oil for a car that burns oil?

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MO

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My girlfriend drives a '98 Prelude with the H22A4 engine. This engine burns oil. Yes, I know there are people out there who have H22As with 10 million miles and have never burned a drop, but in general, most H22As burn oil. My girlfriend's car is no exception; it uses about 1qt/1000mi. Hers has about 120k miles on it.

I believe most of the oil being burned is getting past the rings. This seems to be typical of these cars, and I see no puffs of smoke on deceleration or startup, so it's probably not the valve seals. These engines have notoriously large clearances on the rings, and they have the FRM cylinder liners which some suggest may tend to trap oil.

Given that oil is getting past the rings, what oil is good to use for minimizing the burn-off? I assume we want (1) a heavier oil, (2) an oil with a higher flashpoint, (3) an oil with lots of moly, (4) anything else?

Given these criteria, which is a good oil to use? We're in Boston, and I'd like to stick with a 5W-30 for those cold nights (or a 0W-30, but GC is a bit expensive for a car that burns this much oil and has its oil refreshed this often anyway).

Also, any idea on whether an Auto-RX treatment would be of any help? The car has always had regular oil changes, but usually with dealer-supplied bulk oil. I don't know how likely there is to be sludge. I plan to send off a sample for analysis when I change the oil, but I'm trying to figure out what to put in there in the meantime. We've got some Castrol Syntec Blend 5W-30 on hand.

Thanks for any thoughts,

Matt
 
quote:
Originally posted by MO:



Also, any idea on whether an Auto-RX treatment would be of any help?
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I think it would most definitely help! Auto-rx will clean very well and so then the rings seal better, so consumption should go way down.
 
Actually, come to think of it, if you have an empty container of the same exact kind of oil as you used to fill your car originally, and you never left the cap off of the old container, that would work too. I've done it before and it produced results completely in line with my trend.
 
I second the HDEO (15W40). Delo is good, I also like Rotella.

These oils may clean your engine up a bit, and I've cut oil consumption to nil in my high mileage '93 Ford Escort simply by using HDEO's. I've had good luck with Delo and Rotella. My engine used to use a quart every 1K. But in the warmer months, I run the 15W40 and have no issues with consumption.

In the winter, just go back to a lighter oil and plan on topping it off more regularly.

There's no reason you can't run the 15W40 this summer and early fall.

Dan
 
Clean the engine with a couple half-bottle treatments of engine flush using Delo, Delvac or Rotella 15W-40 in two short OCIs covering the end of September... then either switch to a High Mileage oil from Castrol, Pennzoil, Valvoline, Mobil... etc... or use any brand with a bottle of Valvoline Maxlife Oil Treatment.
 
We had a 94Chrysler Lebaron 189k miles with the infamous smoker Mitsu 3 liter v-6 motor that eventually burned about 1qt every 900-1100 miles depending on a number of factors including how old the crankcase oil was. I had switched to Amsoil synthetic 15w-40 in the summer and Amsoil or M-1 10w-40 in the winter to cut burning. I agree that having to add synth oil was an unnecessary expense so often at 1-2qts/month. It was probably worth getting another motor for $400-$500 considering how long we kept the car, 3yr. Using dino oil such as 20w-50 only worked for 1-2k miles before the motor embarrasingly smoked like the Batmobile from a stop. Even adding thickeners like Lucas oil additive to cut consumption/smoking, was very temporary at best-1500 miles if lucky, before severely smoking again. I did ARX this motor at 150k miles but the most significant decrease in burnoff past rings/ valve seals was when I ran synthetic, whichever happened to be the best buy at the time. Amsoil advertises in their oil benefits/characteristics that it is blended to resist getting past rings as well or better than any oil out there, and speaking visually for tailpipe smoking, there is truth to that IMO.
crushedcar.gif
 
This is what I've done since joining this site several years ago, in four vehicles. The newest was two years old with 40m; the next was 24-yrs old with about 75m; the next was 32-yrs old with 130m; the last, four years and 94m.

I have converted all cars owned (and those of a few family members) to synthetic since 1982. Each of those cars/trucks had over 100m (a few, much more), all were "oil-burning" V8's.

Of both groups of cars the flush (nowadays with LUBE CONTROL LC-20; see "Molasoak" [approx] under search), the synthetic oil, a major tune up including pulling the intake for cleaning, overhauling the carb (except on two in first group), etc; all resulted in either reduced and/or stabilized oil consumption. That is, the oil consumption never got any worse. Whether pulling an 8000-lb trailer, or idling in traffic its whole life.

Were that Honda mine, I'd first take advantage of one of the DYSON ANALYSIS offers to do a UOA. The same day I sent off the sample I'd Mola-soak it, tune it, run the prescribed TWO Auto-Rx treatments with a dino oil, and then change it to REDLINE coupled with a low-restriction, heavy-duty, extended-service synthetic media oil filter (BALDWIN HPG or other), treat it with LC-20 and run FUEL POWER FP-60 in the fuel tank per directions.

These products work. They work very well, and within 4000-miles that Honda ought to be just fine as to consumption; again, it ought to stabilize at the least.

I'd certainly check the Honda boards to see about other issues with that year and model, but BITOG is the place for fluids advice, ESPECIALLY internal engine cleanliness.

Getting Terry to read that UOA, well, you'll be miles ahead in prolonging engine life. And have an early warning of any contaminants out of spec with, again, car make and model in re miles/time.

Money in the bank.
 
From what I understand, this isn't an oil burning engine. This is an engine that is 'not immune' to poor maintenance like other Hondas. Sure, we can blame the engineering for not being immune to negligence or we can overmaintain it and not worry!
You need to clean the engine out and start a religious maintenance program with quality fluids.
This would be a good candidate for valve cover/oilpan removal and inspection. Any sludge revealed would point at a problem other then the engine's engineering.

Store bought quick 5-10 minute flush, boutique slow cleaning(like autorx), or oil additives(like LC/Lubegard/Rislone/Marvel.....) can be used to clean out the engine.

Change the oil with a quality synthetic. Use the 0w30, 0w40, or 5w40 from Castrol/Mobil1....
For topping off, since the name brand synth is too expensive, use a store brand(no name) or on sale synthetics. Rotella-t synthetic 5w40 is also ~$3.50 a quart at wallyworld.
 
Don't use any HDEO oil, you'll regret it. You'll have to clean the spark plugs on a weekly basis and more soot buildup than you can get rid of. Just get the cheapest store brand oil you can find probably in 10w-40 weight, add a quart when it needs it, change the oil filter on a 3k basis and don't even worry about changing the oil. I put HDEO in my oil-burning aspire about the same usage and fouled the plugs on a 500 mile basis, and HDEO just plain down right stinks when it's combusted. Never know you could still get another 80k out of it.
 
H22s in particular, and all DOHC VTEC cylinder headed Hondas consume oil by design to an extent greater than most other engines. I agree with Eric on not using 15w-40 but because these engines don't like thick oil like this. Just my opinion of course. I personally would buy Lube Control, start using that per the instructions, and do an overnight piston soak when you 1st get your order. Maybe a 2 night piston soak; add a bit more on the second night and turn the engine over by hand a few more times. That should de-gum the rings IF they are gummed, which they probably are to an extent. Then, use a 5w-30 or 10w-30 of your choosing, synthetic or dino. Maybe 5w-30 winter, 10w-30 summer.
 
Drew,

What do mean by "consume oil by design to an extent greater than most other engines"

I hear this alot. And I understand it to be true. But can you give me some more info

I own an Integra GSR with 100,000 miles. The motor runs as strong as ever but it does consume oil. Right now I'm at about 3/4 of a quart every 3K.

quote:
Originally posted by Drew99GT:
H22s in particular, and all DOHC VTEC cylinder headed Hondas consume oil by design to an extent greater than most other engines. I agree with Eric on not using 15w-40 but because these engines don't like thick oil like this. Just my opinion of course. I personally would buy Lube Control, start using that per the instructions, and do an overnight piston soak when you 1st get your order. Maybe a 2 night piston soak; add a bit more on the second night and turn the engine over by hand a few more times. That should de-gum the rings IF they are gummed, which they probably are to an extent. Then, use a 5w-30 or 10w-30 of your choosing, synthetic or dino. Maybe 5w-30 winter, 10w-30 summer.
Click to expand...
 
I don't know exactly what design feature causes oil consumption in them. I think it has to do with how the cylinders are honed and they use a slightly larger ring gap. They're designed to draw a bit more oil past the rings for high rpm lubrication. Another factor is simply rpms. These engines redline at over 8,000 rpms, so your turning over 4 grand on the highway cruising. That in and of itself will increase oil consumption. By the way, 3/4 to 1 quart per 3,000 miles is EXCELLENT for a B18C!
 
I just searched Hondatech. Oil consumption and Preludes go hand in hand, except for the A2 closed deck pre 97 Ludes. One common theme I found was the cam seals; they apparently are notorious for leaking. Check around the timing belt cover on the left side of the engine for seepage. You may have to pop the cover to inspect it.
 
MO my name is tuong and I too have a 5th gen honda prelude. I have been on this topic for years on trying to figure out if I have a problem with my car.
I tried just about everything except auto x. if you do use that please tell me how it goes. I doubt it would work though, sometimes Auto x exposes some other leaks according to some people on this site. There are various reasons why our oil leaks but it is very common and there nothing wrong with it unless you are burning about a quart every 1000 miles.
Many prelude burn oil. THe only people that dont burn oil are the people taht dont drive the car hard. Use vtec. If you drive like a grandma, uw il not burn oil. Vtec burn oil. S2000 manual says its fine to burn oil. Dont worry about it. seriously, THe main reason I am on this site is because of oil burning.
Btw. I hear castrol syn is garbage. MObil 1 is common oil burner. I use Amsoil 10-30 summer and 5-30 winter. It still burns oil. If you dont drive hard, u can use conventional and the burning will be very minimal. I heard kendal is good conventional.
Use mobile one filter too btw. AMsoil if you can get it. if you dont want to pay that much , use purator. I been on this site monitoring stuff for a while. oil burning is normal unless u are burning about half a quart ever week depending on how u drive.
best regards
fellow luder
 
Thanks for your feed back. My Integra GSR hits VTEC at about 6K RPMs and then Redlines at 8100K. I always have figured this is part of the reason for the oil burn off. That is alot of RPMs. Problem is the car doesn't move unless you get it up there
smile.gif


The cam seal seems to be a problem on these motors. After and auto-rx treatment mine started leaking so I replaced it when I had the timing belt done.

I got behind an S2000 once and this thing was burning oil like crazy. He gunned it when the light turned green and there was black smoke flying out of the back of it. I'm guessing it was modified or there was something worng with it. Way too much smoke.


quote:
Originally posted by Drew99GT:
I don't know exactly what design feature causes oil consumption in them. I think it has to do with how the cylinders are honed and they use a slightly larger ring gap. They're designed to draw a bit more oil past the rings for high rpm lubrication. Another factor is simply rpms. These engines redline at over 8,000 rpms, so your turning over 4 grand on the highway cruising. That in and of itself will increase oil consumption. By the way, 3/4 to 1 quart per 3,000 miles is EXCELLENT for a B18C!
Click to expand...
 
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