PP 0W-20 10,065 miles Accord V6 6MT

Messages
20
Location
Georgia, USA
19 months and 10,065 miles of use got me these results. According to average speeds from fillups, fuelly is saying I do 2/3 highway and 1/3 city driving. I usually drive at very low rpm except when accelerating, and I shut the engine off when I am going to be waiting at a stop light for more than 15 seconds. As of lately, probably the last thousand or so miles in this oil change I got an engine block(coolant) heater and have been preheating the car before starting it. Yes, even when it is 85 degrees outside I still use the heater. The engine will idle at 1000 rpm cold, or 700 rpm if preheated, and it runs smoother when preheated as well! At around the 7000 mile mark I had to add a quart of oil, I had an oil pan and drain plug leak that were fixed after this oil change, so I may not have to add any oil this time around. Here is what Blackstone had to say: "We're not sure how the TBN would've read without the added oil. Probably lower, but it's hard to say how much. In terms of metals, only aluminum (pistons or bearings) is a bit elevated. Iron is high, but since it accumulates with use, this level is fine for the mileage. The TBN's good at 2.5, and no contamination was found. Let's see how aluminum looks after 11,500 miles."
Code:
Oil       Penzoil Platinum 0W-20         Universal averages
Miles in use          10,065
Miles                 148,814
Sample taken         6/25/2017
Make up oil added       1 qt

Aluminum                 9                              3
Chromium                 1                              1
Iron                    20                              9
Copper                   1                              9
Lead                     0                              2
Tin                      1                              1
Molybdenum              51                              74
Nickel                   0                              0
Manganese                2                              1
Silver                   0                              0
Titanium                 0                              2
Potassium                1                              2
Boron                    5                              51
Silicon                 13                              11
Sodium                  78                              38
Calcium                2190                            2109
Magnesium                7                              130
Phosphorus              610                             691
Zinc                    693                             815
Barium                   0                              0
                               Values Should be

SUS Viscosity @ 210F    53.0         46-49
cST Viscosity @ 100C    8.17        6.0-10.2
Flashpoint in F         430           >385
Fuel %                 <0.5           <2.0
Antifreeze %            0.0            0.0
Water %                 0.0           <0.1
Insolubles %            0.3           <0.6
TBN                     3.5           >1.0
 
Messages
1,104
Location
PA,US
Originally Posted By: Donald
The block heater is a waste of time. I would do another 10k OCI and not listen to Blackstone who want to push it.
Especially with 0w20 in the south. In winter months maybe, but not in the summer. Some of those block heaters pull a good amount of electricity (might not be much $$ wise I'm not sure).
 

Daschicken

Thread starter
Messages
20
Location
Georgia, USA
I want to push it. My undertray isn't all that fun to remove and put back on... As far as the cost of block heating: The electricity can pay for itself in improved fuel economy with UP TO 3 hours of heater use. After that, the heat introduced and the heat lost to surroundings pretty much equal out. You can rely on a block heater to heat the coolant about 50 degrees F above ambient, but that is about all it will do. I plug in my heater for between 30 minutes to 2 hours and get increased coolant temps between 15 degrees F and 40 degrees F, even in 70+ degree weather.
 
Messages
1,104
Location
PA,US
Is all that undertray factory?? Also, fair enough about your points on electricity and fuel economy, it sounds like you've worked out the numbers.
 

Daschicken

Thread starter
Messages
20
Location
Georgia, USA
Nope, not factory. This is what it would look like from the factory. It is dirty because it used to leak oil, and my hands are usually oily when working on it. Plus that stuff doesn't really want to come out! Here is the rear diffuser, which IS factory on the hybrid models.
 
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Messages
1,104
Location
PA,US
Now I only have more questions... What is the tray for? Did you add it for fuel economy savings on the highway? What is it made of? if it works to a measurable degree its pretty neat. I do remember the filter location on my 08 Civic Si to be horrible, not sure if its the case with your 3.0.
 
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1,993
Location
.
Dunno if these UOA results are abnormal or not, but I'd stop turning off the engine at stoplights and ditch the underbody tray. There's always a bit of extra wear during start-up; factory designed systems crank the engine much faster before introducing fuel, which mitigates the problem. And one unintended consequence of the underbody tray could be higher oil temperature as it seems to inhibit airflow over the oil pan. Perhaps neither issue is a contributor, but just my $.02.
 

MolaKule

Staff member
Messages
21,688
Location
Iowegia - USA
~1 ppm/1k for aluminum and 2 ppm/1k for Iron? No problem. However, the added 1 quart at 7K definately skewed the results somewhat.
 
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Messages
693
Location
Toronto
I would recommend using duct tape on the body panel gaps, to get better fuel economy. grin If you want to push it more, you should use PUP. I wouldn't extend it with PP without seeing the TAN.
 
Messages
1,918
Location
British Columbia, Canada
It's good to hear that someone else drives a Honda Accord 4Dr V6 6MT. They seem to be quite rare. Coincidentally I'm using PP right now too but in my case the 5W-20 version. I change my oil by the OLM. I guess I can stop fussing over the occasional change that goes out to 5% of oil life left. My changes average 8,0000 Km (5,000 miles). I wouldn't bother with the plug in before starting and turning it off at 15 second lights. That's too much busy work for too little gain. The only time I have ever plugged mine in was for a single outdoor -40 start. The seats were actually rock hard that day. I hope you never suffer from the well known "quick start" phenomenon, discovering that you're driving along with an extension cord dragging on the road. In my case I have too many things to think about without unplugging a block heater at every cold start.
 

Daschicken

Thread starter
Messages
20
Location
Georgia, USA
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Now I only have more questions... What is the tray for? Did you add it for fuel economy savings on the highway? What is it made of? if it works to a measurable degree its pretty neat. I do remember the filter location on my 08 Civic Si to be horrible, not sure if its the case with your 3.0.
The tray is to reduce drag, so yes, improve fuel economy at higher speeds. It is made of coroplast, corrugated plastic, plastic cardboard basically. The same material small signs are made of. All of my aero mods (yes, there are more) contribute to about a %10 increase in highway fuel economy. The benefits of the undertray were easily noticeable, as i got better fuel economy and had better stability above 50 mph. My car is rated to get 18 city, 27 highway, 21 combined. So far I have achieved a lifetime mpg of 33.0 with the driving split listed in my first post. On my usual 45 mile highway commute I get right around 40-42 mpg most of the time. I have gotten as high as 47.1, and as low as 28 something. The filter is on the bottom right by the right lower control arm, not too difficult to access.
Originally Posted By: JoelB
Seems like a whole lot of effort for not much gain.
It is. But I do this as a hobby, therefore justifying the effort.
Originally Posted By: dgunay
I would recommend using duct tape on the body panel gaps, to get better fuel economy. grin If you want to push it more, you should use PUP. I wouldn't extend it with PP without seeing the TAN.
I would use clear tape, but I guess that's just me. I STILL have not found PUP ANYWHERE! Never seen it in person in my life. I'm also trying to get filter pictures posted. I used a fram ultra synthetic and it looked great, but my phone doesn't want to cooperate.
 

Daschicken

Thread starter
Messages
20
Location
Georgia, USA
Originally Posted By: Danh
Dunno if these UOA results are abnormal or not, but I'd stop turning off the engine at stoplights and ditch the underbody tray. There's always a bit of extra wear during start-up; factory designed systems crank the engine much faster before introducing fuel, which mitigates the problem. And one unintended consequence of the underbody tray could be higher oil temperature as it seems to inhibit airflow over the oil pan. Perhaps neither issue is a contributor, but just my $.02.
Woops! Missed your post in my multi quote.. I can assume that you are right about the tray allowing the oil to heat up more, which you are about to see is a good thing. My driving style does not get the oil hot. I have measured the oil temp several times at several different ambient temperatures. The last half mile of driving leading up to the oil temp check is pretty much all downhill, likely skewing temps further down. Outside temperature: 55 degrees Oil pan temperature: 135-150 degrees Outside temperature: 65 degrees Oil pan temperature: 140-150 degrees Outside temperature: 82 degrees Oil pan temperature: 160-170 Oil filter temperature: 170-175 degrees The highest temperature I have seen the oil was around 190 degrees after a spirited romp to heat up the oil prior to analysis.
 
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Messages
1,918
Location
British Columbia, Canada
Originally Posted By: Daschicken
The benefits of the undertray were easily noticeable, as i got better fuel economy and had better stability above 50 mph. My car is rated to get 18 city, 27 highway, 21 combined. So far I have achieved a lifetime mpg of 33.0 with the driving split listed in my first post. On my usual 45 mile highway commute I get right around 40-42 mpg most of the time. I have gotten as high as 47.1, and as low as 28 something.
You might be onto something. Your mileage is better than mine. I get up to 38 MPG on a mostly highway trip, more typically 35 - 36 MPG. And of course those are Imperial gallons. I typically drive at 125 Km/hr (77.5 MPH) and I'm not particularly careful with the go-pedal. I also typically use cruise control once I'm up to speed which also seems to be pretty heavy-footed.
 
Messages
534
Location
Minnesota
Originally Posted By: JoelB
Seems like a whole lot of effort for not much gain.
It is. But I do this as a hobby, therefore justifying the effort. Well I can't fault you there. More power to you then!
 
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