Pennzoil YB Past & Present - Rumors/Facts

[BTLew81]

That alone should show how great YB is.

 

[Chris142]

 Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah

PS: Some type of Ford motor? late 80's 2.8l V6 out of a Ranger or Bronco?? (air injection with FI)

It's a 351W. See how the lower thermostat bolt is acessable. On 302's you cant see it because it's stuffed behind the timing cover. As for the sludge rumors. IMO back in the 60's and 70's oil, all oil brands were not as good as they are today. Many owners put 160F stats in their cars or even removed the stat completly thinking that 195F was too hot. So now we have an engine that never gets hot enough to boil out the condensation. 10w-40 was very common because 5w-30 or 10w-30 was thought to be too "thin" to properly protect an engine. Then the PCV valve gets plugged. So somebody's brothers wifes brothers cousin once removed had his engine sludge up and blamed Pennzoil when the actual cause was unknown to them. Oil does not make sludge. It prevents it but no oil can prevent it if the circumstances are bad enough.

 

[ProfPS]

I see a little sludge buildup between the push rods for cylinder #4.

 

[PF52]

 Originally Posted By: Chris142

So somebody's brothers wifes brothers cousin once removed had his engine sludge up and blamed Pennzoil when the actual cause was unknown to them.

That's the type of anecdotal evidence that is spread all over the internet and thus fuels the rumor. I'm on one forum where the biggest "Pennzoil-causes-sludge" believer bases his opinion on cars he tore down 30-40 years ago, none of which he bought new of course. Whichever oil they actually used is unknown. On another forum, I mentioned my good experience with the clean 300K Beretta (and was all set to post pics) when some guy came on and said not to bother and that any pics I might post are likely to be "fakes". I never did bother to post them; its hard to argue with the "experts" such as himself.

 

[StevieC]

Now these kind of pictures really show how good YB really is and how much [censored] is out there... Thanks for posting!

 

[deven]

There is a reason why Pennzoil YB is the #1 selling conventional oil for a long time and it has nothing to do with sludge!!! I'll take Jiffy Lube as an example, google it and you'll see complaints after complaints about them. Even if 90% of them do a great job most of the time its the other 10% that ruin their image because as a society we tend to magnify the negatives but few tend to voice there positive outcomes. It's just the way life is.

 

[demarpaint]

I wish I had pictures of my 85 E-150 that was stop and go use for over 150,000 miles. That van was run on YB its whole life until I sold it. I changed the VC gasket just before I sold it because of a bad leak, it was cleaner than the 300,000 mile engine by a long shot. Granted it had half the miles, my point is the engine was spotless, just like that 300K engine.

 

[OldDirtyBaytown]

 Originally Posted By: Chris142

Many owners put 160F stats in their cars or even removed the stat completly thinking that 195F was too hot. So now we have an engine that never gets hot enough to boil out the condensation. 10w-40 was very common because 5w-30 or 10w-30 was thought to be too "thin" to properly protect an engine. Then the PCV valve gets plugged.

 

[Gary Allan]

The two most popular oils in use over generations were PZ and QS. Of all the millions of units using these two popular oils, some engines had sludge. or restated, Out of millions of units over a few generations, some engines had sludge. A high percentage of those units used PZ or QS. Out of those units, the oil was the source of the sludge. Now if people bothered to find the cause...

 

[labman]

I once took some paraffin and dissolved it in Pennzoil with no trouble. I then put it in the freezer when my wife wasn't around. The paraffin stayed dissolved. Warm Pennzoil dissolves paraffin and keeps it dissolved. Sludge is mostly carbonized junk difficult to dissolve.

 

[Johnny]

labman, does your wife know how weird you are?

 

[GrampsintheSand]

 Originally Posted By: OldDirtyBaytown

When did this stuff go from utter [censored] to the high-water mark for conventional oils? Has Pennzoil changed it up that much over the last 10-12 yrs, or was it undeserved bad rep.? I'm sure I'm not the only one who heard horror stories. It was partially (or even directly) blamed for engines sludging up & catastrophic engine failures back in the day, rightfully so or not. But then I read about recent Oil analysis with YB in newer motors saying it's good to 5-6k, whats really going on? Was it really improved that much? And yes, I realize there's a former Pennzoil employee on this board. Maybe he can shed some light... or maybe that's why members on here are buying up YB in the first place? I haven't seen a frenzy for YB (or AutoRX) on other automotive forums. Inquiring minds want to know... my case specifically would be a '93 Nissan KA24DE in Houston summer (6-month summer) @ 95*/Gridlock traffic daily to Dusty job-sites @ 3-4 OCIs, synthetic is not an option. Pretty much worst-case scenario I'm thinking 10w30 or a thick 5w

I did not read all the other post as this question comes up a lot on another board I frequent. UOA's and people personal experience just plain tell us Pennzoil YB is good stuff. But the question always comes up "what happened because Pennzoil was garbage/caused sludge etc." Here it is. Back a few years Pennzoil was the leading brand of motor oil on the road.... huge market share. Also back then motors were not efficient at all. Car "maintenance" was not what it is today. There were no "Jiffy Lubes" on every corner etc. so folks didn't change oil as much. Crank ventilation solutions consisted of a hose hanging under the car from the valve covers. So motors sludged/failed etc. and more than often Pennzoil was in the sump. So Pennzoil got blamed when poor maintenance/engine design etc. should have been blamed. So bottom line is engines are more efficient/People are more aware of maintenance and have access to inexpensive/convenient oil changes etc. Oils are much more robust today for sure...but the factors I mention have much to do with the "myth" that Pennzoil was a "bad" oil 20 years ago. Just is not true at all.

 

[labman]

 Originally Posted By: Johnny

labman, does your wife know how weird you are?

Well, I think I hide the worst of it. But all the nonsense about paraffin and sludge gets to me. Being a chemist, I understand things like paraffins and solubilities.

 

[TWINRAY]

I have a '69 Corvette that I bought in 1973. I used Penzoil 10w-40 exlcusively in the car until the late 80's at which point it was put into storage (until 2002). I read about the sludge problems and always thought I was just lucky cause I knew I had a clean valve train area. Always changed my oil at either 3 mos or 3K miles. Glad to finally hear the issue was all bull.

 

[tom slick]

I know a guy who was management level in product development and later marketing at Pennzoil in the early 80's so I asked him about the sludge rumors. He laughed and his comments were: When you are one of, if not the most, popular oil brands there is a good possibility that any engine that has sludge has had Pennzoil in it, statistically it is going to happen. It will happen to other brands also but for whatever reason people remember Pennzoil. If Pennzoil did cause sludge it would never pass the standardized (i.e. SAE) or manufacturer's tests such as the "Aunt Minnie" test. Ford specifically tested oils for sludge formation. Causing sludge would be committing suicide because OEMs would recommend against your product to CYA against warranty issues. I think it is interesting that you hear rumors but never see proof that Pennzoil specifically causes sludge.

 

[Hokiefyd]

I've never seen a lick of proof that, given a sludged up engine: - Pennzoil was used exclusively in that engine since the first day of operation. - The correct viscosity grade was used. - The correct oil change interval was used. - Other possible causes of the sludge were ruled out. And ultimately, - Pennzoil brand oil was the cause of the sludge. Until ANYONE brings ANYTHING like that to the table, I'm afraid this will always remain a myth in most folks' minds, mine certainly included.

 

[Steve S]

paraffin is a part of all crude oils.

 

[Hokiefyd]

 Originally Posted By: Steve S

paraffin is a part of all crude oils.

The notion I've heard is that the base stocks that Pennzoil and QS used or use contain(ed) more paraffin than others, which supposedly caused it to precipitate out or something, forming the sludge. I don't know a whole lot about oil chemistry myself, but I find this statement questionable at best. I think it's also amusing that at least half of the folks that continue to perpetuate these tales seem to be those who only use synthetic oil, and the tale is usually followed with, "and that's why I use only Brand X synthetic oil today," almost as if the tale was contrived (or at least passed along) only to rationalize the use of their favorite brand of synthetic. I don't care what oil any given person uses. What I do care about is the continued passing of stories that, at best, are based on anecdotal stories and small sample sizes, and are of no real statistical value.

 

[dishdude]

Who uses the same oil for the entire life of an engine? I would say there are very few who do and the ones that do are most likely the maintenance fanatics who will never extend an oci too long. These people won't get sludge no matter what brand they use. It is the people who take their car to the quick lube and see an oil brand on the windshield sticker, and whatever is on there last is what they associate with the problem. Never mind that the engine has seen 6 different brands of oil over it's lifetime, been run low on oil and run on extremely long ocis.

 

[labman]

 Originally Posted By: dishdude

Who uses the same oil for the entire life of an engine? I would say there are very few who do and the ones that do are most likely the maintenance fanatics who will never extend an oci too long. These people won't get sludge no matter what brand they use. It is the people who take their car to the quick lube and see an oil brand on the windshield sticker, and whatever is on there last is what they associate with the problem. Never mind that the engine has seen 6 different brands of oil over it's lifetime, been run low on oil and run on extremely long ocis.

I mostly do. I think I switched to Pennzoil from Valvoline after Ashland Chemical threw me out in 1975. I have run nothing else but it except Quaker State for a few years in the late 80's. I buy new, and keep for a long time. The only thing I ever saw a sludge problem with was my 81 Pontiac Phoenix. It had the SBC cut down to a 6. It was getting few enough miles, I was following the owner's manual and doing 6 month oil changes. A few years after switching to Quaker State, I pulled the valve covers because they were leaking oil. What a mess. It was so badly sludged, oil was standing in it because the return holes were plugged. I cleaned it up the best I could, and switched back to Pennzoil. Truthfully, I can't say it wasn't already sludged up when I started to use Quaker State. When I told my brother, he told me back in the 50's he had a sludge problems, and he was told it was because he was running Quaker State. My 77 Chevy LUV was getting the same oil at the same time, and never showed any sign of sludge. Not long after that, I traded the Phoenix on a 91 Grand AM with the HO Quad 4. After reading its owner's manual, I concluded I should be changing oil every 3 months which I have ever since on both my 77 LUV and the 02 Cavailer with the Ecotec. I have mostly run AC filters when I could find them cheap. When I couldn't, I ran Fram or Purolator until I cut open the last Fram I ever bought. In the more recent years, the truck was mostly ST.