Oil recommendation for my BMW X3?

[TomX3]

Thanks Garak that post was helpful. I've been reading this thread to see if I can figure out what LL-01 really entails. http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1061057

I just got this car. For all of it's life except the last 2 years it's had oil changes at the dealership. Last 2 years no records of where maintenance was done. That makes me want to go with an oil with good cleaning ability which is why I started looking at PU. Plus PU and PP base oil seems very good.

Since I won't be driving this car every day I was considering RP HPS for the synerlec. The issue is that HPS isn't even API or ACEA certified.

The ideal oil for me I think would be PU with Synerlec with a BMW LL01 approval that wouldn't degrade emission components. That doesn't exist so I'm trying to figure out where I want to compromise.

If someone knowledgeable about oils was able to tell me what properties of PU, PP (non euro) and RP HPS differ from what little is known of the LL-01 certification and what that means in the real world that would be helpful.

My backup plan is to just go with an LL01 oil, possibly with a liqui molly engine flush and maybe ceratec.

 

[Garak]

With respect to the Pennzoil products available in North America, particularly the 40 grades, I wouldn't try to differentiate too much between them. Others have been able to follow the matter more closely (actually being able to see the products in the wild), but I suspect at least 50% of the song and dance over the issue was rebranding, not reformulation. Castrol, as I said, has four completely distinct products available to the general public up here, outside of dealership OE oils. There is no confusion. Shell introduces one, yanks another, then relabels it, then pulls it, and introduces something else, in a different viscosity. As far as I'm concerned, Shell is doing themselves and their customers a terrible disservice by not having one A3/B4 product readily and reliably available. I don't care if it's a 5w-40 or a 0w-30. Get the product out there, quit messing with labeling and names and formulations, and leave it out there. No retailer is interested in carrying a product that's going to have a new name and bar code every six months.

So, aside from my little rant, if you choose a Pennzoil LL-01 product, don't be concerned as to whether it's Ultra or Platinum or if it says Euro or not. Grab one and be confident that it's quite suitable.

With respect to ACEA A3/B4, be aware that is self-certified, rather than a formal approval or license. RP is using some dated ACEA specifications, but they are quite open with that. I used their 0w-40 in my old Audi years back, and was happy with it. It's pricing, however, beat M1 0w-40 since the jugs of M1 0w-40 were not yet available here. I never tried the RP 5w-40. Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40 was my best bet on price, by far.

It's hard to say what differences there are between all these oils. We know about RP's Synerlec in 5w-40, which is lacking in RP 0w-40. RP should be primarily PAO, as might M1 0w-40 and Castrol 0w-30 and 0w-40. I wouldn't fuss too much. Get something that you can get reliably and without breaking the bank. I wouldn't be concerned too much with additives, or single aspects of the various LL-01 approved oils.

To add a little fuel to the fire about M1 0w-40's approval, for some reason, the M1 0w-40 data sheets are gone from the ExxonMobil site in the States and Imperial Oil in Canada. And, going to the link directly from a Google search brings up a dead link. That's exceedingly peculiar.

 

[TomX3]

Until I wrap my head more around the other oils I think I'm going to stick to an LL-01 oil. I really do like the HPS oil I use in my small engine, 4-cycle outdoor power equipment. Everything starts on the first or second pull every time. Even my snow blower after it's been sitting for weeks unused.

I have been known to make stuipid mistakes but I distinctlyh remember "european" and MB, VW and porsche approvals with no BMW LL-01. I sent an email to mobil 1 support to see what's going on.

Last time BMW USA announced anything regarding changes to LL-01 I think was last January. I wonder if they decided not to renew their license this year? If anyone sees a bottle check to see if the date code is from 2016. It should start something like XXX16aYY. It was really odd I went to the store with th intention of purchasing it until I didn't see the BMW approval on the package. I flipped it back around and where it was supposed to say "Approved for Mercedes-Benz, BMW" on the first line it only said MB. On the next line it listed the other makers. This I'm not 100% sure about but I think on the front it also said "for European Cars" instead of "European Car Formula". Also I'm pretty sure the data sheet was there for 0w40 recently. It's now missing on exxonmobil.com as you mentioned as well as on mobil.com too linked from here https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/mobil-1/mobil-1 which is what I was looking at recently. Data sheets for other weights are still up.

The plot viscocitens?

 

[Quattro Pete]

The OP is right. I just checked at my local WM. The 1qt m1 0w40 bottles list the BMW spec, but the 5qt jugs dont. Odd.

Probably just an error on mobil's side. In any case, it still lists mb 229.5 which is an even more stringent spec, so i would not worry.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
The OP is right. I just checked at my local WM. The 1qt m1 0w40 bottles list the BMW spec, but the 5qt jugs dont. Odd.

Probably just an error on mobil's side. In any case, it still lists mb 229.5 which is an even more stringent spec, so i would not worry.


Ehh, I doubt it. When this thread was started I looked around the Internet a little and this isn't the first time the spec has been dropped, for whatever reason.

Besides the MB spec, there is always Castrol... Which is a bit cheaper anyway.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Ehh, I doubt it. When this thread was started I looked around the Internet a little and this isn't the first time the spec has been dropped, for whatever reason.

You might be right.

FYI, here is the stock from my local WM. If I read the dates codes correctly, the 1qt bottles are from 2015 while the 5qt jugs are from 2016...

 

[TomX3]

Originally Posted By: kschachn
Ehh, I doubt it. When this thread was started I looked around the Internet a little and this isn't the first time the spec has been dropped, for whatever reason.


What were some of the reasons? Links? I couldn't find anything when I looked.

 

[Leonardo629]

So what's going on? BMW LL-01 is still listed on the website.

 

[SilverC6]

I'd use the M1 before I used the RP with Slinkydink.

If RP met LL-01 and they told the world what Synerlec really was, I might be moved to consider their overpriced offering....Not!

 

[Garak]

Quattro Pete: For what it's worth, both the M1 0w-40 pages in Canada and the U.S. on the web (data sheets were MIA) still show the BMW specification. Some tech probably did this on purpose to stir up BITOG.

 

[BrocLuno]

I'm going out on a limb here as I sold my last Beemer a couple of years ago. But if you are only short tripping this thing a few times a week and then one road trip on the weekend, I'd be looking at shorter change intervals. The short trips contribute to oil degradation ... So I'd be changing at least once a year and maybe twice ...

With that in mind, and tossing the whole Long Life thing on its head, just get whatever oil satisfies the actual lubrication requirements which could be anything from Redline to Pennz Ultra.

You are not tracking it, so you don't need race grade protection, although either of the two I just mentioned would certainly do for that also

 

[TomX3]

Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
I'm going out on a limb here as I sold my last Beemer a couple of years ago. But if you are only short tripping this thing a few times a week and then one road trip on the weekend, I'd be looking at shorter change intervals. The short trips contribute to oil degradation ... So I'd be changing at least once a year and maybe twice ...


I was thinking every 5k miles. Does that sound about right?

Quote:
With that in mind, and tossing the whole Long Life thing on its head, just get whatever oil satisfies the actual lubrication requirements which could be anything from Redline to Pennz Ultra.


The primary reason I posted the question was to get suggestions on which oil will satisfy my actual requirements from members of this board with more knowledge and experience.

 

[ryanm8]

Hmm..... It's a bit concerning that some of the specs are gone from M1 0w40. There is no Nissan GTR "spec" anymore either.

I think I may be switching to Castrol 0w40.

 

[RooflessVW]

I'm only freaking out a little... But I may be switching to Castrol's 0W-40 as well for my small fleet.

I change every year or 10k.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: ryanm8
Hmm..... It's a bit concerning that some of the specs are gone from M1 0w40. There is no Nissan GTR "spec" anymore either.

Well, it's still on the Mobil site, and I suppose one would have to check specifically with Nissan to see if anything new meets the specification. In Canada, Mobil is the service fill anyhow.

We also have to watch labeling. Mobil has made mistakes with labeling before, and I've posted examples. Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40 has stuff printed on the label that is simply baloney. Its label claims non-existent specs and ignores some that it actually meets. Such is life, I guess.

That is where Castrol excels, though. There is no guesswork.

 

[TomX3]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
I'm only freaking out a little... But I may be switching to Castrol's 0W-40 as well for my small fleet.

I change every year or 10k.


There are 3 likely causes on what's going on imo.

1. There was a printing error. Least likely IMO.

2. Something in the latest batch or possibly a reformulation causes it to not meet the BMW LL-01 spec.

3. Poor planning in getting the approval renewed for this year, ongoing negotiations on licensing costs paid to BMW or possibly not wanting to pay the licensing fees anymore.

My money's on 3 but hopefully I hear something back tomorrow to confirm.

I wouldn't go by what's on the website only what's on the bottle you're pouring.

 

[Garak]

Read my post above. That, too, can be problematic.

We also do know, too, that SOPUS doesn't like throwing out labels and hangs to them for a long time. The Mobil Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40 spurious E5 claim lasted into a relabeling, and never shows up anywhere on the Mobil site or data sheets, not to mention that E4 is completely outdated and was never relevant even when Delvac 1 ESP 5w-40 first came out. The following is the new Delvac 1 labeling, closer to the U.S. labeling. Of course, I don't have a picture of the full back with the screwup handy. I should have samples of both bottle designs, with the same error on each.

 

[Leonardo629]

Anyone else notice "FS" on the front label of the 5qt. jug? That's not on the jug of what I currently have in my garage.

 

[ryanm8]

I don't think it's a printing error because BMW was removed from both the front and back label.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Originally Posted By: ryanm8
I don't think it's a printing error because BMW was removed from both the front and back label.

Good point. It does seem deliberate, now that you mentioned it.