Name brand Oil all Relative anyway?

[Budman]

I am driving myself nuts reading this board, browsing the shelves, checking Product sheets, etc and then came to a conclusion. Why quibble over small, minor details of the oil? With the technology nowadays aren't all the bigger name brands fairly similar and you couldn't go wrong with any of them? I am mostly talking dino oils as there tends to be a bigger gap between different synth oils.

Don't they all use Hydrocracked base stocks now (Valvoline, Penzoil, Texaco, Chevron, etc)? Aren't they all up to par and group II at least to stay competitive and to meet specs? It isn't easy to find out which ones are Group II, or Group II+. So Could you make a bad choice choosing any oil when changing 3-5k? Is that slight difference in Flash point you found actually going to matter?

The big companies have the budget and the R&D to give a good product. They test and test so the consumer doesn't have to. Right? If not, we are all going to go nuts because then HOW do you find out and know which is best? Specs don't tell. And Analysis isn't cost effective. You can probably find tons of people who have good experience with any oil. One group swear by Chevron, another says Cococo, and others say Penzoil, while there are some who downgrade the three. It becomes more of a "brand loyalty" thing than anything.
But as Johnny mentioned in other thread about oil possibly becoming expensive in near future, then analysis could become good practice.

Bud

 

[Al]

All this is probably true for the OTC SL Dino based oils. You are describing the Joe-Sixpack routine which works for Joe Sixpacks. But what you are dealing on this board is the individual who wants (for the most part) a better product because of various reasons-high performance driving, extended drain intervals, or whatever. People on this board are decidedly different. Some people need to purchase 20 dollar/pound coffee and thats their thing. If you decide that you are happy with the OTD dino oils and 3 to 4 K oil filter changes. This board probaboly won't be very exciting to you.

 

[Spector]

Right on for the average driver on the street, about 90% of the population!

I know too many people who could care less about oil changes, what oil or filter they have in use and just follow the owners manual for changes.It is extremely discouraging to note that their engines seem to last as long as the methodical users of synthetic with analysis etc. If it ain't broke don't fix it philosophy

Maybe it's just the game that keeps us in here. Our tombstones will read. He believed in the best for his engine and analyzed to his death.

 

[Patman]

I'm definitely guilty of thinking far too much about oil, especially for someone who has historically changed his car every year or so!

But I always approach each car I own as if I'm going to keep it a very long time, since that usually is my plan when I first buy it, things just change after that.

If you drive a car hard, picking the right oil is very important, as there are differences in the additive packages that will effect how your engine wears. If you drive gently, and do 3-5k oil changes, honestly, any oil will do. But those of us that read this forum are definitely not the average motorists, and we strive to find the best oil we can for our particular applications.

 

[widman]

As a general rule, yes, in the U.S. it is hard to go too far wrong. if it about $1, it is a group I, $1.60 or so, Group II, $4.00 Group III, IV, or a good marketing department.
But there are differences. Analysis can show that for the same price one company will give you 1500 ppm of zinc, another 800. Protection! For the car driven by the little old lady to church every day at least 5 miles each way, any oil will probably be fine. If you like to get places in a hurry, tow trailers, carry carloads of kids/drywall or whatever, or just plain like to be in the left lane at 70 mph from a dead stop entrance to the freeway in a few seconds, it makes a difference.
For the engines that shear oils, or bake them, it makes a difference. For turbocharged engines, it makes a difference.

 

[Spector]

For the engines that shear oils, or bake them, it makes a difference. For turbocharged engines, it makes a difference.

Not sure this is true if you change your oil every 3-4000 miles. Even the Toyotas that had a tendency to sludge up did not sludge up if oil was changed every 3000. Maybe years ago but not with today's SL oil IMO.

http://www.xs11.com/stories/croil96.shtml

[ August 05, 2002, 03:40 PM: Message edited by: Spector ]

 

[Budman]

"if it about $1, it is a group I, $1.60 or so, Group II, $4.00 Group III, IV..."

This is defenitly not right. Chevron Supreme and Havoline are Group II (Havoline says right on back)and they both cost about $1.00 at Wallmart. Motorcraft (Conoco) is a Group II (maybe II+ ?) and is at the $1.50 range. Same with QS which is surely just a plain Group II. So pricing isn't a good measure.
I also understand that Basestock quality is important, but the additive package is much more important in determining how well an Oil holds up under use (or extreme use) in an actual engine. But I would love to have a good ground to start on and KNOW which ones use what basestock. For example, I don't want to be buying Havoline, which is the same price as Chevron, if Chevron uses II+ and Havoline is just a II.
Is there a list somewhere that lists most major oils and what group exactly the oil base belongs to?

 

[The_Oz]

I agree with what people are pretty much saying here. This board is typically made up of anally-retentive (no offence intended) people who just wants the best for their vehicle...this includes me since I cannot afford to have no car as my job depends on it. Also, as Bob stated a while back, he created this webboard not only to market Schaeffer, but also to put everything on the table - and finally see which oil company is full of BS, and who isn't.

Is Schaeffer better than Pennzoil (for example)? Maybe, maybe not. But one thing is for certain - I am not about to support BS marketing tactics. If Pennzoil properly blended Pennzane in right amounts, then maybe I'll consider using it. If Castrol actually admits that Syntec is Group III hydrocracked and lowers its price accordingly, then maybe I'll consider it, and so on, and so forth.

Regards,

Oz

 

[GROUCHO MARX]

Al, Spector, et.al.

You've got it right. For most drivers, there is no Holy Grail of motor oil. There are, however, many people looking to become more informed. Subsequently, they have become addicted to getting more information.

I think that is what brings many here.

 

[Maverick]

Well said Spector. Basically we're all a bunch of freaks! But day after day I find myself lurking around here just waiting for more info and new analysis posts... Ack.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Spector:
Maybe it's just the game that keeps us in here. Our tombstones will read. He believed in the best for his engine and analyzed to his death.

---

 

[GeorgeCLS]

I think the quote should be changed from " Our tombstones will read. He believed in the best for his engine and analyzed to his death." to "He believed in the best for his engine and analyzed to prevent its death".. From a lube engineer's perspective, of course...

 

[geo]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Budman:
For example, I don't want to be buying Havoline, which is the same price as Chevron, if Chevron uses II+ and Havoline is just a II.

---

Just for the record, Havoline and Chevron use the same base oils.