Purolater Pure one...

[daman]

Originally Posted By: river_rat
Originally Posted By: daman
does anyone have one(yellow) cut open compared to the old blue style? are they the same,media??

Dan, I have an new, old style blue one in the box (don't have the car it fits anymore.) I can buy a new one of the same type and cut and post pics. Give me a day or two and I will do that if you like.

If you like sure,could paypal ya a few bucks to help??

my craftsman is do for a service here soon and i was using that filter but now that they changed to the new yellow i want to know if it is as good,like to see one opend if anyone did.

thanks Rob!!

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: tomcat
I just had my oil changed on my 03 Honda CRV at my local Honda dealer and I brought with me a PureOne PL14610 for them to install. I refuse to have the FRAM made Honda filter on my vehicle. The guy at the service counter asked me the reason for using the PureOne and told him the truth that it was better made in the USA with metal end caps than their Canadian made filter with cardboard endcaps.

Yea and he probably looked at your like, huh,what????

 

[river_rat]

Originally Posted By: daman
..could paypal ya a few bucks to help?

Thank but no I got it. I got plenty of good free info from you snd the board. Happy to help.
I just brought in the old style one from the garage. The box is even way different and says 98% efficient. The new ones say 99.9% or something.
I'll pick up the same part number new style tomorrow. This will be kind of fun for me.

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: river_rat
Originally Posted By: daman
..could paypal ya a few bucks to help?

Thank but no I got it. I got plenty of good free info from you snd the board. Happy to help.
I just brought in the old style one from the garage. The box is even way different and says 98% efficient. The new ones say 99.9% or something.
I'll pick up the same part number new style tomorrow. This will be kind of fun for me.

cool i owe ya one,lots of pics!!

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: H2GURU
All this talk about flow rate and the PURE-ONE? Perhaps Gary can explain, but to me, if you've got a good filter with an exceptional media working for you... wouldn't you expect a lower flow rate due to restriction as it cleans?


Well, yes and no. With few exceptions a filter is invisible. Now as it loads ..it will simulate a smaller filter and WILL reach its capacity to pass oil sooner than it does brand new. This too is typically minor and is dependent upon visc and volume (pretty much interchangeable).

So, for example, if you would be at the limits of flow @ 9gpm ..you may reach it at 7.

Not an issue if you're only pushing 5gpm @ 5000 rpm.

Now on the other end of it ..at startup ...(we're speaking generically here - Soupy will come in with his hot oil treatments and only show you exceptions) there's no loss of flow to the engine unless the pump is in relief. You MAY reach the PSID of the bypass until the engine envelopes and provides something besides ZERO back pressure ..beyond that, if the engine can't fit the total flow it sees ..and backs up pressure to the pump, you may also see bypass levels of PSID depending on how much flow the engine can't process.

In this sceario (relief) you're ultimately governed by the bypass valve on what the filter can present in terms of pressure drop. It's a relatively narrow range from one filter to the next.

It's not worth sweating over for 99% of the rolling population in 99% of the rolling fleet.

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
... there's no loss of flow to the engine unless the pump is in relief.


Actually, there is no loss of flow volume to the engine even with the pump in relief. All that is happening when in pressure relief is that no increased pressure is put on the filter/engine flow path ... so therefore, the MAX flow volume will occur at pump pressure relief point. All excess pump volume is simply shunted back to the sump via the relief valve.

You can not make any more volume go down the filter/engine circuit than when at pressure relief point. Pressure is what PUSHES the oil through the filter/engine ... nothing else. The higher the pressure, the higher the flow volume. Supply pressure is MAX at the pump's pressure relief setting.

 

[Gary Allan]

You can't give up.

If you're in relief ..you're at reduced flow. There's no spin on that, Soupy.

Don't hijack this thread for one of your spinner trips.

 

[PurplDodge]

I'm lovin the new total-grip Pumice on the putsie of the filter. Plus grainy yellow beats the [censored] out of Radioactive orange!

 

[river_rat]

Originally Posted By: daman
cool i owe ya one,lots of pics!!

Here ya go then bro,


Here's the unused old one for a 2000 Blazer 4WD. I bought this filter about four years ago:

The old center tube:

I cross checked to make sure the numbers haven't changed and got the same new style filter for the same application:

The new center tubes are the same:

The media (new on left does look a little different.
On both filters the pleat depth was 0.4" and there wer 60 pleats on both filters:

Here's the good news. Not only is the new filter rated at higher efficiency (on the box) as the old version, but it passed oil twice as fast in my "dunk test."
I sank both of these elements (dry) to the bottom of my clean oil pan and the new version (right) filled with oil just about twice as fast:

 

[daman]

Wow good job Rob you the man!!

, nice pics and good thinking on the dunk test

, i guess i'm sold looks good i'll be changing oil in the 18.5 hp this weekend.

Thank you!!!!!

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
You can't give up.

If you're in relief ..you're at reduced flow. There's no spin on that, Soupy.

Don't hijack this thread for one of your spinner trips.



This is where you keep missing the train. I can't give up when you are always talking about incorrect information and facts. Take it to the other thread, or start a new thread if you want to see your erroneous thinking.

The filter/engine circuit will ONLY FLOW what the pressure makes it flow. If the pump is in relief at say 100 psi and never goes any higher in supply pressure, then that is the MAX FLOW possible through the system at that point in time with whatever the viscoity is at that point in time.

All the excess pump volume is shunted to the sump (oil pan). The flow volume (for a given viscosity) going through the filter/engine is always MAX at pump relief pressure ... always.

Explain to me how the flow is reduced to the filter/engine circuit when you are at max supply pressure - YOU CAN'T. You're living in a dream world man!

No wonder you're all screwed up on this stuff.

Certainly someone besides myself can see this ... chime in sometime.

 

[river_rat]

Originally Posted By: daman
Wow good job Rob you the man!!

, nice pics and good thinking on the dunk test

, i guess i'm sold looks good i'll be changing oil in the 18.5 hp this weekend.

Thank you!!!!!

They seem to be an excellent--and improved filter. Especially for the money. Cheaper than a Fram ToughGuard and I like Purolator pruducts much better.
I will kepp up the comparisons as time permits.
Any others you want my to cut and dunk? I love this stuff!

 

[river_rat]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Certainly someone besides myself can see this ... chime in sometime.
I agree that max flow occurs when the relief valve truncates the pressure curve. And since the regulator is a simple design, and since the viscosity varies, that pressure point varies somewhat. But I don't know what you guys are talking about for sure because I was in a side conversation, so that's all I can agree on right now.
Both you guys are really smart and knowlegable so I don't know any more than that.

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: river_rat
Originally Posted By: daman
Wow good job Rob you the man!!

, nice pics and good thinking on the dunk test

, i guess i'm sold looks good i'll be changing oil in the 18.5 hp this weekend.

Thank you!!!!!

They seem to be an excellent--and improved filter. Especially for the money. Cheaper than a Fram ToughGuard and I like Purolator pruducts much better.
I will kepp up the comparisons as time permits.
Any others you want my to cut and dunk? I love this stuff!

yea i love a good cut job too, why anyone would wana run a FRAM-O-Death or ST over one of these it just nuts,and priced right too.

thanks again!!!

 

[Gary Allan]

Quote:
All the excess pump volume is shunted to the sump (oil pan). The flow volume (for a given viscosity) going through the filter/engine is always MAX at pump relief pressure ... always.


Yep ..reshuffle it and reword it into your own image.
Standard Soupy.

So ..1 gpm @ 10CST is equal in flow to .65 gpm @ 100 Cst right.

No flow difference, huh?


Folks. Prepare for the shake and bake

You really don't have the capability to agree unless it's regurgitated as your own. Amazing.

 

[pzev]

He did say for a given viscosity...

All I can say is SuperBusa has made a good deal more sense in the threads you too have been posting in.

 

[Gary Allan]

What you may have failed to observe is that he tends to "take you on a trip". When a pump is in relief, it's not at full flow. He, instead of saying "yes ..this is true" he drags you on a trip that points out the obvious.



This is required for him to author it himself. So, discount the "truth" and present something else to bolster himself on well tread ground.

He has done no testing of his own. He dwells in the theoretical and has no bearings in fact to base his musings. While surely what he says is "disciplined" ..while mine is not, he has no factual experience to orient himself. This is his one lacking. If he had such, he would be tap dancing different tunes. He also loves and lives with "hot oil and high volume" ..which only Fast & Furious types dwell in. In those areas, he's surely got high merit to his assertions. No dispute there.


While you may feel that he makes more sense, these concepts, at least those I try and communicate, aren't as "straight forward" as he believes. They're more complex than he's aware, again, in the confines of my observations of the physical events as they occur. He can't rationalize them, so he alters the arena so that he's always right.

..but..I've never taken a physics course, and, although several learned engineers here have shared my observations, you can take his word for whatever it's worth. While I'm inarticulate on some aspects of communicating my explanation for the physical events as they occur, he has never done the testing himself and cannot speak from experience, regardless of how convincing he can make himself sound.

I really am too lazy ..but I'll suit up again and do the testing that led me to all these smacked arse conclusions.

What you will see is one of two things out of Soupy. He will claim that he had already acknowledged and conceded to everything that I depict in the presentation ..and had in fact more accurately explained it in "the real terms" of what was happening ..or he'll default on his "hot oil and high volume" in an attempt to diminish the value of the data. That's what he's done all along. When he can't win the chess game ..he calls the checkerboard junk.


..but again, if he makes sense to you ...listen to him.

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: river_rat
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Certainly someone besides myself can see this ... chime in sometime.
I agree that max flow occurs when the relief valve truncates the pressure curve. And since the regulator is a simple design, and since the viscosity varies, that pressure point varies somewhat. But I don't know what you guys are talking about for sure because I was in a side conversation, so that's all I can agree on right now.
Both you guys are really smart and knowlegable so I don't know any more than that.


You got it right river_rat.

At any given viscosity, the supply pressure feeding the filter/engine circuit (fixed flow resistor) will determine the flow volume going through that circuit. The more pressure you put on the circuit, the more flow you get ... simple as that. When the pump in is pressure relief, that's the highest supply pressure the system ever sees (talking "ideal" pump/relief valve of course).

I don't why Gary is all twisted up around the axle on some of this stuff

... it's been that way ever since the first time I tried to tell him how it actually works.

Originally Posted By: pzev
He did say for a given viscosity...

All I can say is SuperBusa has made a good deal more sense in the threads you too have been posting in.


Thanks ... it's about time other people chimed in on some of this stuff. If it just remains Gary and me with no other inputs than it might not be clear who's talking more sense.

 

[SuperBusa]

Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Quote:
All the excess pump volume is shunted to the sump (oil pan). The flow volume (for a given viscosity) going through the filter/engine is always MAX at pump relief pressure ... always.


Yep ..reshuffle it and reword it into your own image.
Standard Soupy.

So ..1 gpm @ 10CST is equal in flow to .65 gpm @ 100 Cst right.



Standard Gary ... you aren't reading this stuff correctly. Please read it carefully ... I really don't think I write in a vague manner.

Assume the oil viscosity is CONSTANT - let's say it's 5W-30 Mobil 1 FS at 200 deg F. Assume pump relief is 100 psi, and the relief valve works perfectly and NEVER allows the supply pressure to the filter/engine (aka, pump output pressure) to go over 100 psi.

If the pump is in relief the supply pressure is 100 psi. At 100 psi, the flow rate going through the filter/engine IS THE MAX POSSIBLE WITH THIS OIL VISCOSITY. Let's assume the flow rate is 6 gpm.

Now if the oil was say 100 deg F, and the pump was again in relief at 100 psi, then the flow rate going through the filter/engine IS THE MAX POSSIBLE WITH THIS OIL VISCOSITY. Let's say the flow rate is 3 gpm.

Get the picture? I really can't say it any more clear than that! Wakeup !!

Done hijacking ... anyone interested, go to this thread for continued technical discussions.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1524869#Post1524869

 

[SHAMUS]

GARY ALLAN/SUPERBUSA: You two need to find a state that allows "gay" marriage, move, and get hitched! If you're going to argue like an old married couple - you might as well be!