Oil for brand new 2012 Subaru WRX

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
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Most Resource Conserving oils will shear in a Subaru turbo. And the Honda HTO-06 spec will only keep your turbo clean when you spin a bearing.

Most oils shear some in all applications.
Suggesting possible engine damage in running the spec' oil for even enthusiastic street use is of course nonsense.

Most OEMs today have fail safe systems in place to protect the engine in the event of dangerously high oil or coolant temp's (vehicle will go into limp mode until things cool down).
I would be surprised if 2012 Subie turbo engined cars don't have this feature.
Aside from this, if one is still concerned that the spec' oil may possibly be too light in the way they use their car, do the proper thing and install an oil pressure gauge. This will tell you how much viscosity reserve you have continuously when your engine is running.
This makes a lot more sense than blindly running a heavier oil just because someone says your turbo engine needs it.

CATERHAM, it's obvious you have not spent much time in any Subaru turbo forums.

Yes there have been failures due to owner negligence and improperly tuned modified cars, but there have been many bearing and turbo failures in unmodified cars running factory recommended 5W-30 at factory recommended 3,750 mile OCI's, with oil changes performed by a dealer. Even after SoA's recommendation/requirement of using synthetic oil.

I've been posting that I'm pleasantly surprised by some of the latest GF-5 uoa's popping up. But a few good $30 uoa's provide no guarantee of spotting impending doom. Been there, done that.

Please do some research before saying something is nonsense. It's obvious that your comments are based soley on your opinion. IMO, you need to use IMO much more often.

-Dennis

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie
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And the Honda HTO-06 spec will only keep your turbo clean when you spin a bearing.

bluesubie, I don't see you using "IMO" in this rather OTT declaration.

One thing I know about high performance cars like the WRX, is that a higher percentage a yahoo's will buy them than buy less performance oriented cars. So you will get more abuse related failures that are hard to prove.
I contend that if you maintain your car properly, even with some spirited driving, the OEM spec' oil will more than meet the lubrication requirements of the engine.

 

[bluesubie]

I should have used a smiley, but I was being sarcastic. Yes, it's hard to prove because you may not get all of the facts in a forum. But I am not only talking about WRX's. I'm talking about soccer moms in Forester and Outback turbos that don't necessarily drive like a "typical WRX" driver (or like me).

When I was getting my blown turbo replaced, the head tech at my dealership agreed with you that I shouldn't need to run thicker than a 5W-30. Alhough, he was completely puzzled as to why it happened and only said it was a "lubrication related failure" (as he showed me the turbo with lots of shaft play).

-Dennis

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie

When I was getting my blown turbo replaced, the head tech at my dealership agreed with you that I shouldn't need to run thicker than a 5W-30. Alhough, he was completely puzzled as to why it happened and only said it was a "lubrication related failure" (as he showed me the turbo with lots of shaft play).-Dennis

I agree with your head tech.
The fact that he was "puzzled" indicates to me that it's not a common problem and he said thicker oil wouldn't have helped.

As far as the actual engine is concerned, if one feels a heavier oil may be necessary for the way they drive, do the proper thing and install an OP gauge first. You'll likely find a heavier oil is not necessary and if on the off chance their are conditions where it could be beneficial, if they are infrequent then you may choose instead to avoid high boost at those times.
The point is you're in control of the situation and you're making a decision based on actual viscometric data.

 

[bluesubie]

No, he was puzzled since most turbo failures that he has seen are due to sludge blocking the turbo oil line screen and mine didn't have any sludge. He actually showed me a turbo from another car that he was working on that failed around the same time as mine.

-Dennis

 

[GumbyJarvis]

Whatever you do, use the Subie Oil Filter.

 

[Govinator3]

What is your reason for saying "use the oem filter" when the new wix filter meets the oem bypass pressure spec?

 

[GumbyJarvis]

Subaru's Bypass is odd, there may be a new Wix with the same specs, but I wouldnt chance getting old stock. Unless the new wix is a new Product Number?

 

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: GumbyJarvis
Unless the new wix is a new Product Number?

Yes.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2624258&page=1

I'm lazy so I just order OEM filters from on-line dealers.

-Dennis

 

[GearheadTool]

Originally Posted By: 92saturnsl2
Originally Posted By: Josh8519
I'm kinda thinking about having the dealership change my oil. This is my first brand new car and it would be nice to have complete service records if I ever need warranty work done.


If you:

a) don't drive the car hard on a routine basis
b) plan on trading the car in at some point and are not concerned about engine longevity in the LONG term
c) aren't 100% intent on having the best wear protection available

If those above statements don't apply to you, go with dealer oil changes or use whatever 5w-30 synthetic oil that your manual recommends.

The service records is a moot point as you can keep receipts for your oil changes just as well as you can keep service receipts from the dealership.

The old adage that "manufacturer knows best, use what they recommend" is something I don't agree with. The manufacturers have a long list of different attributes they have to work with with, some more important than others that ultimately lead up to one thing: a compromise!

Among these are CAFE, emissions, price, availability, engine protection, the list goes on. I can tell you with certainty that engine protection is well down on the list of importance. What good is the best protected engine if the dealer is replacing catalytic converters at 50k? That right there is a compromise.

I'm not suggesting manufacturers load up their oils with a substance that is going to kill their cats prematurely with the goal of increasing engine longevity, but that example serves to make a point. Emissions dictate an oil low in ZDDP to prevent catalytic converter poisoning, a trend which all oils and manufacturers adhere to. That's something we don't have control of.

What we do have control of is choosing an oil that perhaps fares better in engine longevity, but maybe something that doesn't fare as well in some of the other categories such as price or availability, or maybe fuel mileage.

The OEM has to find an oil spec which any Tom, **** or Harry can find on any store shelve. The average customer does not want to pay a mint for an oil change, nor does he want to visit fifteen places trying to find it. The OEM has fuel economy as a major interest too. All these things are why Subaru has settled on a 5w-30 synthetic: Common grade, easy to find, not TOO terribly expensive, great engine protection from today's oils.

Just because they recommend 5w-30 doesn't mean it's the BEST for your engine. If you're willing to sacrifice a tiny margin of fuel economy (think 0.5 - 1.0%), or looking a little harder to find it (ACEA A3 spec for example), and maybe pay a fraction more, you will come away with an oil that protects better than what the manufacturer recommends.

That said, if you drive the car hard at times, I would go with the above recommendation of a ACEA A3 rated oil. There's only a handful of xW-30 out there, the rest are 40 weights or greater. Castrol Syntec 0w-30 is one, a lot of the high mileage synthetic 10w-30's are options (Mobil 1 and Valvoline I know for sure). There may be others. But I think in a turbo application the HTHS rating is something to look out for, and the ACEA A3 spec has a minimum that a lot of 5w-30 and 10w-30's don't make.

If you HAVE to stick with a xw-30 and you want the best, I think Castrol Syntec 0w-30 is a fabulous choice.


I am not so sure about all of this. I think running a thicker than needed oil, particularly in today's engines, is a no-no. In fact, many manuals warn AGAINST using 10W-30 or heavier, though 10W-30 can be used "when 5W-30 is not available." And, of course, we now see the switch to 5-20 recommended and on the cap; surely, going to 0W-20 at some point. For all temperatures.

Your post reads like a cheat sheet for a shop trying to put heavier oil in a vehicle because "that is what they do" or whatever reason For example, when a 5W-20 car like a 2001 or later Honda Civic is told that 20W-50 will be better for it because it is summertime.

I cant tell you how many techs say "Thicker oil protects the engine better" and how 1970s that sounds, when oil sucked (was inferior in quality, lead to Black Death.)

 

[92saturnsl2]

Originally Posted By: GearheadTool
I am not so sure about all of this. I think running a thicker than needed oil, particularly in today's engines, is a no-no. In fact, many manuals warn AGAINST using 10W-30 or heavier, though 10W-30 can be used "when 5W-30 is not available." And, of course, we now see the switch to 5-20 recommended and on the cap; surely, going to 0W-20 at some point. For all temperatures.

Your post reads like a cheat sheet for a shop trying to put heavier oil in a vehicle because "that is what they do" or whatever reason For example, when a 5W-20 car like a 2001 or later Honda Civic is told that 20W-50 will be better for it because it is summertime.

I cant tell you how many techs say "Thicker oil protects the engine better" and how 1970s that sounds, when oil sucked (was inferior in quality, lead to Black Death.)


Where in my post am I advocating running a thicker oil than needed? This topic spans one car, and one car only, a turbo WRX. Nowhere are we talking about Honda Civics, or using thicker oils. You are attempting to turn my post into something it isn't, or you're trying to read between the lines something that's not there.

In fact my recommendation is only toward an ACEA A3 oil, *for this application*. There are plenty 30 weights with this rating, of which I listed several that I would wholehearteldy recommend.

I am all for resource conserving oils, and plan to use them in my car (at least in winter), also a turbo, despite the recommendation *against* anything under a 5w-40/0w-40.

Clearly you drive a Civic or some 5w-20/0w-20 variant; if you want to go spread around your "xW-20 is great and thicker is not" theories, go find a thread to which it will actually apply!

I've had oil analysis prove that thinner oils can protect just fine, even under severe service such as forced induction. I just happen to think that an ACEA A3 rated oil is best for his car. That's my opinion, you're welcome to your own, but don't come on here insisting I'm making suggestions that I'm not.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: 92saturnsl2
I've had oil analysis prove that thinner oils can protect just fine, even under severe service such as forced induction. I just happen to think that an ACEA A3 rated oil is best for his car. That's my opinion, you're welcome to your own, but don't come on here insisting I'm making suggestions that I'm not.


An ACEA A3 likely won't meet GF-5, which might be a warranty concern. Aside from that little detail, I agree that an ACEA A3 oil, particularly in the 30 grade, is far from too thick for the vehicle. Take a look at something like Delvac Elite 222 0w-30, for instance. It doesn't list its HTHS, but considering it's an HDEO, it's HTHS would be in the neighbourhood of 3.5, and its KV 100 gives us the idea it's a thick 30. Then it's VI is 176 and SA of 0.99. Aside from not being GF-5 (probably cannot be certified due to phosphorous and perhaps too thick) or being an actual A3 oil, what's not to like?