PCMatic

[Mystic]

Just as a side note if somebody does use the ESET online scan and there is malware on the computer you might be able to remove the malware using the ESET online scan.

For removing malware it is very possible that you will have to run in Safe Mode. HitmanPro, Malwarebytes, and the ESET AV can all run in safe mode. It is also possible to run off a CD, using the Kaspersky AV or F-Secure. These work okay on a Windows 7 computer but since they run in versions of Linux I have not tried them on a Windows 8.1 computer. I have disinfected computers. And I have advised some people on how to disinfect computers.

I happen to know that one major company uses HitmanPro and Sysinternals to disinfect computers. But I am not going to say what company. People who don't know about Sysinternals should not use that software. You can mess up your computer if you don't know what you are doing.

 

[lugNutz]

Originally Posted By: Subdued
I just think it's extremely dangerous for someone to take their own clearly limited experience and suggest that the product works great, when there is a mountain of opposing evidence suggesting it's ineffective.

Cognitive dissonance at its finest.


Congratulations... you are officially added to list of idiots that learned big words in other threads and googled what they meant -- then repurposed them in an attempt to seem intelligent. (See bold below from last month)

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I have no problem with people buying whatever they want. I just don't want to hear them whine when gas prices go up!

You make your bed, you sleep in it. You don't answer to me for using more resources than someone else. This is still America. We waste more than just about any nation on Earth.


Yeah exactly this. I'm lucky to live somewhere where annual costs for reg, insurance, inspection on a 1995 F150 are ~$275 a year. I drive this truck when I need to, which is not often. My other vehicles are properly sized for commuting, hauling family, etc. Gas could be $10 and I wouldn't be upset that I bit of more than I could chew, and I wouldn't undergo the cognitive dissonance of "I assumed gas would be three bucks for the next twenty years straight."


Now, I am pretty sure that your wildly incorrect statement was directed towards me, but I will not bother devoting any additional time aside from this reply, to the unintelligent, especially since your 3 chime-ins have proven nothing except you probably just finished building your first computer and think you are god's gift to technology. You should go to Google and find the definition of experience. It is rather clear given what I do for a living and my previous statements that I in fact DO have experience.

OVERKILL has his OWN personal experiences, and the same goes for Mystic and myself, which is where the intelligence remains encapsulated in the latter half of this thread. It's like different brands of cars, oil, oil filters, etc... People buy them, love them, and stick with them. If you become dissatisfied, you move on. In my case, I have had great experiences with a product in which others have not. A lot of major corporations and home users use Microsoft's security, and I am fairly certain they wouldn't, if it didn't work for them. Same goes for ANY applications that serve similar purposes. In no way did I tell anyone they should not use the security of their choice or bash them for doing so. Good luck to you with your endeavors Mystic, hope it all works out.

 

[Mystic]

I am not removing malware for a living. I am retired. But I have removed malware from computers.

There are things the average person can do that will work if a computer is not bricked up too bad by malware. In the old days we used anti-rootkit software and stuff like that. Today a person can download the Kaspersky Rescue CD software and put in on a CD. You may have to use a separate computer to do that. And then you can use the Kaspersky Rescue CD to remove malware. If you can get the computer running well enough to permit downloading of security software, you can download Malwarebytes and HitmanPro. You may have to run these in safe mode.

If things like that do not work it is time to seek professional help. If a computer is too heavily infested with malware I would not trust it. Get it running as well as possible and save data and put the data on an external drive and format the hard drive of the computer. This is the only way to be sure the malware is gone.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: lugNutz

OVERKILL has his OWN personal experiences, and the same goes for Mystic and myself, which is where the intelligence remains encapsulated in the latter half of this thread. It's like different brands of cars, oil, oil filters, etc... People buy them, love them, and stick with them. If you become dissatisfied, you move on. In my case, I have had great experiences with a product in which others have not. A lot of major corporations and home users use Microsoft's security, and I am fairly certain they wouldn't, if it didn't work for them. Same goes for ANY applications that serve similar purposes. In no way did I tell anyone they should not use the security of their choice or bash them for doing so. Good luck to you with your endeavors Mystic, hope it all works out.

 

[dishdude]

You guys had me second guessing, so I ran an ESET online scan on what would be my worst machine - XP running only MSE as protection, but typically use Chrome on it. No threats found.

 

[Subdued]

Originally Posted By: lugNutz
Originally Posted By: Subdued
I just think it's extremely dangerous for someone to take their own clearly limited experience and suggest that the product works great, when there is a mountain of opposing evidence suggesting it's ineffective.

Cognitive dissonance at its finest.


Congratulations... you are officially added to list of idiots that learned big words in other threads and googled what they meant -- then repurposed them in an attempt to seem intelligent. (See bold below from last month)

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
I have no problem with people buying whatever they want. I just don't want to hear them whine when gas prices go up!

You make your bed, you sleep in it. You don't answer to me for using more resources than someone else. This is still America. We waste more than just about any nation on Earth.


Yeah exactly this. I'm lucky to live somewhere where annual costs for reg, insurance, inspection on a 1995 F150 are ~$275 a year. I drive this truck when I need to, which is not often. My other vehicles are properly sized for commuting, hauling family, etc. Gas could be $10 and I wouldn't be upset that I bit of more than I could chew, and I wouldn't undergo the cognitive dissonance of "I assumed gas would be three bucks for the next twenty years straight."


Now, I am pretty sure that your wildly incorrect statement was directed towards me, but I will not bother devoting any additional time aside from this reply, to the unintelligent, especially since your 3 chime-ins have proven nothing except you probably just finished building your first computer and think you are god's gift to technology. You should go to Google and find the definition of experience. It is rather clear given what I do for a living and my previous statements that I in fact DO have experience.

OVERKILL has his OWN personal experiences, and the same goes for Mystic and myself, which is where the intelligence remains encapsulated in the latter half of this thread. It's like different brands of cars, oil, oil filters, etc... People buy them, love them, and stick with them. If you become dissatisfied, you move on. In my case, I have had great experiences with a product in which others have not. A lot of major corporations and home users use Microsoft's security, and I am fairly certain they wouldn't, if it didn't work for them. Same goes for ANY applications that serve similar purposes. In no way did I tell anyone they should not use the security of their choice or bash them for doing so. Good luck to you with your endeavors Mystic, hope it all works out.


MSE IS still widely used by the average home user, and most don't have a problem. I'll give you that. It's a fact.

HOWEVER!!!!

That doesn't mean it's an effective solution, that just means those people haven't run into something that compromises it yet.

I will always lean towards what I know to be an effective solution. Right now for me it's Bitdefender. That could change in a year. Unfortunately the end-user home free AV market is in a state of constant flux. Solutions that were elegant, lightweight, and effective one year can be bloated pieces of dung the next. It's actually quite maddening.


Now to address this utter rubbish you posted above:

First, I don't need to recycle and google terms. I know exactly what I'm talking about, and your extremely angry reply and insulting name calling says it all. I use big words sometimes because I know what they mean and they fit better than using a lot of small words you might be more able to understand. Your poor vocabulary is not my problem.

Second, I'm a network engineer, and have been for some time. I have 20+ years of experience in the business starting with PC building and repair and moving up from there. Sorry, your experience is probably limited compared to mine. It's just a fact, don't get all mad about it.

Third, "Microsoft's security" (whatever that even means) is NOT widely used by business. I've supported hundreds of businesses, and several large (over 500 employees) companies and a few (over 20,000 employee) corporations in several states, and NOT A SINGLE ONE uses microsoft anti-malware solutions. Not one.

 

[Subdued]

Originally Posted By: Mystic
I am not removing malware for a living. I am retired. But I have removed malware from computers.

There are things the average person can do that will work if a computer is not bricked up too bad by malware. In the old days we used anti-rootkit software and stuff like that. Today a person can download the Kaspersky Rescue CD software and put in on a CD. You may have to use a separate computer to do that. And then you can use the Kaspersky Rescue CD to remove malware. If you can get the computer running well enough to permit downloading of security software, you can download Malwarebytes and HitmanPro. You may have to run these in safe mode.

If things like that do not work it is time to seek professional help. If a computer is too heavily infested with malware I would not trust it. Get it running as well as possible and save data and put the data on an external drive and format the hard drive of the computer. This is the only way to be sure the malware is gone.

Don't forget to scan the recovered data with a known good working anti-malware solution...

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: dishdude
You guys had me second guessing, so I ran an ESET online scan on what would be my worst machine - XP running only MSE as protection, but typically use Chrome on it. No threats found.




Good to hear! Did you check the box to detect potentially unwanted applications?

 

[Subdued]

Chrome also goes a long way in helping to mitigate a lot of threats that would otherwise make someone have a really bad day...

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: Subdued

Third, "Microsoft's security" (whatever that even means) is NOT widely used by business. I've supported hundreds of businesses, and several large (over 500 employees) companies and a few (over 20,000 employee) corporations in several states, and NOT A SINGLE ONE uses microsoft anti-malware solutions. Not one.


That has been my experience as well, as I posted above. It is unfortunate that this discussion started to get personal, as I think it was going well prior to that

That said, lugNutz is doing programming and .NET programming at that, so it is a Microsoft environment. I'm guessing that these types of environments are more inclined to be leveraging a Microsoft-sourced security solution than the environments we work in.

 

[Subdued]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Subdued

Third, "Microsoft's security" (whatever that even means) is NOT widely used by business. I've supported hundreds of businesses, and several large (over 500 employees) companies and a few (over 20,000 employee) corporations in several states, and NOT A SINGLE ONE uses microsoft anti-malware solutions. Not one.


That has been my experience as well, as I posted above. It is unfortunate that this discussion started to get personal, as I think it was going well prior to that

That said, lugNutz is doing programming and .NET programming at that, so it is a Microsoft environment. I'm guessing that these types of environments are more inclined to be leveraging a Microsoft-sourced security solution than the environments we work in.

That explains a lot...

Please excuse my antagonistic tone.

 

[Mystic]

Personally I have some major concerns about MSE (Windows Defender for Windows 8.1) but it is interesting that NSS Labs in order to test AV software had to shut off SmartScreen in Windows 8/8.1. The Microsoft SmartScreen technology used to defend only IE. In Windows 8/8.1 it defends the entire computer. It was so effective and detected threats so well that they could not test the various AV programs without turning it off. So that is impressive technology from Microsoft and used with MSE or Windows Defender and the Windows firewall it provides more effective protection for Windows computers.

But I still prefer a better AV than Microsoft's AV. So I use ESET. But if Microsoft's AV was at least close in effectiveness to other programs I would use it and Malwarebytes and HitmanPro. And the ESET online scan from time to time.

It is good that you did not find malware on your computer. But if I were you I would run an ESET online scan from time to time. It can't hurt and it is free.

 

[dishdude]

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL


Good to hear! Did you check the box to detect potentially unwanted applications?


Yes.

Originally Posted By: Subdued

Third, "Microsoft's security" (whatever that even means) is NOT widely used by business. I've supported hundreds of businesses, and several large (over 500 employees) companies and a few (over 20,000 employee) corporations in several states, and NOT A SINGLE ONE uses microsoft anti-malware solutions. Not one.


I work for a Fortune 500 Company that uses Microsoft Forefront Endpoint Protection on their PCs. I really am finding it hard to believe that they would choose an option that would put the security of company data at risk.

 

[Subdued]

Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL


Good to hear! Did you check the box to detect potentially unwanted applications?


Yes.

Originally Posted By: Subdued

Third, "Microsoft's security" (whatever that even means) is NOT widely used by business. I've supported hundreds of businesses, and several large (over 500 employees) companies and a few (over 20,000 employee) corporations in several states, and NOT A SINGLE ONE uses microsoft anti-malware solutions. Not one.


I work for a Fortune 500 Company that uses Microsoft Forefront Endpoint Protection on their PCs. I really am finding it hard to believe that they would choose an option that would put the security of company data at risk.

I tend to agree with you on that one, and I'm sure Forefront is a fine product. It just isn't widely used for one reason or another. My point was never that Forefront was junk, it's that it isn't nearly as widely used as some may think. And it certainly isn't the same product as their home offerings.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Mystic
OVERKILL how does HitmanPro compare with the ESET online scan?

Mystic, I haven't pestered you to switch to Linux for a few days, so I suppose I'm due.

 

[Mystic]

Linux just does not work for me. I use Windows because of the software and hardware compatibility and Windows enables me to do the things I like and want to do. But I actually have used various Linux O/Ss. I tried SuSe Linux and I have used Linux O/S rescue CDs running Kaspersky or F-Secure.

I have an iMac also but if Apple's new Photos application is a joke I am going to move away from Apple. Apple does not seem to worry very much about customers needs. I think Apple is concentrating on mobile computing and the limited needs of people who just use the internet, text, go to Facebook and Twitter, email, etc.

For me it is whatever technology works for me. I don't have any kind of religious like devotion to any of these O/Ss or corporations.

It is true that there is a lot of malware affecting Windows. But I would rather have to deal with that issue than not being able to do the things I want to do because of software or hardware issues. Even with Apple every time they come out with a new O/S my hardware may not work for a while. That is unacceptable to me. And I am not going to try to work on photos using GIMP or using an old version of Photoshop running in WINE. Even Apple's Aperture software has fallen behind and Apple is going to dump it. It really seriously could have been great software.

When people don't care about my needs I don't care about them.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Mystic
Linux just does not work for me.

I know that. Like I said, it was just time to pester you about it again.

 

[Noobie]

I'd recommend Bitdefender and Kaspersky.

 

[Mystic]

I would love to use Bitdefender. But every time I try it it seems kind of buggy. I have kind of moved away from Kaspersky. It does not run well enough for me on a 64 bit version of Windows.

The problem with the German AV programs is at least where I live I can't just walk into a store and buy a copy and I have heard that USA support is not that great. The same problem might exist for F-Secure. I tried a trial version of F-Secure and I liked it in a lot of ways, but I guess they have slow servers because the updates were slow.

TrendMicro seems pretty good but the last time I tried a trial version of it it seemed to slow my computer down.

For me ESET seems pretty good. It might not rank quite as high as Bitdefender and Kaspersky but it does not slow the computer down and it just works. If a person has just one computer you can buy ESET NOD32 for one computer for about thirty bucks.

I believe in layers of protection and I think in addition to an AV a person should have at least the free version of Malwarebytes. The free version does not interfere with the AV. Also of course common sense on the internet and good passwords and occasional back up scans with ESET online scan.

You have to watch also to see where these programs rank all the time. Because ESET may be near the top right now and next year it could be ranked 7th. If I have to switch AV programs I will probably go to Bitdefender.

 

[ClutchDisc]

Mystic, if you give Bitdefender a try again let me know if you still find it buggy or not.. Because I've put it on a few computers, and have been running it on my Windows computer for a while now without any issues. It's not been buggy at all for me. I love it.. lightweight, and never pops up messages trying to get you to buy their paid AV.