Pennzoil Platinum 5w-20, 5025 miles, 2007 Corolla

[HondaMan]

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That's an obvious attempt to mislead. Why do you do this so often? You know that:
1. Most posted UOAs are by Blackstone (our minds are trained to their trends)
2. Blackstone's fuel and flash methods differ from those used by the lab you use

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JAG,

So your mind is 'trained' to the 'trends' of another lab.
GREAT!!
I think you should use this lab only and never use another lab. Never.
With this, please never use the services of Terry so that he as just a little more time for those of us who are not 'trained' into the 'trends' of your favorite lab.

 

[Artemedes]

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Good choice. Looking forward to seeing your UOA too. What kind of MPG are you getting?

This is the only UOA so far. I didn't do one this past oil change, but I will on next one in a couple months.

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I am averaging 37 in mixed driving. This tank has been mostly highway and am at 225 miles and not even close to the 1/2 way mark, so this one is on track to be 40 or more. Ever since getting my first UOA back I can't wait for the next one. At the pace I am going it is going to turn cold again before it has 5k miles on it. My UOA was right in line with Bill's if you look at his. Hopefully it will continue to turn results close to his. I am trying the PP 5w20 mainly as an experiment, because I couldn't find any reports with 1zzfe engines and this weight. I felt PP was the natural choice to test it. Hope changing out your air filter helps things for you next report.

 

[Terry]

JAG, I honestly was trying to clarify what my proprietary lab testing actually is and does. If that is misleading you need to reboot your internal logic tree.
Sorry to hijack the discussion but I felt this was germane to the commentary.

 

[mfisher1967]

Terry, can you shed a little light on what is going on with this vehicle? It seems like this Toyota should have less wear particles and fuel dilution considering its age, frequent OCI's and use of PP.

 

[mikeg5]

maybe the oversize pureone isnt doing the job you think it should? just a thought.. my girl has the same car but an automatic. those air filters have to placed right your will get kinks and pinches that will allow the air to seep in.. plus keep that pcv valve clean or replaced..

 

[JAG]

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Nothing misleading about it. Blackstone uses open cup and they extrapolate fuel % based on their flashpoint results. This is far less accurate than actually checking for fuel signature in the spectrograph.

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I agree Terry's lab's methods are far more accurate. My point is what I originally said in this thread. Some members here are seeing the results from the lab Terry uses and freaking out by the low flashpoints and high fuel dilution (even you did in that other thread). They are freaking out because they are used to seeing flashpoints in the high 300s and fuel levels less than 0.5%. They think there is a huge fuel dilution problem going on. The methods produce different results as I said and that must be considered when comparing UOAs from the different labs.

 

[Terry]

"They think there is a huge fuel dilution problem going on."

There is a broad based DESIGN gasoline fuel dilute issue going on and I have addressed that on BITOG most recently with the RS4 issues.

JAG, agreed that the closed cup flash can be dramatically different than open cup, and add the fact that Bklabs may be over reporting the flash a bit,the weekend analyst viewing here would be shocked and has been. My customers are not because I tell them that when they buy my time and service.

The combo of FTIR fuels AND a conservative flash is a good indicator of dilute and aromatics levels and why I use it.

When you add some abrasive ( dirt) ingress, mechanical shear,and then top off the trifecta with aromatic/fuels dilution to a engine and oil that is also driven hard unless you use a miracle lube like the BIOSYN stuff seems to be against this effect, well the engine is gonna wear like a "bad boy" and thats exactly what we see here.

Platinum and Quaker syns may be the best off the shelf synlubes at resisting this effect.

All that being said: the customers who use our service and follow the recommendations see high 300s -400F flash and 0.5 or less fuel dilute, even with the punitive Dyson Premium Service testing!

 

[JAG]

That's all I wanted to hear you say! Thank you! Ok, I'll hush up now, view other forums, and thereby stay out of the trouble.

 

[JAG]

double post...ignore

 

[Cutehumor]

Jason, it looks like you used 5w-20 for entire ownership. how's oil consumption if any?

 

[Camu Mahubah]

Also Jason, is this car spec'd for 5w20? And Terry just said that Pennzoil and Quaker State oils are some of the best formulations for fuel dilution problems, is that why you use Pennzoil Platinum?

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

There has been no perceptible oil consumption so far.

It says 5w-30 on cap and manual but there is a Toyota TSB specifying 5w-20.
That is not why I used it because I didn't even know I had a dilution issue, first time I found out. I did hear other good things about it here however, and that is why I used it.

 

[Last_Z]

Terry, JAG and G-man,

You guys have me very confused now. I think somebody should explain this in detail, So I'll ask very detailed questions.

1- Terry's method of testing for fuel in the oil is FTIR and not closed cup, correct?

2- Whichever method Terry uses is more accurate than Blackstones, correct?

3- What method do oil blenders/makers (Pennzoil, Mobil, etc) use to test for flash point for listing on their MSDSs?

4- How are the different testing methods for flash and fuel corelated?

Either way Terry tested the flashpoint in this Corolla, it is scary low at only 280*F. What am I missing? I do apologize if I have mixed flash point and and fuel dilute testing methods.....obviously I am clueless!

Thanks!

Rick

 

[smokey1]

would SHELL motor oils be good for fuel dilution issues , being they're same company as PENNZOIL and QUAKER STATE . ?

 

[JAG]

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Terry, JAG and G-man,

3- What method do oil blenders/makers (Pennzoil, Mobil, etc) use to test for flash point for listing on their MSDSs?

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I'll just take this question. I know that Mobil uses ASTM D92 (open cup) method because they state this in the Product Data Sheets. Other brands may use different procedures and if their product data sheets are most helpful, they will say what the procedure is.

I tried to find what Pennzoil uses but my internet explorer won't open PDF files right now.

ASTM D92: http://storkview.storksmt.com/specsite/newspecdetail.asp?topic=ASTM_D92&sid=305

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

By the way the way artemedes, that is amazing mpg. Does KC have ethanol in their gasoline? Bill's most recent UOA post had even more awesome MPG. I guess the high altitude helps his though. I am envious. The highest I ever had was 38.5mpg, all highway, I did drive 80mph but only some of the time, that may be why. I don't seem to be able to break 34 mpg anymore(used to be higher). Only thing different is the air filter and I have new tires (Potenza RE960, great BTW).

 

[Panzerman]

Regardless, I like when people use Blackstone simply because they can post the comments that Blackstone gives you with the report. This bussiness where you cannot post the result comments is bogus, if you pay for the results you own them, its your oil, your tests, your results. Not all of us work at NASA on the weekends and like to read those little comments to tell us what we are looking at.

 

[bmph8ter]

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Regardless, I like when people use Blackstone simply because they can post the comments that Blackstone gives you with the report. This bussiness where you cannot post the result comments is bogus, if you pay for the results you own them, its your oil, your tests, your results. Not all of us work at NASA on the weekends and like to read those little comments to tell us what we are looking at.

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Amen to that; thanks for posting up your results jason07-1zzfe!

 

[02zx9r]

I second that notion!

 

[wgtoys]

Personally I would switch up to 5W-30 with a moderate fuel dilution/flashpoint issue like that. The slightly higher base viscosity could buy a bit of safety margin.

Also this engine is still relatively fresh. Really high copper numbers on late model low mileage engines seems to be very common. The iron is a touch high for a Toyota but would be a good number from a GM engine

. Date for previous runs would be interesting as well.

The silicon could easily still be from new seals and sealers in the engine. Silicon doesn't always mean an air leak.

Finally, to me the whole point of 'net discussion groups is to share information. Having a super secret portion of the conversation being referred to yet kept behind closed doors seems to violate that spirit.