Question about moly in Schaeffer oil...

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I'm certain that he had a clean engine after the Auto-Rx clean, and the oil was able to do it's job, and that is to prevent wear, and the oil darn sure did that part of it. So in my opinion, this was a winning combination for this engine.
 
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If it was such a good combination why was it recommended to take the next run to 9k w/o the RX ?Like Bob ,said the RX did not hurt but the oil certainly was doing something there in terms of protection [Smile] I imagine it should have cleaned the motor "rx claims it to be a metal cleaner" but the oil has once again through analysis performed what it is supposed to and that is protect the motor and is a cost effecient way to go about it and yes, a clean motor is a more efficient motor no doubt vetteman, You seem to not think this oil will not do as well in a lower mile or higher mile car with a motor not in need of a cleaning ? My thoughts are it will in a good motor with out the excessive Oxidation [ November 19, 2002, 01:41 PM: Message edited by: dragboat ]
 

MolaKule

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XHVI, ZDDP and MoTDC react similarly. When I mention temperatures (in this context), I am referring to surface (metal-to-metal) temperatures, not the bulk oil temperatures. ZDDP and MoTDC go into the oil solution and form organosulfur (carbon -sulfur) compounds. At about 450 F, the zinc polyphosphates form a fluid glass; it is this glass that lubricates the surfaces. At 500-800 F, the moly polycarbamates form a glass-like layer that lubricates the surfaces. The dithiocarbamates of moly are often referred to as Anti-Wear additives, but also present Extreme Pressure properties as well. The higher the loads (and after the hydrodynamic layer breaks down), the greater the mixed or boundary lubrication conditions that exist, and the greater the coaing effect. [ November 20, 2002, 08:14 PM: Message edited by: MolaKule ]
 

Bio-T

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quote:
Originally posted by 59 Vetteman: and the oil was able to do it's job, and that is to prevent wear, and the oil darn sure did that part of it.
I thought I had stated that the oil did a darn good job, and sure enough I was correct. Dragboat, Could you post your oil analysis of your personal use of Schaeffer's oil. I am curious how it is working in your vehicles. Or are you happy with the Phillip's, Mobil syn ect.?
 

MolaKule

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XHVI, Many oils contain both moly and ZDDP. Schaeffer's adds one more level of AW/EP protection with SbTDC or Antimony Dithiocarbamates. My opinion is that since Schaeffer's does not use polyol esters, they substitute the FM properties of esters for the FM AND AW/EP properties of Moly and Antimony.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by 59 Vetteman:
quote:
Originally posted by 59 Vetteman: and the oil was able to do it's job, and that is to prevent wear, and the oil darn sure did that part of it.
I thought I had stated that the oil did a darn good job, and sure enough I was correct. Dragboat, Could you post your oil analysis of your personal use of Schaeffer's oil. I am curious how it is working in your vehicles. Or are you happy with the Phillip's, Mobil syn ect.?

I am very happy with the Phillips oil I use in three cars,the Mobil Supersyn in another and just cannot wait until the miles acumulate on two more with the Schaeffers 10/30 blend in them. But to pull it at 5k? I am not going to have the Schaeffers anaylized from either car till miles warrant a drain and it ain't time yet but they will be posted along with the Phillips and Mobil you can count on that. [Wink] And only then will it be to show how well the oil performs to others because I have no doubt it is a great oil or it would not be in those two motors and wanna know why I have no doubt? Analysis I have seen proves it a good oil [Wink] Not all these analysis are on this site and I am not certain Bob would like for me to post how to see these on a individual basis so for now we will wait as the individual tests come in to see the merits of this oil posted here
 
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"SbTDC or Antimony Dithiocarbamates." Is this the "penetro" additive? If not, what should we call it ... "Anty?" [Wink] I have Schaeffer 7000 10W30 in my Civic right now. Gonna drain it the first week in December and send a sample away to be tested. --- Bror Jace
 

MolaKule

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In addition to moly being a great FM, AW/EP, and anti-oxidant additives, there are two side benefits to moly additives. When Magnesium sulphonate (detergent) and moly (MoTDC) are placed together in a formulation, these chemicals reduce phosphorous poisoning of the catalytic convertor. Secondly, Engine NOX emission is reduced by the addition of MoTDC. As early as 1983, it was reported that, "One advantage of moly dithiocarbamates is that, unlike moly dithiophosphates and zinc dithiophosphates, they do not poison automobile exhaust catalysts."
 

MolaKule

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Is this the "penetro" additive? If not, what should we call it ... "Anty?" Bror, I like that term Anty! [LOL!] Their "penetro" is the combination of Anty with a surfactant - a wetting agent.
 
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Dragboat, I recommended Stuart take the next oil change out to 9000 w/o RX to establish the difference in wear values w/o AUTO-RX. The 2 to 3 oz load of RX "seems" to contribute to very low wear value in used oil analysis, and seems to work very well with the Schaeffers oil formulations. I am currently testing this theory with Chevron Supreme 10w-30 also. When we ( Dyson Analysis)tested the product we only looked at the cleaning mode, not the lower maintenance dose. Stuart did not want to change winning Combo and is still using RX at the lower dosage I believe. Maybe he'll pipe in here to clarify.
 
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I noticed from the MSDS that Schaeffer's 7000 series contains both zinc and moly. The zinc based EP additives in oil only come into play when the oil film completely breaks down, thereby preventing actual metal-to-metal contact. Does the moly work the same way? Does it only "plate" the metal surfaces when the oil film (from extreme pressure) breaks down? Or does the moly get in there and plate up everything from the get go? [ November 19, 2002, 12:03 PM: Message edited by: XHVI ]
 
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That has got to be one of the best formulated oils on the planet with no big claims of extended intervals. Bob can tell you more how the moly works with ZDDP but here is how the 3.00 buck a quart works in a motor,,kinda self explanatory. The stuff a data sheet cannot tell you is below and that is the end result,protecting a motor EDIT: Funny how a analysis gets posted with reasonably good results with another oil and there are 30+ replies,,this one only recieved 5- Now how can this oil be overlooked so easily,,,ahhh not on TV or in the Magazines? Would it draw more attention if it were a 8 buck a quart oil instead of a 3 buck a quart oil ? Dunno but again,the oil speeks for itself through analysis [Smile] http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=000197 A 6k run of 10/30 Schaeffers blend on a 120k motor Copper 1 Iron 0 (Yes, 0) Chromium 0 Lead 1 Aluminum 1 Silicon 6 (LOW!) Tin 3 *Additives* Molybdenum 84 Sodium 0 Magnesium 13 Zinc 857 Potassium 0 Phosphorus 724 Calcium 1600 *Physical Properties* Water, Fuel, & Antifreeze all 0 Soot 0 Oxidation 123 (61.5%, elevated by Auto-Rx, cleaning) Nitration 54 (27%) Sulfur 64 TBN 8 (starts at 8.5 or so) [email protected] C: 10.5 (30W) Final comments: (The lowest wear values overall I have seen on a Chrysler 4-cyl. Next oil change try just running Schaeffers and take it to 9,000 miles. This is one clean engine!) [ November 19, 2002, 12:19 PM: Message edited by: dragboat ]
 
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quote:
Originally posted by dragboat: That has got to be one of the best formulated oils on the planet with no big claims of extended intervals.
Well, any oil that is MB 229.3 approved (as Schaeffer's Supreme is) doesn't need to make "big claims" about extended drains--being on this list is "big" enough.
 

Bio-T

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Final comments: (The lowest wear values overall I have seen on a Chrysler 4-cyl. Next oil change try just running Schaeffers and take it to 9,000 miles. This is one clean engine!)[/QB][/QUOTE] The Auto-Rx clean prior to this oil change and the 2 oz Auto-Rx maintenance dose in this oil run sure made one clean engine for this oil to do it's job. Working hand in hand with each other, this seems like a winning combination.
 
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