Moving from 0W-20 to 5W-30 in late model Toyotas

[tolian21]

I did a video on YouTube about the differences between the earlier model 2GRFE and the later model 2GRFE...bearing clearances, valve guide clearances, oil pump, etc. There are no differences

The defenders of 0w-20 will tell you that US models have different ECM programming and that fuel additives are different in US vs other countries. If it was true, I am sure there would be a statement about this from Toyota, unless its a big secret they dont want anyone to know

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

I recently made the switch in my 2016 Avalon. Went from 0W20 to 5W30. No difference. I did it for slightly higher HTS. I figured...I’m at 120,000 miles, why not bump it up? Truthfully the 0W20 did fine in that engine, but I made the switch anyway.

I was very curious if there were any significant changes in my engine (2GRFE), because it initially called for 5W30 when it first came out (for several years), then Toyota switched to 0W20.

I did a video on YouTube about the differences between the earlier model 2GRFE and the later model 2GRFE...bearing clearances, valve guide clearances, oil pump, etc. There are no differences. The only even slightest difference I could find was on one clearance on one cap on the camshaft. We’re talking .002 thousands of an inch. And it may be less. But it was still well within specs. Bottom line...it’s because of CAFE regulations.

Thanks. I'm pretty much convinced that I'm going to move to 5W-30, still stay with Kirkland. My next oil change in my RX350 (2GRFE) will be with 5W-30. I'll do a couple more oil changes in my Tundra with 0W-20 and I will use the rest of my stash of 0W-20 in the LX570 until it runs out. I think I have about eight 5-quart jugs left, so it will be gone in about a year or so, that's only 4 oil changes between the 5.7L engines.

 

[tolian21]

My next oil change in my RX350 (2GRFE) will be with 5W-30

lexus manual allowed 5w-30 on 2gr-fe prior to 2013, and then they said you can run 0w-20 in older models. Here is interesting chart, notice the back port older models to use both 0w-20
And 5w-30


https://www.clublexus.com/forums/at...047_lexus_oil_chart_revised_april_2011_en.pdf

 

[Astro14]

Sigh…time to screenshot my Toyota owners manual again…

I’ve been running 5W30 in the Tundra for several years. There is no measurable difference in MPG, and my owners manual says this:

Then, there is this thread, asking the same question, which eventually had to be moderated…

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...s-and-canada-vs-0w-20-run-5w-30-right.367260/

You are not going to hurt your engine running a 5W30.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Wow, thank you, Astro, I feel so much smarterer.

 

[Matt1357]

Switching from Energy Conserving 0W-20 to Energy Conserving 5W-30 is incomsequential. Switching to a 5W-30 (or 0W-40/5W-40) with a 3.5+ HTHS will give you some added wear protection at the expense of a tiny bit of fuel economy. Thin oils help with fuel economy during bumper-to-bumper traffic and long idling times. Not so much when the engine is under load, constant load, and/or heavy load. The downside of low HTHS oils is that you get more blow-by and potentially more wear and tear when you work the engine hard. Keep in mind that the manufacturer's concern is to get that engine through warranty while meeting CAFE fleet requirements.

I do alot of idling and it can get cold in New England. I'm sticking with 0w20

 

[Astro14]

I do alot of idling and it can get cold in New England. I'm sticking with 0w20

What is your oil temperature when idling?

My truck has an oil/water cooler, which will serve to warm the oil more quickly as the water temperature goes up.

As far as cold starts? If I still lived where it was very cold, I would choose a 0W30 for those starts.

That said, I used to fire up my 4Runner with relative ease on synthetic 5W30 when the temp got below -20F (actual temp at the house, not “wind chill”) in Vermont. Worst I saw was about -28F, and it started fine.

If you’re seeing colder than that, perhaps the 0W20 will be an advantage.

 

[Chief119]

Who here has switched to 5W-30 from years of using 0W-20 in their Toyota/Lexus engines that call for 0W-20?

I have 3 Toyota/Lexus vehicles that all call for 0W-20 and I have used nothing but that for 10 years since my first Toyota in 2014. I have had zero issues with 0W-20. I have 177k miles on my bought-new Tundra using it, initially I used Mobil-1, about the 70k mile mark I started using Kirkland oil from Costco. My consumption went from 1+ quart over 6-8k miles to nearly zero across a 5+ OCI.

I have used Kirkland in my LX570 since I bought it, 2 years ago and we've put about 25k miles on it.

I have used it in my 2015 RX350, bought at 160k miles, currently has 223k miles on it.

No, there is no reason to change. I know that's the first response.

But I have read several people of late posting on social media in various places about how they have switched to 5W-30. I haven't gone looking for this. I have noticed through the years and most people state this is what's used in these same vehicles outside North America.

Actually, you can get this information from your Owner Manual!

It CLEARLY states that if you operate the vehicle in dusty conditions, stop and go traffic, and if you tow with it, that high viscosity may be better to use and to change the oil every 5 k if you do any of this.

There is your answer. I run 5w30 in my 21 LC because I tow my boat with it.

 

[tolian21]

Notice words “recommended viscosity”, they would say “required viscosity” instead if it was important

 

[Rogueman2016s]

you could use whatever you’d like the motor knows no difference. It’s interesting that they went from 5w30 straight to a 0w20 and not 5w20. It’s amazing who thinks this stuff up. Owner’s manual to my 16’ rogue says 0w20 or 5w30 I’m the 2nd owner according to the 1st owner’s service records 0w20 was always used I’ll stick at it.

 

[tolian21]

Owner’s manual to my 16’ rogue says 0w20 or 5w30

Owner manual for my 2012 es350 says 5w-30, but in later years the same engine 2GR-FE got 0w-20 and Toyota released a memo telling dealerships they can put either 0w-20 or 5w-20 or 5w-30 into some of the older cars that originally called for 5w-30. This is very interesting and gives you some clues of how they decided to go with 0w-20 without actually doing any changes to the engine

 

[Rogueman2016s]

Owner manual for my 2012 es350 says 5w-30, but in later years the same engine 2GR-FE got 0w-20 and Toyota released a memo telling dealerships they can put either 0w-20 or 5w-20 into some of the older cars that originally called for 5w-30. This is very interesting and gives you some clues of how they decided to go with 0w-20 without actually doing any changes to the engine

Oh yeah reminds me of my 98’ F150 which called for a 5w30 then ford had a tech bulletin switching to a 5w20. There’s nothing different internally to justify the switch

 

[kschachn]

you could use whatever you’d like the motor knows no difference. It’s interesting that they went from 5w30 straight to a 0w20 and not 5w20. It’s amazing who thinks this stuff up. Owner’s manual to my 16’ rogue says 0w20 or 5w30 I’m the 2nd owner according to the 1st owner’s service records 0w20 was always used I’ll stick at it.

Why would the 5W winter rating be an intermediate stop? Both are 20-grades, that’s what matters.

 

[ATex7239]

Why would the 5W winter rating be an intermediate stop? Both are 20-grades, that’s what matters.

5 is more than 0. Bigger is always better. Duh.

 

[kschachn]

5 is more than 0. Bigger is always better. Duh.

Apparently.

 

[dlundblad]

I went from 0w20 to 5w30 and eventually 0w40 in my mom’s 2015 4Runner.

The verbiage in her manual as well as the manual for my wife’s 2022 4Runner both allow “going up a grade” if the vehicle is used for towing. Mom’s it out of warranty hence the 0w40. The wife’s will get the same treatment when the time comes.

 

[Vitamin Yoda]

It’s interesting that they went from 5w30 straight to a 0w20 and not 5w20.

Well, 5W-20 has become kind of an irrelevant grade. In fact, the very first Mobil 1 5W-20 was actually a 0W-20, however, way back when, SAE hadn't yet published the specifications for 0W, so Mobil just marketed it as 5W-20. Today, blending 5W-20 is either an additional hassle for blenders to make, or an opportunity to save a few pennies in materials, depending how you look at it. And some love having an extra product in their portfolio to take up more shelf space at Walmart. All in all, it's a pointless grade today, given how close it is to 0W-20.

I went from 0w20 to 5w30 and eventually 0w40 in my mom’s 2015 4Runner.

The verbiage in her manual as well as the manual for my wife’s 2022 4Runner both allow “going up a grade” if the vehicle is used for towing. Mom’s it out of warranty hence the 0w40. The wife’s will get the same treatment when the time comes.

Even when under warranty, you can use whatever grade you deem appropriate as long as it's within reason. No, I wouldn't advise anyone to jump on Mobil 1 15W-50 and put that in their engine, however, 0W-40 or 5W-40 can be used in just about anything that calls for 0W-20. Tolerances and oil passages will easily accommodate for that. If an engine fails, it's usually due to a design flaw, or lack of maintenance. Using a motor oil that will provide better wear protection will not cause it to fail. The manufacturer knows that, the dealer knows that. Just never get into it with a know-it-all service advisor or service manager that don't know anything about lubrication.

When the 3.6 Pentastar PUG was released and used in the 2016 Jeep GC for the first time, it called for 0W-20. In fact, it still calls for that. The various Mopar forum bogeymen out there will tell you not to use anything lese, but MS-6395 0W-20 oil in it. Well, the bearing tolerance ranges in that engine are nearly identical to the 5.7 and 6.4 HEMI engines. And yes, you can safely use a 0W-40 or 5W-40 in a 3.6 Pentastar PUG engine. Though I wouldn't recommend anything beyond that, because they made some of the oil passages relatively narrow.

 

[dlundblad]

Well, 5W-20 has become kind of an irrelevant grade. In fact, the very first Mobil 1 5W-20 was actually a 0W-20, however, way back when, SAE hadn't yet published the specifications for 0W, so Mobil just marketed it as 5W-20. Today, blending 5W-20 is either an additional hassle for blenders to make, or an opportunity to save a few pennies in materials, depending how you look at it. And some love having an extra product in their portfolio to take up more shelf space at Walmart. All in all, it's a pointless grade today, given how close it is to 0W-20.


Even when under warranty, you can use whatever grade you deem appropriate as long as it's within reason. No, I wouldn't advise anyone to jump on Mobil 1 15W-50 and put that in their engine, however, 0W-40 or 5W-40 can be used in just about anything that calls for 0W-20. Tolerances and oil passages will easily accommodate for that. If an engine fails, it's usually due to a design flaw, or lack of maintenance. Using a motor oil that will provide better wear protection will not cause it to fail. The manufacturer knows that, the dealer knows that. Just never get into it with a know-it-all service advisor or service manager that don't know anything about lubrication.

When the 3.6 Pentastar PUG was released and used in the 2016 Jeep GC for the first time, it called for 0W-20. In fact, it still calls for that. The various Mopar forum bogeymen out there will tell you not to use anything lese, but MS-6395 0W-20 oil in it. Well, the bearing tolerance ranges in that engine are nearly identical to the 5.7 and 6.4 HEMI engines. And yes, you can safely use a 0W-40 or 5W-40 in a 3.6 Pentastar PUG engine. Though I wouldn't recommend anything beyond that, because they made some of the oil passages relatively narrow.

I would not use 0w40 in a Toyota under warranty in the US. It isn’t listed in the manual.

In other parts of the world, I believe 15w50 is an acceptable choice if the climate allows.

 

[Barkleymut]

I bought a bunch of VWB 5w30 for $7 /5qt jug (plus a rebate!) It is going into my wifes 2018 rx350....please do not tell her

 

[kschachn]

When the 3.6 Pentastar PUG was released and used in the 2016 Jeep GC for the first time, it called for 0W-20. In fact, it still calls for that. The various Mopar forum bogeymen out there will tell you not to use anything lese, but MS-6395 0W-20 oil in it. Well, the bearing tolerance ranges in that engine are nearly identical to the 5.7 and 6.4 HEMI engines. And yes, you can safely use a 0W-40 or 5W-40 in a 3.6 Pentastar PUG engine. Though I wouldn't recommend anything beyond that, because they made some of the oil passages relatively narrow.

Just how big do you think oil molecules are? The oil passages are not too narrow for a 50-grade. If that were the case then every engine would starve for oil at any temperature below normal operating temperature.

Sometimes there’s a lot of imagination about goes on in an engine.