NYSE Plans to move Chicago operations to Texas

And it amazes me people from places like CA, NY, IL can't really see the markets free hand moving. I guess living in denial is their strategy.
 
The NYSE President today called Texas "The market leader in fostering a pro-buisness atmosphere".
Gov. Abbott just said "Texas will now become the Financial capital of America".

They are both right. In fact, Texas already has the largest number of NYSE listings in the nation, as it is now.
 
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gfh77665 said:
The NYSE President today called Texas "The market leader in fostering a pro-buisness atmosphere".
Gov. Abbott just said "Texas will now become the Financial capital of America".

They are both right. In fact, Texas already has the largest number of NYSE listings, as it is now.
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Would that include the business that makes SpaceX rocket parts land on people's homes and cars for miles in the flight path when they explode?
 
gfh77665 said:
Meanwhile in Houston:

https://www.tmc.edu/news/2019/07/se...d-as-best-hospitals-by-u-s-news-world-report/

our world renowned Med Center keeps on growing and getting better. Wealthy people come from all across the USA and the globe to get the very best care and highest skilled physicians on the planet.
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I never said there were no hospitals in Houston. I said that there are entire counties in Texas where there's no hospital in the county and in fact, there may not be one for 4 counties. I don't believe we have that problem in Illinois because we have safety net hospitals if there's nothing else.

Since Texas chose to have so many people with no insurance, they get freestanding ERs that don't help the uninsured, and they put all the hospitals in bankruptcy that are even at risk of being near uncompensated care. They chose to do this. So yes, if you're very rich in Texas you may get some healthcare.

The hospital failures are not only avoidable, they're basically being engineered and the problem is not stabilizing yet and won't until you need a city like Houston to have a hospital anywhere nearby.

I'm proud to live somewhere where people are generally decent enough to make sure this doesn't happen. It's a values thing.

I don't need to go to Texas to get healthcare. Illinois has some of the best hospitals in the country and a strong framework in place to protect the rights and dignity of the patients.

Texans, and this is my general observation of them, consider the American flag to be a flag of convenience. They want everything that this country has to offer them including the single market and a strong currency, but at the same time they consider themselves to be Americans only if they're getting their way and when they hit a speed bump in that department, they suddenly talk of "leaving", and it just goes back and forth, and it's ridiculous. And Illinoisans consider ourselves Americans first and foremost and don't abandon the principles of our great nation when it falls on dark times.

This behavior of acting like they've collected a "scalp" with the stock exchange just really goes to demonstrate my point. It's just not terribly helpful.
 
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BaronHK said:
"Amazing. Every word of what you just said was wrong." -Luke Skywalker

This isn't as significant as it might look. For starters, the stock exchange in Chicago has seen relatively little use as far as trading volume for many years. The Chinese were interested in paying a very modest sum about ten years ago just to get the license to trade securities from it.

Expect another wave of "the death of Illinois" from the usual people, however, the economy of Chicago alone could roll over and smack Indiana like an insect several times over. And that's just the city, not the rest of the Cook County or State of Illinois.

They're basically a dumping ground of low wage employment that people mainly take so they can get assistance. Indiana's entire GDP is comparable to North Korea, while just the city limits of Chicago GDP (just the city limits) is the size of Switzerland's.

Everyone you hear complain about Illinois a lot doesn't live here, and couldn't afford to. It's like How I Met Your Mother. You know the rant about New York and people who say they're from there when they're not, also applies to my case because nobody knows where anything is in Indiana except maybe Indianapolis. People ask what part of Indiana I came from and nobody knows. So I say "It's sort of near Fort Wayne." and they don't know where that is either.

"Saying you're a New Yorker when you're not. Because, this is the greatest city in the world and you have to earn the right to call yourself a New Yorker. So why don't you girls crawl into the open sewer pipe you call the Holland tunnel and flush yourselves back to "Pretty much New York"? Because I will do a lot to [redacted], but I am not going to New Jersey!"

That's sort of how I feel about living where I do. I don't want to even go to Indiana because things in Illinois tend to be more like Indiana was 30 years ago before it all failed and they started tearing houses down and not replacing them with anything, in my home town of Marion.

When Marion, Indiana had RCA and a huge workforce at General Motors, and twice the population it does now, it looked much better. Unemployment was super low. Now you can literally get on YouTube and there's numerous videos of people driving around and gawking at how it's the middle of the day and nobody's even out driving, all the stores are closed, half the residential areas are where houses once stood, and the malls on the bypass are completely dead. And that's generally what the past 20 years has done for the rest of the State.

Tax cuts only matter if you can find a good job, otherwise they don't matter. If there's no paycheck there's already no taxes, and that's the unfortunate reality most Hoosiers who remain are facing. That and a major drug trade problem, and that's sad to see. The rest of the State's economy is heavily dependent on agriculture and Social Security checks. It wasn't at all like this when I was young. This is what they've done to my home. Most of it in the last 20 years or so.

If tax and regulatory cuts are magic for the economy, why hasn't it helped Indiana? Why is literally the only reason anyone relocates there the $7 minimum wage and getting to use their environment like an open sewer? Like Hoist Liftruck saying they liked the $7.

Texas is not getting a major deal here with the NYSE. Chicago won't really notice it missing.

What we have in Cook and the surrounding counties is a very very rich area, generally speaking. I am in Lake County, which is the fourth wealthiest county on a per capita basis, in the entire country.

I would not move to Texas if you paid me to. Why would I? So I can freeze to death with no electricity AND still somehow open a $50,000 electric bill from something called a "Griddy" when their nutty electric grid collapses?

In the Great State of Illinois, the electric goes down for maybe a total of 10 minutes per year over the last ten years, on average, during a freak thunderstorm. Sometimes it just goes "blip" and it's back on again, because we have a reliable electric grid that we've made investments into and not Bitcoin miners and ERCOT.

So I can live four counties from the nearest hospital? No, wait, it would be because of their community property laws which state that if one spouse has so much debt that they have to file bankruptcy, they take the other spouse into bankruptcy too even if that spouse has no debt.

I went to Texas a couple times, and both times they had a freak snowstorm and they were dumping....beach sand on the freeways, which was causing another hazard, clouds of sand, while people slipped and crashed anyway because they don't know how to drive on it.

One guy at a whataburger said he liked my coat. Asked me where I got it. "Chicago".

I was the only one there dressed for foul weather.

We're a tougher bunch up here. We have grit.

One day it wasn't even that cold. Only in the 30s, and water pipes were exploding all over Houston and my ex's step-dad was a plumber and he was working major overtime probably charging all those people out the butt because they don't build their houses well. So, when you do something wrong the first time you get to pay more to fix it later.

View attachment 263178
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I grew up in IL. I’m never going to move back. Ever.

My parents are moving here once my Grandma is gone.
 
svtrit said:
I grew up in IL. I’m never going to move back. Ever.

My parents are moving here once my Grandma is gone.
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I've floated the idea of a "Stay in Illinois" bonus on the State Pension System.

They should change it so that your earned benefit is half what the current pension amount is, and if you stay in Illinois you get the earned benefit amount plus a bonus of the equal amount. If you take up residence in another State, you lose that half of your pension.

It would make sense. Stay here and support our economy or have fun watching your pension get torn in half and have fun in Florida or Texas or wherever you go.

It would improve a lot of things, including the actuarial outlook on the pension funds.
 
BaronHK said:
I never said there were no hospitals in Houston. I said that there are entire counties in Texas where there's no hospital in the county and in fact, there may not be one for 4 counties. I don't believe we have that problem in Illinois because we have safety net hospitals if there's nothing else.
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You don't even know what you posted. The words in your post are: "Texas has no hospitals or electric".

Lets refocus on the NYSE moving to TX. That is the subject.
 
svtrit said:
I grew up in IL. I’m never going to move back. Ever.

My parents are moving here once my Grandma is gone.
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I am sorry it came to that for you but you are not alone. Illinois has lost population ten years in a row from 2013 to 2023.
Iowa is a great place to be.
 
gfh77665 said:
I am sorry it came to that for you but you are not alone. Illinois has lost population ten years in a row from 2013 to 2023.
Iowa is a great place to be.
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We actually have no idea who lives where.

I remember reading about Census workers in Indiana saying that they were "making up people" who don't even exist in houses that were empty.

Nobody even tried to count me or my spouse in Illinois, or mail us a form. I had to know to go to the Census website and fill out the form.

The 2020 Census was completely bungled and I think a lot of the result was manufactured. They undercounted Illinois by at least 2% apparently, so that means we lost a House seat we shouldn't have. When they're in there screwing things up, it has real effects. There's more people in Illinois than the Census bureau said.

Just going by the undercount there are at least a few hundred thousand they didn't even count, most likely. Indicating a generally stable population and a crappy Census.

I do hope that the Census Bureau in 2030 is in better shape to perform a legitimate and actual count of the population.

I remember when they were so aggressive about counting people that first they mailed you a form and then if you didn't mail it back they did everything short of breaking down your front door with an axe to get you to talk to them. They came back out several times until you talked to them.

My fear is that they'll basically pull another one where they barely even try to reach out to anyone and "Who even knows what's going on in there?" and then we get these "results" showing the population is growing "where they want it to be".

When they didn't even mail us anything, it just sort of didn't do anything to help alleviate my suspicions that this is what was going on.
 
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Aka NYSE got a bigger deal in Texas. A lot of big companies are moving main office out of downtown Chicago and into the suburbs like Oak Brook and Naperthrill anyways. That along with it being easier to get a business loan to build or own your own building versus getting a loan to redo a floor on an existing office building.

IL is still trying to support a lot of legacy department companies. Sears, Macy's, etc....alot of corruption between officials, companies, and unions.

Data centers have been opening though. Considering we have the largest amount of nuclear power in the states.
 
ArrestMeRedZ said:
I think if Texas was Indiana some of your posts might make sense in this thread.
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While the attitude of both States seems very similar on the surface as of late, Indiana has been laser focused on salting the Earth so that nothing ever grows again as far as desirable business or gainful employment opportunities, while I stipulate to the fact that Texas still has an economy.

:)
 
Pew said:
Aka NYSE got a bigger deal in Texas. A lot of big companies are moving main office out of downtown Chicago and into the suburbs like Oak Brook and Naperthrill anyways. That along with it being easier to get a business loan to build or own your own building versus getting a loan to redo a floor on an existing office building.

IL is still trying to support a lot of legacy department companies. Sears, Macy's, etc....alot of corruption between officials, companies, and unions.

Data centers have been opening though. Considering we have the largest amount of nuclear power in the states.
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Sears? /me checks to see if he woke up in the past....nope..

Sears has been dead for a long time. The only thing left with a presence here as a legacy of Sears is Discover Financial. They have a major presence. Capital One says their plan is to leave that alone and, in fact, expand their presence in Illinois. So there's that.

Macy's? Not doing well. Granted. But...Chicago isn't going anywhere and it makes me laugh when it's this constant churn of "Oh my God, Hoist Liftruck left because of the $7 minimum wage in Indiana and took 9 jobs! Chicago is finished!"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Illinois

"The economy of Illinois is the fifth largest by GDP in the United States and one of the most diversified economies in the world."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_U.S._states_and_territories_by_GDP

Nominal GDP per capita in Illinois is #12 in America at $90,449, placing it #12, and Texas is #16 at $86,987.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Illinois#/media/File:Illinois_counties_by_GDP_(2021).png

As you can see by the graph, most of the counties in Illinois aren't worth much to the State's economy, by GDP.

Downstate Illinois is good for farms and power plants, and not much else. Farmland doesn't really add much to GDP. Agrarian economies are poor.

Anyway, on a per capita GDP basis, Illinois is significantly wealthier than Texas. If the downstate Illinois counties left and joined Indiana, they'd only make Indiana even poorer, and it's already #30 by GDP per capita at $68,530.

Anyway, my point stands that lower taxes and lower regulation are not a silver bullet.

If they were, Indiana would be on a trend upward in median income and per capita GDP, whereas Indiana has actually been lowering taxes and regulations for decades and the minimum wage hasn't increased in almost 20 years, and they're getting poorer every single year.

The comparison is important because people seem to be arguing that Texas is doing well simply because it's low tax and hand-off when it comes to business. If that's the case, then why are California, Washington, Illinois, New York, and others, significantly more wealthy than Texas by the metrics, and nearly 1/3rd more than Indiana by those metrics?
 
BaronHK said:
I never said there were no hospitals in Houston. I said that there are entire counties in Texas where there's no hospital in the county and in fact, there may not be one for 4 counties. I don't believe we have that problem in Illinois because we have safety net hospitals if there's nothing else.

Since Texas chose to have so many people with no insurance, they get freestanding ERs that don't help the uninsured, and they put all the hospitals in bankruptcy that are even at risk of being near uncompensated care. They chose to do this. So yes, if you're very rich in Texas you may get some healthcare.

The hospital failures are not only avoidable, they're basically being engineered and the problem is not stabilizing yet and won't until you need a city like Houston to have a hospital anywhere nearby.

I'm proud to live somewhere where people are generally decent enough to make sure this doesn't happen. It's a values thing.

I don't need to go to Texas to get healthcare. Illinois has some of the best hospitals in the country and a strong framework in place to protect the rights and dignity of the patients.

Texans, and this is my general observation of them, consider the American flag to be a flag of convenience. They want everything that this country has to offer them including the single market and a strong currency, but at the same time they consider themselves to be Americans only if they're getting their way and when they hit a speed bump in that department, they suddenly talk of "leaving", and it just goes back and forth, and it's ridiculous. And Illinoisans consider ourselves Americans first and foremost and don't abandon the principles of our great nation when it falls on dark times.

This behavior of acting like they've collected a "scalp" with the stock exchange just really goes to demonstrate my point. It's just not terribly helpful.
Click to expand...
Time for a break, HK.

You’ve cherry-picked the data on Texas and turned it into another biased, parochial screed.
 
BaronHK said:
Sears? /me checks to see if he woke up in the past....nope..

Sears has been dead for a long time. The only thing left with a presence here as a legacy of Sears is Discover Financial. They have a major presence. Capital One says their plan is to leave that alone and, in fact, expand their presence in Illinois. So there's that.

Macy's? Not doing well. Granted. But...Chicago isn't going anywhere and it makes me laugh when it's this constant churn of "Oh my God, Hoist Liftruck left because of the $7 minimum wage in Indiana and took 9 jobs! Chicago is finished!
Click to expand...

There's Sears has a floor in my office building It could be for one employee, who knows...but it's there.

My point is, we as the state taxpayers are still paying on the tax breaks given to these large department stores that shuttered not too long after.
 
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