Oil Filtration vs Flow Opinon Needed.

[SilverStreak]

I've always used K&N oil filters and my UOAs shows good wear numbers. When I did my last oil change I used a Puralator PureOne filer, known for its filtration rather than flow since I didn't have a K&N on hand.

My friend who has the same car (Honda S2000) has a S/C on his car and uses the PureOne. On his last UOA, we had the similar wear numbers except for alumninum. I had 4ppm compared to his 31ppm. His 10W30 oil also thinned to a 5W30 weight where mine remained at a 10W30 weight. Can the supercharger be the cause of the high aluminum or the more restrictive filter?

I have a K&N on hand now, should I just change back to the K&N? I've had the PureOne on for about a week. Oil pressure is pretty similar between the two filters from what my oil pressure gauge tells me but I think my engine sounds a bit louder with the PureOne on.

 

[Al]

With that high of Al it might be his silicon (air filter/leaking intake)-check that. I think the turbo or maybe all the dirt/silicon could break down his oil. I believe superchargers see higher lead. (I could be wrong) I like the K&N I think they flow better and its probably important for the Turbo. I'd keep using the K&N. Can you post his UOA??

 

[SilverStreak]

Here is his analysis numbers.
Mobil 1 10W 30 with PureOne filter
Vortech S/C and Vortech Air filter.
His Silicon number would probably result from him resealing his oilpan when he had to take it off to tap a oil return line for the S/C.

Sample No WC-616213
Sample Date 8/12/2003
Unit Age 35000k
Time on Fluid 5000k
Time on Filter 5000k
Fluid Maint. Changed
Filter Maint. Changed
Fluid MO462
Iron (Fe) 14
Chromium (Cr) 0.8
Nickel (Ni) 0.2
Titanium (Ti) 1.3
Silver (Ag) 0.2
Aluminum (Al) 31
Lead (Pb) 0.8
Copper (Cu) 2.7
Tin (Sn) 0
Silicon (Si) 31
Sodium (Na) 11
Potassium (K) 0
Boron (B) 195
Barium (Ba) 0.3
Molybdenum (Mo) 78
Magnesium (Mg) 161
Calcium (Ca) 3040
Phosphorus (P) 794
Zinc (Zn) 1063
Sulfur (S) 1940
Manganese (Mn) 87
Vanadium (V) 0.4
Fuel(%) 1.1
Oxidation(PA) 68
Nitratrion(PA) 46
Sulfation(PA) 65
Kv@100°C 9.6
White Metal NONE
Babbitt NONE
Precipitate NONE
Silt NONE
Debris NONE
Dirt NONE
Appearance NORML
Odor NORML
H2O(Emul) NEG
H2O(Free) NEG

 

[TR3-2001SE]

I would bet he has a K&N air filter on that supercharger. High silicon numbers. Still An excellent UOA.

 

[Idrinkmotoroil]

I think I posted something in one other post of yours, but 9000 rpms is a ton of revs, if your lacking just a touch of oil flow at that rpm its bad news. Have you checked your oil pressure at high rpms ?, not sure how accurate the oil pressure guage is but it may be worth comparing. Plus you never know what the oil filter is doing, is it in bypass mode at those high rpms ?.

I was just watching the speedvision cup race in mid-Ohio this weekend on TV, the Mugen RSX won the race. After the race they were commenting on their earlier motor problems, explaining that in previous races they were losing oil pressure on long high speed curves and that resulted in engine damage, but they've since corrected the problem and they ran flawlessly at Mid-Ohio. Your s2000 motor is nothing short of a race motor transplanted in a passenger vehicle, oil flow is critical. I'll swear by Honda oil filters any day of the week, but we've heard that K&N filters are excellent performers as well (but I've not seen any real proof of that).

Joey

 

[SilverStreak]

I took the PureOne out and put my usual K&N back tonight. The engine feel more free with it back in. Only 300 kms on the PureOne so hopefully it didn't result in any extra wear. We'll see in my next UOA.

Anything above 4000 rpm and both oil filters will give 600kPa, which is near 87psi I believe. At 9000rpm the oil pressure is near 87-89psi range.

I personally think the K&N is better than the North American OEM Honda filters. The JDM Honda filters made by Tenex and HAMP are another story.

I'll get another sample from my friend's setup and then will give him a K&N filter to use, then we will have the story of which filter is better for this high reving engine.

 

[michaelv]

Hi SilverStreak, I have a new Honda Pilot, based on your Oil filter comments, should I use a K&N filter instead of a Honda OEM? I know K&N are good but, I heard that Honda OF are also good. thanks in advance..mv

 

[SilverStreak]

Yes, I would recommend the K&N. They are a bit pricey but well worth it. It has probably the best mix of flow and filtration.

If you can locate HAMP (Honda Aftermarket Performance) filter from Japan, use those but the K&N is easy to get at Canadian tire or Partsource.

 

[Chris A]

quote:

---

Originally posted by SilverStreak:
I took the PureOne out and put my usual K&N back tonight. The engine feel more free with it back in.

---

You guys crack me up.

Your oil pump is pumping the same amount of oil with either filter. That oil is either going to go through the engine (via the filter media or bypass valve) or bypass back to the sump. No way is that going to make your engine "more free".

 

[MarkC]

Also, according to someone at Purolator I emailed, the PureOne has less than 3psi delta(SAE testing) over the filter area, the idea of it being restrictive is not true. And There's a graph showing flow rates for several filters, and PureOne flowed better than any others on the chart except AC.

 

[SilverStreak]

The PureOne didn't fare to well in Bob's oil pressure test. It had the largest drop off in pressure.

I don't kno but I can feel the difference in the engine sound and revs

 

[MRC01]

quote:

---

Originally posted by SilverStreak:
The PureOne didn't fare to well in Bob's oil pressure test. It had the largest drop off in pressure.

I don't kno but I can feel the difference in the engine sound and revs

---

The human mind is a powerful thing.

 

[cangreylegend]

Generally if you spend a lot of time at high rpms, and WOT, you might be better off with a high flow since the high flow that the pump generates at high rpms could cause a restrictive filter's bypass to open.

If you just cruise around, either is fine.

 

[MarkC]

quote:

---

Originally posted by SilverStreak:
The PureOne didn't fare to well in Bob's oil pressure test. It had the largest drop off in pressure.

I don't kno but I can feel the difference in the engine sound and revs

---

Bob's test wasn't carried out under SAE guidlines, nor was it very controlled. I'm not saying it's not useful information, but there needs to be more work done. If you believe the oil pressure gauge on your instrument panel, and you don't see any big difference in pressure when you switch filters, what would you conclude?
BTW, the Mobil1 rep says that filter has 1% drop in pressure. So. What will you believe? Of course. Mobil and Purolator aren't going to admit that their porducts might restrict flow, but neither are they going to market something that will open them to some expensive lawsuits for damaging engines.