (Texas). No big deal, I assumed it would be normal to get a little hot.
During my last two sessions, for which I made the mistake of running back-to-back, the transmission had serious trouble upshifting down the pit lane (slipping in excess of 1-2k RPMs). As soon as I got back up to speed, the transmission presumeably cooled off, and went back to normal.
After the weekend was over, I drove home to Houston, and noticed the transmission was back to it's unusual behavior from when the cold front first hit. I noticed that there was a very small amount of slip/flair on the 2-3 upshift/downshift, while the 1-2 and 3-4 upshift/downshifts were OK.
A couple of days ago, I drained the transmission and did not find a noticeable amount of metal shavings on the drain plug. I relocated the cooler so that it gets a siginifcantly higher amount of air flow, as it was blocked by a large portion of the front bumper. At the same time, I decided it would be a good idea to run a mix of Honda ATF-Z1, and a higher quality synthetic ATF. I settled on Mobil1 ATF given it's local availability, and the fact that would run it with the Z1 to make the transmission function properly.
Since the transmission holds 6.4 quarts, and a drain+refill is 2.6 quarts, I added ~2.6 quarts of Mobil 1 ATF to obtain a 40/60 ratio. I noticed absolutely no change in shift quality at all. I then drove 50 miles, noticed a slight improvement in shift quality, and drained the ATF again. This time I removed various solenoids, and the 3rd clutch pressure switch from the transmission, and cleaned them. THey were fairly clean, but I noticed that the mesh screen on the A/B pressure switch were a tad dirty. I reinstalled the solenoids, and refilled with 1qt+8oz of Mobil1 ATF, and the rest with Z1, to refresh the Z1 that was still in there. This made for a 45/55 ratio of M1 and Z1, or 2.9 total quarts of M1, and ~3.5 quarts of Z1.
I noticed a good improvement in shift quality, and noticed that it got better over the 10 mile trip. I have not driven the car again (yet), but am convinced that the shift quality will continue to improve. As of now my 1-2 and 3-4 up/down shifts are perfect, while the 2-3 shift still has a small amount of flare/slip left.
Looking around here, I found that adding 2-3 oz of Lubegard may help, especially since the M1 ATF does not have the FMs required by my transmission.
Should I run out to the store and try the Lubegard, or wait until I've driven 200+ miles and see if it continues to get better?
Depending one whether or not I run the Lubegard, and if the shift quality continues to improve, I am considering switching changing my maintenance routine so that the AT contains 60% M1 ATF, 40% Z1 ATF, along with the appropriate amount of Lubegard black to match the amount of M1 ATF in the transmission.
I'm awaiting for more advice on the matter before I decide to start running Lubegard, and/or change the ratio of M1/Z1 in my transmission. Currently, I still plan on attending another track event, with the transmission temp gauge installed, along with the newly relocated cooler. Hopefully the transmisson gauge should tell me when I am dumping the most heat into the fluid (at idle or at speed?).
So, Lubegard Black? Yes or no?
