Question on Castrol

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digitalgpbandit

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Hello, I am a new member here although I have been browsing around here for some time now. To give a little background I have a '95 Pontiac Grand Am which just rolled 283,000 miles, a modded '99 Pontiac Grand Prix and my wife an '08 Ford Fusion.

The car in question is my '99 Grand Prix since I have been using synthetic oil in there for the majority of the time I have owned it. I have used mainly Mobil 1, but Mazda uses Castrol oils which I can get slightly cheaper at my employee cost then Mobil 1 (not to start a Mobil vs Castrol debate). For synthetic we get supplied with Castrol Edge Professional O.E. rather then the Edge w/syntec you see on the store shelves. Is there any difference between those two oils or is it just the same thing with different marketing? I sent Castrol an email asking & never heard anything back
 
If the question is: "can I use Castrol in my cars that have been using Mobil 1"?

Then the answer is: sure you can. No worries.

As far as the technical differences between professional O.E and Edge? Not sure it even matters for your fleet...even on the modded GP...

http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/4ABA633F17A143FD80257AA90053665B/$File/EDGE%20Professional%20European%20PDS_July_2012.pdf

They meet all the specs that you might require.
 
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It looks like Castrol 5w-30 OE has a HTHS > 3.5 cP which would make it a significantly thicker oil than 5w-30 Syntec.

No it is not the same oil. Furthermore, I do not believe it would be a good fit for your car.

welcome2.gif
to the forum BTW.
 
Originally Posted By: Gabe
It looks like Castrol 5w-30 OE has a HTHS > 3.5 cP which would make it a significantly thicker oil than 5w-30 Syntec.

No it is not the same oil. Furthermore, I do not believe it would be a good fit for your car.



?? Why not?

His GP likely spec'd an SL 5W30 - the OE clearly exceeds that spec...and while the HTHS is high, the viscosity at 100C, at 12.1, which is on the high side of the normal range for a 30 WT...kind of like GC...his GP won't care...the '95 GA probably needs something a bit on the heavier side with that many miles...and the Focus? That 5W20 OE is looking good for that application.

His point was that he can get this oil at work (i.e. cheaper)...and cheaper is always good...why spend more on Mobil 1 when he can get this?
 
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Originally Posted By: Astro14
Originally Posted By: Gabe
It looks like Castrol 5w-30 OE has a HTHS > 3.5 cP which would make it a significantly thicker oil than 5w-30 Syntec.

No it is not the same oil. Furthermore, I do not believe it would be a good fit for your car.



?? Why not?

His GP likely spec'd an SL 5W30 - the OE clearly exceeds that spec...and while the HTHS is high, the viscosity at 100C, at 12.1, which is on the high side of the normal range for a 30 WT...kind of like GC...his GP won't care...the '95 GA probably needs something a bit on the heavier side with that many miles...and the Focus? That 5W20 OE is looking good for that application.

His point was that he can get this oil at work (i.e. cheaper)...and cheaper is always good...why spend more on Mobil 1 when he can get this?


The OP asked solely about his '99 Grand Prix.

While Castrol 5w-30 OE meets his cars factory spec, API isn't a particularly tough spec. If price was his main criteria, we could find a lot cheaper API oil.

Compared to M1 HM, Castrol OE has a lower VI, less ZDDP, higher HTHS, and worse TBN retention (based on the ACEA C3 spec). Castrol's only advantage in this application is being 'slightly cheaper.'
 
The only reason Mazda uses Castrol is because Castrol gave them the most money. It's as easy as that.
 
Thank you for your replies guys.

Quote:
It looks like Castrol 5w-30 OE has a HTHS > 3.5 cP which would make it a significantly thicker oil than 5w-30 Syntec.

No it is not the same oil. Furthermore, I do not believe it would be a good fit for your car.


I am assuming when you say the Edge OE is slighly thicker its at operating tempurature. Would it harm anything or is it just not that big of a difference to cause any issues? The thing I am more worried about is that according to Castrol's site the OE has a uv dye in it to help diagnose leaks. Would running oil with that dye for a full interval cause issues?

My Grand Prix actually calls for 10w30 oil, but my understanding I can use 5w30 as well.
 
Originally Posted By: digitalgpbandit
I am assuming when you say the Edge OE is slighly thicker its at operating tempurature. Would it harm anything or is it just not that big of a difference to cause any issues? The thing I am more worried about is that according to Castrol's site the OE has a uv dye in it to help diagnose leaks. Would running oil with that dye for a full interval cause issues?

My Grand Prix actually calls for 10w30 oil, but my understanding I can use 5w30 as well.


The oil`s weight nor the dye will hurt a thing. Most oils have some kind`ve dye in them. The weight won`t harm either. I used GTX 20W50 in my Olds 3800 which had near 300,000 miles on it when I sold it. Ran like brand new,and didn`t use or burn a single drop. Only reason I sold it was to buy a 3000GT.
 
10w-30 is essentially outdated for automobiles; 5w-30 is the preferred grade.

Castrol 5w-30 OE is designed especially to work with after-treatment emission systems. Part of that requirement (ACEA C3) requires reduced sulfur and phosphate - exactly what I wouldn't want in a Grand Prix that is driven hard. Using Castrol 5w-30 OE, you will experience reduced fuel economy, shorter oil change intervals, and increased wear than if you were using Syntec or M1. But, no, you will not experience a lubrication related failure for the life of your car with either motor oil.
 
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Most oils have some kind`ve dye in them.


Synthetic oil bases are actually crystal clear. The color comes from the additive packages.

Purple RP and green Schaeffer Oil contain dye, but, as far as I know, the UV dye is unique to Castrol.
 
Finally heard back from Castrol. This is what they sent me

Quote:

Thank you for contacting Castrol North America.

Castrol EDGE with SYNTEC Power Technology and Castrol EDGE with Titanium Fluid Strength Technology and Castrol EDGE Professional OE are completely different formulations.

Castrol EDGE with Syntec Power Technology (SPT) and EDGE with Titanium Fluid Strength Technology (FST) are different formulas that contain a different mix of additives. Castrol EDGE with SPT replaces Castrol SYNTEC and maintains maximum horsepower 30% longer than Castrol SYNTEC (5W-30's tested, based on average performances in extreme power tests versus prior Castrol SYNTEC). Castrol EDGE with Titanium FST replaces Castrol EDGE and now contains Castrol's proprietary Titanium molecule that offers added strength to deliver superior performance against deposits, wear, and oxidation making it our most advanced motor oil.

EDGE Professional OE is formulated for VW vehicles, is a fully synthetic engine oil and meets the following specs:

* 505 01, 502 00, 505 00
* API SL/CF
* ACEA A3/B4, C3
* MB 229.51
The 505.01 engine oil is specifically formulated to ensure protection of the cam lobes that drive the unit injectors. High loading requires the proper level of anti-wear protection. In turn VW needs to ensure that 505.01 is utilized for this engine design. The cam shafts are mechanically driven and assist in the buildup of fuel pressure in each injector.
EDGE Professional is a branded product only available in North America through VW Dealerships.

Castrol always recommends following the guidelines of the original engine manufacturer for the recommended grade and API specific to your application. This information can be found in the vehicles owner's manual or by contacting the manufacturer directly.

Thank you again for contacting Castrol, we value your patronage.

Castrol Consumer Relations
 
Originally Posted By: Gabe


The OP asked solely about his '99 Grand Prix.

While Castrol 5w-30 OE meets his cars factory spec, API isn't a particularly tough spec. If price was his main criteria, we could find a lot cheaper API oil.

Compared to M1 HM, Castrol OE has a lower VI, less ZDDP, higher HTHS, and worse TBN retention (based on the ACEA C3 spec). Castrol's only advantage in this application is being 'slightly cheaper.'


http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Oils/Mobil_1_High_Mileage_5W-30.aspx#

http://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/4ABA633F17A143FD80257AA90053665B/$File/EDGE%20Professional%20European%20PDS_July_2012.pdf

In these spec sheets, the VI is almost identical. Actually the Castrol is a bit higher. I don't see how a higher HTHS is a disadvantage, especially in a modded engine. Having a higher base number doesn't help you much if you shear out of grade before you can use up the base. But again these are probably splitting hairs looking at the specs. Castrol has a lower pour point. M1 HM 5w-30 might have a higher flash point. I don't think you will take a noticable hit on mileage between the two oils.

The castrol OE 5w30 is rated SM/SL which is more than fine for the 99 GP. I think I'd run the Castrol.
 
Originally Posted By: 05LGTLtd
In these spec sheets, the VI is almost identical. Actually the Castrol is a bit higher. I don't see how a higher HTHS is a disadvantage, especially in a modded engine. Having a higher base number doesn't help you much if you shear out of grade before you can use up the base. But again these are probably splitting hairs looking at the specs. Castrol has a lower pour point. M1 HM 5w-30 might have a higher flash point. I don't think you will take a noticable hit on mileage between the two oils.

The castrol OE 5w30 is rated SM/SL which is more than fine for the 99 GP. I think I'd run the Castrol.


Looking at the reply from Castrol, the API SM specification might be a typo on the OE's PDS. If it is a typo, that would definitively level the playing field for ZDDP and wear which is a concern for modified cars.

HERE and HERE are a couple UOAs from a competitor oil. The TBN of these C3 European oils does not hold up against North American gasoline. This alone should disqualify the oil from consideration.

Both M1 HM and Castrol OE meet ACEA shear resistance (A5/B5 and A3/B4), so I wouldn't consider either likely to shear. Castrol states the HTHS as > 3.5 cP which I feel crosses a line in the sand. If it was a dedicated race car, I would be more inclined to suggest a higher HTHS. But, I admit that 3.5 cP - which it probably is - is not unreasonable.

Castrol OE is an extremely impressive oil, but it doesn't fit here.

I agree with us splitting hairs; it is what we do here.
cool.gif
 
Did the OP state what their preferred OCI is with previous M1 use?
 
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That's what I come here for....the hairsplitting lol. The Grand Prix I usually change the oil every 5-6,000 miles even with the synthetic depending on the season and the color of it. The car is garaged during the winter and with that I don't really trust the 7500+ intervals even with the pureone filters. The other two cars on the dino oil I do every 3k.

So from what I gather is that if I use Castrol I am better off with the "shelf" edge over the Professional OE stuff I would get through my job.
 
How much is the Castrol OE saving you in money and time over the M1?

For a 5-6k OCI I think your fine with the castrol OE. The problem as I understand is trying to get a longer spec'd oci like 10-15k out of a oil like this. If going to 7500 on the M1 you were running splits the difference in price over time then that would be an option. Personally I'm not a huge fan of M1 Xw-30, but if it works for you it's hard to beat @ $5/qt wally price. GC 0w-30 is ~$4.50/qt when on bogo at Advance around here, and with the 5qt + filter @$29.99 comes out to ~$5/qt and a $5 filter. PennzPlaty 5/10w-30 is ~$14 for 5qt right now with the wally rebate. Plenty of good choices out there. Rotella T5 10w-30 is blend, but I'll mention it too...
 
Originally Posted By: digitalgpbandit
That's what I come here for....the hairsplitting lol. The Grand Prix I usually change the oil every 5-6,000 miles even with the synthetic depending on the season and the color of it. The car is garaged during the winter and with that I don't really trust the 7500+ intervals even with the pureone filters. The other two cars on the dino oil I do every 3k.

So from what I gather is that if I use Castrol I am better off with the "shelf" edge over the Professional OE stuff I would get through my job.


I think you're better off using what you can get cheaply/readily....

oil is important, but not the most important thing in your life...
 
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