My Impressions about Mobil 1 ATF inside my car

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After 5 or 7 minutes of driving from a cold start, this Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF makes glass-smooth shifts inside my '06 Camry. I like the Mobil 1 and might increase it to 100 percent of the ATF fluid. (Right now the car has 50 percent T-IV and 50 percent Mobil 1, as of two weeks ago.) I'm a little concerned, though. In the first 5 or 7 minutes after a cold start, the shifts aren't so glass-smooth. On occasion you can feel the shifts jerk just a very little bit. I really can't compare this shifting to the last 3.5 years when I had 100-percent T-IV ATF in the car, because I really never paid attention to the shifting until this month, when I first drained and filled with Mobil 1 ATF. Again, I only started paying attention to the shifting this month--kinda funny, eh? Is this occasional slight sensation normal for Mobil 1 in the first 5 or 7 minutes after a cold start? I'm not even sure jerk is the right word for it--may be too strong a word. But after the first 5 or 7 mintues, shifts are glass smooth. The car has 25,000 miles on it. I'm not sure to flush and fill next time with Mobil 1 or T-IV, but I'm definitely going to flush it soon to remove the remaining 50 percent factory fill.
 
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I've used M1 ATF since it first came out and my tranny's always shift smooth. Upshift and downshift. Never a failure in tranny's or PS units. I change it every 40,000 miles. Also filter.
 
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OVERKILL

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I don't know how Toyota does it, but Ford has a warm-up program for the transmission. The shift strategy is different and shift points are higher until it is out of warm-up mode.
 

Built_Well

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How does this theory sound: Maybe during the first 5 or 7 minutes after cold startup, the Mobil 1 fluid is more in control of the transmission's shifting than the T-IV because the Mobil 1 is a synthetic ATF and probably more resilient and useful at cold startup. But once things warm up, the T-IV half of the ATF fluid starts shifting the car super smoothly? Isn't T-IV / 3309 known to prolong engagement of the gears so the gears change very smoothly. The downside is more wear as things rub together longer.
 
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 Originally Posted By: Built_Well
Isn't T-IV / 3309 known to prolong engagement of the gears so the gears change very smoothly. The downside is more wear as things rub together longer.
No, 3309 is used for the slipping lockup torque converters in some transmissions/transaxles. See: https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Other_Products/Mobil_ATF_3309.aspx I have about 16 liters of the stuff (Volvo branded) sitting under my roll cart at work just waiting for my fluid to turn a little dark again. Ever since I flushed my transaxle, it has had some hard shifts. The first shifts in the morning are quite hard, they smooth out some, but they are definitely more noticeable than some other cars I have driven at work (same cars). I am thinking about resetting the adaptations next time I do a flush.
 
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TAPs needs to be reset any time you change the fluid on a newer transmission. But, tranny needs to be at temp during the 'learn'. So, the better flow of a full synthetic might not be adapted to causing a slighty firmer shift when cold. Its nothing to worry about. I would definitely get a couple more drain/refills in on the Mobil1. Typical memory reset: PERFORM ROAD TEST TO ALLOW TCM TO LEARN NOTICE: Perform the following procedures while strictly observing all traffic laws and speed limits. (a) From a standstill, achieve highest possible speed with the accelerator pedal opened 15% or less. Keep the accelerator pedal angle steady while driving the vehicle. (b) Repeat the previous step until shift shock no longer occurs. (c) From a standstill, achieve highest possible speed with the accelerator pedal opened 25% or more. Keep the accelerator pedal angle steady while driving the vehicle. (d) Repeat the previous step until shift shock no longer occurs. Some transmissions, by certain automakers, will also require a 1/2 dozen or complete shifts back/forth between Neutral and Drive, and from Park to Reverse, to also teach them hot to shift smoothly into gear. If you shift into R or D and notice it more with the new fluid, you now know why! Other transmissions simply require a battery disconnect to clear out 'multiple drivers' or other learned habits. So simple but engineers won't let you have that much control anymore. Adaptive programming is becoming more of a PITA and a big cause of many issues.
 

Built_Well

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Thank you, unDummy, Tig, and Overkill for your extremely informative explanations. The other thing I notice is the car having a slight problem when shifting from 3rd to 4th--or I guess it's from 3rd to 4th if you're in first gear while accelerating from a stop. The U250E has 5 gears. My style of driving happens to not be fast; in other words I'm a slow driver, so I always accelerate gradually from a stop. But since adding the Mobil 1, I've decided to experiment a little bit, and notice that if I push down substantially on the gas pedal while in 3rd to try to engage 4th gear faster, the opposite happens: I don't engage 4th faster. Instead the RPMs get really high and loud--I guess up to 3,000(?) RPM and I still am not able to change into 4th gear, so I let off the pedal, and then, of course, the car does change into 4th. Is this normal? Maybe this is what's known as a flair? I really can't say if this is what used to happen when the ATF was all T-IV because, like I said, I only started paying attention to these details this month after adding the Mobil 1 to the T-IV factory fill. So, right now, both ATFs are in the car.
 
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My style of driving happens to not be fast; in other words I'm a slow driver, so I always accelerate gradually from a stop. But since adding the Mobil 1, I've decided to experiment a little bit, and notice that if I push down substantially on the gas pedal while in 3rd to try to engage 4th gear faster, the opposite happens: I don't engage 4th faster. Instead the RPMs get really high and loud--I guess up to 3,000(?) RPM and I still am not able to change into 4th gear, so I let off the pedal, and then, of course, the car does change into 4th. Is this normal? Maybe this is what's known as a flair? Built_Well, Typicaly when you press down on the excellerator pedal in any gear, a "downshift" occures not an "upshift". So, if you want to engage 4th gear sooner you will have to be easy on the pedal almost lifting your food off of the gas just a bit. So, yes this is normal.
 
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 Originally Posted By: Built_Well
After 5 or 7 minutes of driving from a cold start, this Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF makes glass-smooth shifts inside my '06 Camry. I like the Mobil 1 and might increase it to 100 percent of the ATF fluid. (Right now the car has 50 percent T-IV and 50 percent Mobil 1, as of two weeks ago.) I'm a little concerned, though. In the first 5 or 7 minutes after a cold start, the shifts aren't so glass-smooth. On occasion you can feel the shifts jerk just a very little bit. I really can't compare this shifting to the last 3.5 years when I had 100-percent T-IV ATF in the car, because I really never paid attention to the shifting until this month, when I first drained and filled with Mobil 1 ATF. Again, I only started paying attention to the shifting this month--kinda funny, eh? Is this occasional slight sensation normal for Mobil 1 in the first 5 or 7 minutes after a cold start? I'm not even sure jerk is the right word for it--may be too strong a word. But after the first 5 or 7 mintues, shifts are glass smooth. The car has 25,000 miles on it. I'm not sure to flush and fill next time with Mobil 1 or T-IV, but I'm definitely going to flush it soon to remove the remaining 50 percent factory fill.
Get that T-IV outa their! and you`ll be glad you did.
 

Built_Well

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 Originally Posted By: unDummy
T-IV isn't a very special oil, and it is used by numerous automakers in AW units. You can dig up a full synth OE equivalent from one of the euro-automakers' ATF PN list, priced like precious metals. Longer change intervals, better cold weather performance, better hot weather protection, and longer lasting transmission...... is why I will use a synthetic ATF. Amalie, Amsoil, BG, Wynns, Royalpurple, Redline, Schaeffers...... have full synthetic univeral multivehicle ATFs that can be used. Don't extend your ATF OCI without a full flow ATF filter kit.
UnDummy, your quotation above (taken from a different thread) is so interesting. I bet most people have no idea that a synthetic version of T-IV exists. I might try it. Do you know which European automaker makes the full synthetic T-IV and what name they've given it? I'd like to stick with Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF, but if I have to flog my car's accelerator pedal 10 or 12 times, going from zero to 80 miles per hour each time in order to get the car finally adapted to the Mobil 1, I probably won't do that. I'd rather stick with dino T-IV, or maybe buy the European synthetic T-IV. I guess my last question is: Would it be harmful to my car if I just kept the Mobil 1 ATF in there and did *not* do the adaptive flogging procedure? AZFireGuy, did you flog your '06 Camry SE to adapt it to the Red Line D4 ATF, or just let it be?
 
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Built Well- No i just reset the ecu. I had no clue about this adaptive learning. Have no idea if this is needed or not in my car. The D4 has been flawless in my camry. It shifts much better than with the original T-IV. One thing I hate about this car is that it has always had "shift flare" at low speeds and with little throttle input. My girlfried drives the car now and has learned how to drive it so that it does not do it anymore. Other than that it's been a great car with lots of power and a nice comfortable ride.
 

Built_Well

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I think I found out who makes the synthetic 3309 (or "T-IV"). Someone in Pennsylvania wrote at the SwedeSpeed forum in October, 2006, the following: "Yes. Previous FWD transmissions used Dexron III. For the Geartronic, ATF meeting standard JWS 3309 is specified. This is used in other Aisin-Warner gearboxes besides the P2 Volvos, but it is hard to come by in stores in my area. Volvo has a synthetic 3309, but it runs about $17 a liter. I purchased the Mobil 3309 for a mere $4 a quart via mail order." [end quote] Dang, that is priced like a precious metal. That's about $4 more than the O'Reilly price for Royal Purple's ATF, which is $13/quart, and O'Reilly is usually one of the better-pricing auto stores. http://forums.swedespeed.com/zerothread?id=67917 Should I get this Volvo stuff and pour it into the Camry during a drain and fill? Wouldn't it be better to use a synthetic 3309 than a synthetic general multi-car formula like Amsoil or Red Line?
 
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Personally, If looking for a good alternative to 3309, I would stick to Redline or Amsoil,maybe amalie. I have never heard of the syn Volvo fluid. T-IV is nothing special. I noticed a positive change going from T-IV to Redline D4. Others have stated similar results using Amsoil (ATF). It becomes a coin toss with those two. Just make sure you perform a complete cooler line flush to get all of the old fluid out. I think at this point that's part of your problem. It's hard to judge any fluid at only 50%. Although I don't know anyone running Mobil 1 syn atf in a T-IV application either, so not sure of it's suitability.
 
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Built_Well

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I dunno. It may be time for me to go back to 100 percent T-IV. The harsh shifts I've experienced are rare, maybe occurring only 2 times in a 10-mile drive, almost always near a mile or two after cold startup, but I don't recall any harsh shifts under 100 percent T-IV. I'll have to do more reading and learning before making a final decision. For now I'll still experiment with the 50/50 combo of Mobil 1 and T-IV that's already in the car. I hope the harsh shifts aren't hurting my car. I found a few people on Google using Mobil 1 ATF inside their Toyotas, for example someone with a Tundra, and, JohnBrowning here on BITOG in an old thread said he's using Mobil 1 in an '07 Camry, but I thought the '07 was spec'ed for WS, not T-IV.
 
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Built_Well

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Hmm, in 2005, someone writing at 4x4wire mentioned: "I'm sure others will have conflicting opinions of Mobil 1 (and synthetics in general) but FWIW: This morning I was in the heavy truck driveline shop that rebuilt my propshaft. They also build gear cases and differentials. I asked about Mobil 1 and was told by their shop manager - and all other workers nodded in agreement - that synthetics just don't lubricate as well in a gear case or differential as they do in an engine. The reason given to me was that engine clearances are .002-.003" whereas gear cases are ~.007". The synthetics are believed (by this group) to be too thin and don't cling as well - particularly when hot. I can't prove or disprove their opinion, but thought you'd like to hear it. I can say they are very experienced and highly respected in their line of work and I learn something every time I chat with them."
 
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 Originally Posted By: unDummy
Adaptive programming is becoming more of a PITA and a big cause of many issues.
This is so true. Very good post. On my car you can easily pull a fuse for a minute or two and reset the adaptives on both ETC and TCM. I'm sure someone knows which one to pull on your car.
 

Built_Well

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This synthetic 3309 fluid may be apocryphal, not real. Some folks at SwedeSpeed are saying the $17 per quart Volvo stuff isn't synthetic at all, but just re-badged 3309. The Volvo stuff may come from Castrol's Swiss factory, even though Castrol has always been headquartered in Britain and Castrol makes GC (German Castrol) in Germany. Synthetic 3309 probably doesn't exist today.
 

Kestas

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 Originally Posted By: Built_Well
I think I found out who makes the synthetic 3309 (or "T-IV"). Someone in Pennsylvania wrote at the SwedeSpeed forum in October, 2006, the following: "Yes. Previous FWD transmissions used Dexron III. For the Geartronic, ATF meeting standard JWS 3309 is specified. This is used in other Aisin-Warner gearboxes besides the P2 Volvos, but it is hard to come by in stores in my area. Volvo has a synthetic 3309, but it runs about $17 a liter. I purchased the Mobil 3309 for a mere $4 a quart via mail order."
Careful, Built_Well. I think it was Volvohead who warned me that there is someone posting misinformation on Volvo transmission fluid in one of the Volvo forums, and that this guy talks beyond what he really knows. I forget his username. My extensive internet reading on this transmission fluid indicates that we have no reason to believe that the $17 Volvo 3309 fluid is synthetic, and that it is really no different from Mobil ATF 3309 or the $5 Toyota Type T-IV.
 
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