oil volatility

Pennzoil motor oil
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RetiredSux

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I did a forum search on the subject and didn't find anything.

I have a Subaru GDI engine and am concerned about the deposits that are going to build up on my intake valves. I use Mobil 1 0W30 oil. Would 5W30 be more appropriate due to volatility? It would seem that the "0" characteristic of the oil won't last very long as the oil heats up hence going to 5W30 wouldn't have an effect on volatility. I prefer the "0" due to its cold flow characteristics.
 
Originally Posted by y_p_w
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
How cold does it get in Oklahoma?

IIRC - typical midwest climate. Freezing temps every year. Somewhat summers.


Basically trying to determine if it gets down ~-30C where a 0w-xx makes sense.
 
I can talk to my friends who work at the Subaru dealerships owned by their family in the Greater Toronto Area and ask them if they are seeing problems with your specific model if you want. If it's going to appear it would in our climate here with cold winters.

Failing that you can use these anacdotal things to minimize it:

-Change oil at at severe duty interval in your manual using an oil that meets the manual requirements and that is synthetic.
-Maybe a lower Noack rating on the oil might help (we don't know if this works)
-Maybe a catch can will also help (make sure it has adequate baffling) (I think this works from personal experience)
-Using a fuel system cleaner with high amounts of PEA in it every oil change could help (To keep injectors are peak efficiency to limit was gets past the rings and ends up recirculated through the PCV)
-Using CRC's valve, intake and turbo cleaner sprayed through the intake can help (Works for my cousins TGDI Veloster that is first generation and known to gunk up valves)
-Taking it out on the highway at 3,000 rpm for 20-30 minutes once a week seems to work for some GDI/TGDI folks here.
 
Last edited:
I've been keeping an eye out for a Noack loss result for Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0w30 and haven't seen a number yet...there was something for a Mobil 0W30 on the Russian Oil Club site but I didn't get the feeling it was the same as AFE. I avoid that site now and don't even remember what the Noack loss for that oil was.

BTW, it's fine if the OPer likes 0W30 but 5W30 should really be fine for his climate...I normally run 5W30 synthetic and haven't had trouble even after cold ski nights in the White Mountains.
The lowest Noack loss I've seen published for a 5W30 you can buy at Walmart is 8.5% for Mobil 1 Annual Protection, but that's a pricey oil.
Valvoline FS is 9.2% at a lower price and Quaker State Ultimate Durability came out around 9% before the 2017 d1G2 formulation change, but I haven't seen an analysis since then.
Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 Formula was around 6%, but that was very expensive in the US and may have been replaced by a just plain ESP of unknown volatility.
Ravenol DXG is also supposed to be around 6% if you don't mind the price and ordering online.
Regular ol Mobil 1 5W30 is at 10% loss from a couple of sources.
 
Originally Posted by StevieC
I can talk to my friends who work at the Subaru dealerships owned by their family in the Greater Toronto Area and ask them if they are seeing problems with your specific model if you want. If it's going to appear it would in our climate here with cold winters.

Failing that you can use these anacdotal things to minimize it:

-Change oil at at severe duty interval in your manual using an oil that meets the manual requirements and that is synthetic.
-Maybe a lower Noack rating on the oil might help (we don't know if this works)
-Maybe a catch can will also help (make sure it has adequate baffling) (I think this works from personal experience)
-Using a fuel system cleaner with high amounts of PEA in it every oil change could help (To keep injectors are peak efficiency to limit was gets past the rings and ends up recirculated through the PCV)
-Using CRC's valve, intake and turbo cleaner sprayed through the intake can help (Works for my cousins TGDI Veloster that is first generation and known to gunk up valves)
-Taking it out on the highway at 3,000 rpm for 20-30 minutes once a week seems to work for some GDI/TGDI folks here.


If you don't mind me asking, did your cuz mod that Veloster Turbo up?
Based upon my limited reading, that may be the most modded vehicle per unit sold that I've heard about...
 
Originally Posted by StevieC
I can talk to my friends who work at the Subaru dealerships owned by their family in the Greater Toronto Area and ask them if they are seeing problems with your specific model if you want. If it's going to appear it would in our climate here with cold winters.


That would be great! Every bit of info helps. Thanks!

Originally Posted by StevieC
Failing that you can use these anacdotal things to minimize it:

-Change oil at at severe duty interval in your manual using an oil that meets the manual requirements and that is synthetic.
-Maybe a lower Noack rating on the oil might help (we don't know if this works)
-Maybe a catch can will also help (make sure it has adequate baffling) (I think this works from personal experience)
-Using a fuel system cleaner with high amounts of PEA in it every oil change could help (To keep injectors are peak efficiency to limit was gets past the rings and ends up recirculated through the PCV)
-Using CRC's valve, intake and turbo cleaner sprayed through the intake can help (Works for my cousins TGDI Veloster that is first generation and known to gunk up valves)
-Taking it out on the highway at 3,000 rpm for 20-30 minutes once a week seems to work for some GDI/TGDI folks here.


Due to the severe duty on my Crosstrek I am going with the 3K OCI per Subaru's recommendation. I've checked into the catch can and haven't yet decided. A fuel system cleaner and turnpike run will become part of my maintenance routine.

Thanks for this info!
cheers3.gif
 
Originally Posted by Virtus_Probi
Originally Posted by StevieC
I can talk to my friends who work at the Subaru dealerships owned by their family in the Greater Toronto Area and ask them if they are seeing problems with your specific model if you want. If it's going to appear it would in our climate here with cold winters.

Failing that you can use these anacdotal things to minimize it:

-Change oil at at severe duty interval in your manual using an oil that meets the manual requirements and that is synthetic.
-Maybe a lower Noack rating on the oil might help (we don't know if this works)
-Maybe a catch can will also help (make sure it has adequate baffling) (I think this works from personal experience)
-Using a fuel system cleaner with high amounts of PEA in it every oil change could help (To keep injectors are peak efficiency to limit was gets past the rings and ends up recirculated through the PCV)
-Using CRC's valve, intake and turbo cleaner sprayed through the intake can help (Works for my cousins TGDI Veloster that is first generation and known to gunk up valves)
-Taking it out on the highway at 3,000 rpm for 20-30 minutes once a week seems to work for some GDI/TGDI folks here.


If you don't mind me asking, did your cuz mod that Veloster Turbo up?
Based upon my limited reading, that may be the most modded vehicle per unit sold that I've heard about...

No it's all stock TGDI 1.6L first generation design. I'll message my friends tonight when I get in from the road.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by CourierDriver
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
How cold does it get in Oklahoma?

low 30s now


So it would need to be much colder than that (say -13F) for a 0w-xx to really make a difference. -22F is the CCS limit for a 5w-xx, but given an oil is allowed to slip a W-rating in service, I used -13F (-25C) instead.
 
I had the same concern with my IS250 and I switched to either 5w20 or 10w30, because they have the lowest noack volatility. Synthetic of course.

The narrower the gap the more uniform the base oil they use, and therefore the less light weight + heavy weight base stock in the mix, and therefore the less light weight to evaporate.

I'm running Pennzoil Ultra old formula, the lowest noack I've seen is around 6-7%, for 5k OCI.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by PandaBear
I'm running Pennzoil Ultra old formula, the lowest noack I've seen is around 6-7%, for 5k OCI.
Using this number how much blow by is there as compared to the NOACK of any oil?
 
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
Originally Posted by CourierDriver
Originally Posted by OVERKILL
How cold does it get in Oklahoma?

low 30s now


So it would need to be much colder than that (say -13F) for a 0w-xx to really make a difference. -22F is the CCS limit for a 5w-xx, but given an oil is allowed to slip a W-rating in service, I used -13F (-25C) instead.



Great points Overkill.

There was one night several years ago that it actually got down to -31°F in Oklahoma... With widespread temps in the -15°F to -20°F... That was after a snowstorm and high pressure over head with clear skies and no wind. Ideal set up for the coldest temps observed in the state in quite awhile.
 
I don't particularly like to resurrect old subjects, but 2 questions have come to mind. First of all, I am switching from Mobil 1 0w30 to Valvoline 5W20 due to its volatility rating of 7.6. I'm also running a bottle of Techron thru the fuel system which I plan to continue concurrent with my 3 month or 3K OCI.. Now the questions:

1) With some gas being blown into the oil, will the Techron in that gas have any effect on the oil?

2) Will the low volatility prevent the burnoff of the gas in the oil as I run the engine?
 
Originally Posted by RetiredSux
I don't particularly like to resurrect old subjects, but 2 questions have come to mind. First of all, I am switching from Mobil 1 0w30 to Valvoline 5W20 due to its volatility rating of 7.6. I'm also running a bottle of Techron thru the fuel system which I plan to continue concurrent with my 3 month or 3K OCI.. Now the questions:

1) With some gas being blown into the oil, will the Techron in that gas have any effect on the oil?

2) Will the low volatility prevent the burnoff of the gas in the oil as I run the engine?


1)
I researched this a while back ...
conclusion:
Not much impact.

Can Techron degrade oil


2)
The gases are recycled through pcv.
 
Find a 5w30 that has HTO-6 spec. 0w30 isnt the best choice. Until you get to -15 I doubt you notice and the 5w will be less volatile and keep that GDi timing chain quiet.
 
I really think the splitting of hairs between good synthetics makes an insignificant difference especially with numerous real world variables at play.

StevieC recently posted of a VW turbo he needed to use CRC GDi cleaner on to clear codes (multiple cylinder misfires usually associated with IVD). Don't these vehicles get the most stout motor oils? It isn't a knock on VW, I'm only using that experience to suggest it really is luck-of-the-draw. I'm positive the vast number of vdubs is just fine.

Staying on top of your maintenance with good synthetic fluids and conservative (7.5k mile) intervals (shorter if blend is considered) should be fine. No one has over thought this GDi thing more than me. It becomes all consuming and unhealthy.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by OilUzer
Originally Posted by RetiredSux
I don't particularly like to resurrect old subjects, but 2 questions have come to mind. First of all, I am switching from Mobil 1 0w30 to Valvoline 5W20 due to its volatility rating of 7.6. I'm also running a bottle of Techron thru the fuel system which I plan to continue concurrent with my 3 month or 3K OCI.. Now the questions:

1) With some gas being blown into the oil, will the Techron in that gas have any effect on the oil?

2) Will the low volatility prevent the burnoff of the gas in the oil as I run the engine?


The gases are recycled through pcv.


I'm trying to mitigate the build-up of carbon on the intake valves of my GDI engine while eliminating gas in the oil. I suppose I can't have both.
 
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