New Motorcraft Oil Meeting New Ford Specification

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All it takes is looking at the spec sheet on the 10w30 in question, or the back of the oil bottle. if it is also SN rated, it will have the low Phosphorous. The Schaeffer CK-4's on the approved list for Ford are not SN rated, so that seems to be the key in figuring out if a CK-4 10w30 has the higher phosphorous. I have noticed several CK-4's that aren't even listing gasoline engine ratings on their spec sheets now. That seems to be a pattern in this CK-4 game. No claim to gas engine rating and it will probably have the higher phosphorous.
 
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
$10,000 engine


That's probably low for a diesel engine or a Mustang engine from Ford tbph


$11,695 for a new 6.7 drop in without accessories.

$64.95 for a new 5.0 longblock, they don't have pricing for a drop in.

FWIW the 6.7s are a lot cheaper than the 6.4 and 6.0 drop in engines.


How much for one of the hi-po engines that specs 5W50 though?

IIRC it was about $15k when my friend needed a 6.0L and she worked at a dealer parts department, same as you
smile.gif
 
Call it whatever you want but a DPF/POC/DOC/SCR are all simply a metal substrate catalyst in various different designs and compositions. SCR adds(as you call it) a DEF injector with a ceramic/precious metal substrate... Catalyst. It stands for Selective Catalytic Reduction..... Fancy name for basically a catalytic converter.

So yes it does apply.

Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
The catalytic converter thing really doesn't apply anyway. The main reason for the CK-4 changes was to protect DEF units and DPF units. The cost for those replacements make catalytic converters look like buying stuff on sale at Dollar General. Since the vast majority of CK-4 oil are going into commercial applications, it makes sense to have oil formulations that are more emission component friendly. A DPF filter alone (just filter, not the whole DPF unit) on a heavy commercial vehicle can easily meet or exceed $3000, not counting labor or tax. And the price goes up from there on SCR units and complete DPF units.
 
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Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
Originally Posted By: Ethan1
Originally Posted By: A_Harman
$10,000 engine


That's probably low for a diesel engine or a Mustang engine from Ford tbph


$11,695 for a new 6.7 drop in without accessories.

$64.95 for a new 5.0 longblock, they don't have pricing for a drop in.

FWIW the 6.7s are a lot cheaper than the 6.4 and 6.0 drop in engines.


How much for one of the hi-po engines that specs 5W50 though?

IIRC it was about $15k when my friend needed a 6.0L and she worked at a dealer parts department, same as you
smile.gif



That sounds about right for a 6.0L. My 5.0L specs 5W50 and it is no more than a regular 5.0L, actually arguably deficient because it does not have oil piston squirters.

A 5.2L in the new GT-350 is 20,298.33 and the GT-350R is 25,985.78.
 
Originally Posted By: RLS
Can we get a picture of the back of the bottle showing the API rating?
Here you go....notice anything conspicuously missing from both bottles?


Here is the back of the 15W-40:


hMVLYQ.jpg


Here is the front of 10W-30:


b6KTpo.jpg


Here is the back of 10W-30:
QJ0HYv.jpg
 
No mention of CK4, or API specs on bottles. Their website says CJ4. Also mentions 0w40 (instead of 5w40) for cold temps.

Guess they've had it with API. Can't say that I blame them based on what happened.
 
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These Ford oils ARE CK4.
But I suppose it's smart of Ford to exclude CK4 label ...... for now.

Edit:grammar
 
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Originally Posted By: RLS
Can we get a picture of the back of the bottle showing the API rating?


Look at the back of any bottle or jug of HDEO you want on the store shelf. Or look at their spec sheet on the website. You can get all the pictures you want that way.
 
Originally Posted By: TiredTrucker
Originally Posted By: RLS
Can we get a picture of the back of the bottle showing the API rating?
Look at the back of any bottle or jug of HDEO you want on the store shelf. Or look at their spec sheet on the website. You can get all the pictures you want that way.
Except there is no API specification on the new MC bottles as shown by the photos I added above. I do not consider it to be a normal thing not to see an API specification on the bottle (neither for diesel or gasoline ratings).
 
API certs can be found here
https://engineoil.api.org/AccountManager/WelcomeMarketer

However, things are so fluid in terms of Ford's changing specs, bottle labels, etc, I'm not sure we'll get a clear view of this for some time ...

Here's what I see at this moment (copied/pasted directly from the linked search results):
Html:


MOTORCRAFT FULL SYNTHETIC DIESEL 5W-40 CJ-4, CI-4, CH-4 CI-4 PLUS

MOTORCRAFT SUPER DUTY DIESEL 10W-30 CJ-4, CI-4, CH-4 CI-4 PLUS

MOTORCRAFT SUPER DUTY DIESEL 15W-40 CJ-4, CI-4, CH-4 CI-4 PLUS

Motorcraft Superduty Motor Oil 10W-30 CJ-4, CI-4, CH-4/SN CI-4 PLUS

Motorcraft Super Duty Diesel 15W-40 CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 CI-4 PLUS

Motorcraft Super Duty Diesel 10W-30 CK-4, CJ-4, CI-4 CI-4 PLUS
 
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Originally Posted By: 2015_PSD
I was at my local WM this morning and saw the new MC oil for Powerstrokes meeting the new WSS-M2C171-F1 specification sitting on the shelf. Based upon what I see on the bottle "Contains More Than 1000PPM Phosphorus For Better Wear Protection", it makes me wonder if any HDEO with >1000PPM meets their specification; i.e. is that all that is required. I realize that is a broad statement, but...

VUnKyn.jpg



This is a great thing, I can see this as a sale boom to Ford too, for people wanting more zinc.

I honestly do not get some people trashing Ford about making things confusing, what the HECK is confusing???

Ford wants more ZINC in their oil for their engine, you get that with their new spec'd oil and its a great plus for anyone else looking for more zinc whether it is a Ford or not.
I THINK this is the best thing to happen to oil in a long time, you know what you are getting.

GM does the same thing in a much worse way, EVERYTHING is spec'd by their DEXOs but no one knows what they are getting.
With Ford you do, it will also help the Power Sports industry GREATLY for Marine engines and motorcycles as they require more zinc..
 
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Originally Posted By: alarmguy
I honestly do not get some people trashing Ford about making things confusing, what the HECK is confusing???

From the little that I know of Ford story in this 'fiasco' and get trashed in Bitog ........
Ford had been consistently consistent, absolutely !
 
It is unfortunate that Ford has no API certification shown on their bottle. Claiming that the oil meets Cummins and Detroit specs is not good enough. If Cummins and Detroit add this oil to their approval list, that would help. I cannot do a competitive bidding process for our fleet without that API designation. oil for our fleet must meet API CK-4, Cummins CES20086, Detroit DFS93K222 and Ford WSS-M2C171-F1 specifications, no exceptions. Someone saying it meets the Cummins spec and not having the Cummins approval makes a difference. I cannot afford to loose and 20K engine over a [censored] contest on oil specs.
That being said, I believe the Motorcraft oil is a good oil, I just cannot bid it out without the proper documentation.

Come on Ford, your killing us guys running mix fleets.

End of rant.
 
Originally Posted By: alarmguy

This is a great thing, I can see this as a sale boom to Ford too, for people wanting more zinc.

I honestly do not get some people trashing Ford about making things confusing, what the HECK is confusing???

Ford wants more ZINC in their oil for their engine, you get that with their new spec'd oil and its a great plus for anyone else looking for more zinc whether it is a Ford or not.
I THINK this is the best thing to happen to oil in a long time, you know what you are getting.

GM does the same thing in a much worse way, EVERYTHING is spec'd by their DEXOs but no one knows what they are getting.
With Ford you do, it will also help the Power Sports industry GREATLY for Marine engines and motorcycles as they require more zinc..


Ford wants more Zinc? Thought they wanted more phosphorous. Seems that is what the label on the MC jug was promoting. The Delvac Extreme 10w30 CK-4 I used and did a UOA on had 995 phosphorous and 1189 in zinc. but it does not make the Ford approved list. Zinc and Phosphorous are not two sides of the same thing. You don't need to increase one when you increase the other or vice versa.

This issue will probably be a sales boon for Ford. Easy to manipulate public perception. Ask P.T. Barnum. All this Ford hoopla seems to remind me of is when I was younger and had children and one of them wanted their way.
 
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