Personal defence vs STD rounds

They shoot them that many times because they are able to train more (budget, ammo cost), and the pistols are more shootable and faster splits are possible with the lower recoiling round.
Well you stick with that. I'm sticking with my 45 ACP and 230 Gr HP at close to 900 fps.
 
I was taught back in the day, 2rounds, center mass, to stop. Repeat as necessary. This was with the standard 38/357 6-shooter and 9mm jam-o-matics. None of this "ventilation" we seem to have now.
 
Well you stick with that. I'm sticking with my 45 ACP and 230 Gr HP at close to 900 fps.
Those work, too. Half dozen one or the other, terminally, although I've had more issues with vehicles and the 230gr .45acp stuff than a hot 9 +p 124gr. The .45 stuff doesn't have the kinetic energy vs frontal area to make it through many older car doors like on a monte or vic. Both punch windshields fine, with the heavier bullet getting the nod there. On people? Never seen it matter nearly as much as shot placement, and the 9mm helps, here.
I was taught back in the day, 2rounds, center mass, to stop. Repeat as necessary. This was with the standard 38/357 6-shooter and 9mm jam-o-matics.

Takes a lot more than 2 sometimes. Had more issues with revolvers locking up than my glocks, once you actually begin running some rounds through them. Especially with open base bullets. Lead vapor deposit against the barrel begins to drag the cylinder, etc. Happens with environmental contamination too, potentially.


Whatever you pick, train with it, and understand that handguns just poke holes. They aren't magic.
 
One thing to remember. Police miss their mark 80 of the time bc they actively engage the bg. As a civilian you use the firearm as last resort. Seeking cover, concealment, running away are the best options. I would not shoot unless I was 100% sure of hitting my target.

As far as 9 mm not being effective. That's silly. Get training
 
9mm works just as well as the rest, and I'll take a few more rounds in my mag anyday, without compromising form factor.
With modern JHP ammunition is an important provision there.

All handgun cartridges suck. They are all weak when compared to a 12 gauge shotgun or a centerfire rifle (yes, including .223 Rem). Between modern ammo in 9mmP, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP I’ve yet to be convinced that there is any significant difference in effectiveness.

BSW
 
With modern JHP ammunition is an important provision there.

All handgun cartridges suck. They are all weak when compared to a 12 gauge shotgun or a centerfire rifle (yes, including .223 Rem). Between modern ammo in 9mmP, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP I’ve yet to be convinced that there is any significant difference in effectiveness.

BSW
The FBI data supports this.
 
The difference between PD/HP and STD/FMJ/ball is that one requires a penicillin shot. The main difference is only what is available in this day and age and whether you can hit something.

Best to carry an RPG... works really well according to FBI data.

Nothing works if you don't hit the target. All work reasonably well if you hit CNS.

I could care less about flawed FBI data or protocol, or what NYPD or any gov't or police agency does.

There is nothing about going to court concerning ammo type, unless ammo type is illegal. They don't convict on the type of ammo. They convict on whether its a viable self-defense or not. Silly scare tactics. Yes, my firearm is loaded with mallninjacryptonitesilverhollowpointfangrip+P+samuraimegaflechettechainsawmultitaptalonclawboloperpeating 20mm SD ammo. The 30mm ammo recoiled too much. A10 warthogs got me beat there.

Mr Fish is an idiot.

12 gauge? I just can't conceal the street-sweeper too well and the holsters available just plain suck. Any recommendations? Should I just stick with my volley gun?

And, I won't be shooting thru car/house doors or windows.
I will already have to clean up and dispose of a criminal carcass in a yard hole and don't care to replace my windows or doors too.

The good thing to remember is that when we get invaded by blobs of gelatin, some of us will make it. Some won't. Also we should fear old phone books, jugs of water/juice, and wet newspapers. They can turn on us at any time.
 
until 1972 i only shot 22lr bolt action rifles. then uncle sam introduced me to centerfire caliber firearms and gave me plenty of combat tested fmj ball ammo to practice with. i have never bought or shot anything but fmj ball ammo since. k.i.s.s.
 
until 1972 i only shot 22lr bolt action rifles. then uncle sam introduced me to centerfire caliber firearms and gave me plenty of combat tested fmj ball ammo to practice with. i have never bought or shot anything but fmj ball ammo since. k.i.s.s.
5.56x45 55gr FMJ from a 20" barrel is typically very nasty stuff. Move into shorter barrels, or introduce barriers like a car door or windshield, and things change rapidly, though.
 
The difference between PD/HP and STD/FMJ/ball is that one requires a penicillin shot. The main difference is only what is available in this day and age and whether you can hit something.

Best to carry an RPG... works really well according to FBI data.

Nothing works if you don't hit the target. All work reasonably well if you hit CNS.

I could care less about flawed FBI data or protocol, or what NYPD or any gov't or police agency does.

There is nothing about going to court concerning ammo type, unless ammo type is illegal. They don't convict on the type of ammo. They convict on whether its a viable self-defense or not. Silly scare tactics. Yes, my firearm is loaded with mallninjacryptonitesilverhollowpointfangrip+P+samuraimegaflechettechainsawmultitaptalonclawboloperpeating 20mm SD ammo. The 30mm ammo recoiled too much. A10 warthogs got me beat there.

Mr Fish is an idiot.

12 gauge? I just can't conceal the street-sweeper too well and the holsters available just plain suck. Any recommendations? Should I just stick with my volley gun?

And, I won't be shooting thru car/house doors or windows.
I will already have to clean up and dispose of a criminal carcass in a yard hole and don't care to replace my windows or doors too.

The good thing to remember is that when we get invaded by blobs of gelatin, some of us will make it. Some won't. Also we should fear old phone books, jugs of water/juice, and wet newspapers. They can turn on us at any time.
Are you the "expert" who gives out advice no one asks for at my gun range? Your sure sound like him.....
 
This isn't a gun range and is a forum with a thread poster asking a question.

Can you help the thread starter, or do just attack everyone else making a comment?
 
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