Motul 300V 5W30 - VAG disel engines

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Originally Posted By: hajes
Changing oil at 16k km interval is quick and painful suicide for engine - especially for VAG cars ;-)


If I want to keep within VW specification - then it doesn't matter what oil you buy because they are all same.


Wrong again. Any OEM specification is a minimum expected performance. Some oils just get past this requirement, other easily pass it and offer performance above and beyond the demands of the specification. By your rationale, all oils supplied with a VW spec on them use precisely the same formulation. This is certainly not true, so differences must exist.
 
On chemical level - any oil lasts for at least 30k km - unless you push it hard. Problem is soot and other particles. Any oil is dead within max. 10k.

This information is provided by an academic/theoretic man who does oil analysis and teaches about oil products.

"I've analysed an oil from a Skoda - 15k km. Engine will last just few such changes. Oil was in perfect shape but full of soot and other particles - slowly killing/wearing engine."

You can live by theories and wild dreams - or you live by facts ;-)

People are idiots - if I forget about improper car usage such as rev at cold, don't cooling down turbo. Many people kills VW turbines at 25k km a wonder what is going on. My turbo lasts 70k of hard core abuse so far. I have dismantled turbo to inspect damage...as new.

Proper maintenance, intelligence and max. 10k km oil change including all filters.

Once, again - it is up to you, if you love marketing or proven facts ;-)

Long life oils - joke. Lifetime gearbox oil - joke. It is common degeneration of modern society - a syndrome of perfection.

For some reason, people believe there are universal, all purpose, best things - keep on dreaming or push it hard ;-)
 
An other example...a man who was a motor master in Skoda Motorsport. Racing Skodas for 25 years.

cimbu.cz

"Your oil change, with your driving style - 10k km oil change is maximal I would go with."

Once again, dreaming or reality - your choice.
 
Conclusion is - you either protect engine and destroy emission devices. Or vice versa.

Since, nobody does engine rebuilds on diesel turbo cars. I will rather destroy anything else - easily replaceable - and keep running an other engine with 300k+ on ODO meter ;-)

My Skoda Fabia 1.4TDi, 59kW, 2008 has got almost 300k km on ODO meter. Comment of my friend "Bloody [censored] man, your can runs better than my Skoda Ooctavia 1.9TDi with less kilometres on ODO meter." :-D

Every car is as good as its weakest link - in most cases, driver.
 
Did you come hear to learn or preach? In your first post you had questions and it showed you had a good deal to learn. The last post you are sound like you are having a converstation with yourself.

VW specstheir oil for DPFs for a reason.( I put many many miles on a common rail VW tdi before I bought my Jeep insead for my short commute) If you dont have a DPF then choose another diesel rated oil with a reasonable interval.
 
To be honest, I didn't learn anything so far. All I see is people who quote user manuals and believe in marketing myths.

I hoped there is some "psychopath" as me who can push cars hard and suggest something reasonable, rather than quotations of user manuals ;-)
 
Originally Posted By: hajes
To be honest, I didn't learn anything so far. All I see is people who quote user manuals and believe in marketing myths.

I hoped there is some "psychopath" as me who can push cars hard and suggest something reasonable, rather than quotations of user manuals ;-)


My 2012 VW Jetta TDI was lemon lawed because of failed EGR, electrical shorts,trunk leaks and fuel pump failing. The DPF was clean and ash level was good. Besides the fuel economy that car was a giant POS. DPF technology isnt ready for primetime and in my experience I wouldn't venture outside of what the OEM says BECAUSE of the warranty. I'm glad I followed the user manual so I wasnt held liable for all the things that broke on that heap of junk.

If I beleived in marketing myths I wouldn't be running 41 year old oil in my 240Z. I would be running something with the latest additives and wasn't "expired". In short, you don't know as much as you think about oil or me. There is a reason people are giving you the recommendations they are and it's not because they a marketing sheep.

Wanna be crazy? Runna a 0w20 TGMO and report back. You should REALLY be able to drive like Colin McRae then with all your freed up horsepower.
smirk.gif
 
That's why I never buy new cars - especially VW. From whole VW concern - Skoda is most reliable car. Especially, in country I was born. I go into break-yard and rebuild my car :-D

Once, I buy oil refinery. I'll run 0w20 oil and change it every 800km :-D

As usually, my experiments and test will be most reliable source of my challenges.

I understand that most people don't drive as me - thus they cannot recommend anything useful.


Manufacturers RECOMMEND - they don't say, YOU MUST.

YOU MUST customise oil to your driving style.

If you live in hot country - you won't run VW recommendation right ;-)

I live in extreme temperatures (of course not as northern countries) - we have hot summers and cold winters. It is range of 40deg C down to -30deg C.

You know that old legend - Carl Benz created first car but he spent, as every TUNER, most of time in garage and first ride was made by his wife.

As Albert Einstein said "What works in theory doesn't work in real life and vice versa."

You're right - I don't know any details about oils. I specialise in suspension customisation, mechanical engineering, design and CNC machining...ECU management is next step.

But I've most important thing that most people miss ;-) COMON SENSE.

If you understand dynamics of nature and oil dynamics, you don't need mumbo jumbo academic details to know what is best for your driving style.

During my life as car technician - I've seen more damage made by improper use rather than controlled experiments. Secret is to know when to quit the experiment.
 
hajes said:
Changing oil at 16k km interval is quick and painful suicide for engine - especially for VAG cars ;-)

You prefer VW:s recommended 30k km intervals?
laugh.gif
. At least in Finland they drive that far
with same oil. (and change engine at 60tkm)
 
SAPS and the DPF is the big issue I'm concerned about. It's a pain to remove the carp from your car, and a pain to replace them.


I get annoyed going 60mph at 50+mpg and having to put up with the filter carp.
 
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Originally Posted By: hajes
Hi,

I am David and I like to drive Colin McRae style.

Who would resist mountain roads of Austria and drive FRC (Family Racing Cup) style.

I recently purchased Skoda Octavia II 2.0TDi 103kW with DPF...VW 505.01 norm if I am not mistaken.


You are mistaken. Recomended for TDI with DPF is VW 504/507 approved oil.

Originally Posted By: hajes

If you live in hot country - you won't run VW recommendation right ;-)


No.
I mean yes, you would run VW recommended oil - if your VW has DPF.

Originally Posted By: hajes


But I've most important thing that most people miss ;-) COMON SENSE.

If you understand dynamics of nature and oil dynamics, you don't need mumbo jumbo academic details to know what is best for your driving style.


COMMON SENSE does not drive 2.0 TDI DPF - Colin McRae style.

Good luck with experiments. You ll` need it.

Hint - find some of (rare) oils that satisfies ACEA C3 in a grade 10W-50. Maybe even Colin McRae in 2.0 TDI would roger that, if he was alive. God bless him.
 
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aye aye captain. but what is point of having a car iff you drive like family lost on shopping trip ;-)

Already spoken with a guys who used to work for Skoda.

10W50 recommended.

DPF doesn't bother me - i'll go off the car.
 
BTW - you're making too much drama around DPF. Imagine you live in Europe where most crude oil is from Russia - it is known it is high sulphur oil.

Despite modern refinery processes are optimal - people are idiots and want cheap products. In Czech Republic is worst fuel you can buy - TOO MUCH SULPHUR in diesel.

Czech Republic would be major consumer of DPF filters. You should see how EGR and other components look like. Still, there is normal rate of DPF change ;-)

Don't worry, be happy - said Bob Marley or lets say Don't worry and drive. Or don't worry about e-experts and drive and ask pros ;-)
 
Originally Posted By: hajes

DPF doesn't bother me - i'll go off the car.


That`s the other ball game (meaning oil recomendation)

In UK - you cant get away if you remove DPF.
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-rules-for-mot-to-test-for-diesel-particulate-filter

***

Originally Posted By: hajes
Imagine you live in Europe where most crude oil is from Russia - it is known it is high sulphur oil.

Despite modern refinery processes are optimal - people are idiots and want cheap products. In Czech Republic is worst fuel you can buy - TOO MUCH SULPHUR in diesel.


No need to imagine, I live in Belgrade, Serbia.

More than a five years, here (even Serbia is not a member of EU) you can buy ULSD aka EuroDiesel that satisfies EN590.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EN_590

Evene Russian eurodizel is well within the prescribed norms.
 
As a member of the EU, the Czech Republic is bound by EU directives. These include DIRECTIVE 2009/30/EC OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL...

Originally Posted By: Directive 2009/30/EC
Diesel fuel

1. Member States shall ensure that diesel fuel may be placed on the market in their territory only if it complies with the specifications set out in Annex II.
Notwithstanding the requirements of Annex II, Member States may permit the placing on the market of diesel with a fatty acid methyl ester (FAME) content greater than 7 %.
Member States shall ensure the provision of appropriate information to consumers concerning the biofuel, in particular FAME, content of diesel fuel.
2. Member States shall ensure that, no later than from 1 January 2008, gas oils intended for use by non-road mobile machinery (including inland waterway vessels), agricultural and forestry tractors and recreational craft may be placed on the market within their territory only if the sulphur content of those gas oils does not exceed 1 000 mg/kg. From 1 January 2011, the maximum permissible sulphur content of those gas oils shall be 10 mg/kg. Member States shall ensure that liquid fuels other than those gas oils may be used in inland waterway vessels and recreational craft only if the sulphur content of those liquid fuels does not exceed the maximum permissible content of those gas oils.
However, in order to accommodate minor contamination in the supply chain, Member States may, from 1 January 2011, permit gas oil intended for use by non-road mobile machinery (including inland waterway vessels), agricultural and forestry tractors and recreational craft to contain up to 20 mg/kg of sulphur at the point of final distribution to end users. Member States may also permit the continued placing on the market until 31 December 2011 of gas oil containing up to 1 000 mg/kg sulphur for rail vehicles and agricultural and forestry tractors, provided that they can ensure that the proper functioning of emissions control systems will not be compromised.
3. Member States may, for the outermost regions, make specific provision for the introduction of diesel fuel and gas oils with a maximum sulphur content of 10 mg/kg. Member States making use of this provision shall inform the Commission accordingly.
4. For Member States with severe winter weather, the maximum distillation point of 65 % at 250 °C for diesel fuels and gas oils may be replaced by a maximum distillation point of 10 % (vol/vol) at 180 °C.


Originally Posted By: hajes
BTW - you're making too much drama around DPF. Imagine you live in Europe where most crude oil is from Russia - it is known it is high sulphur oil.


I do live in Europe, where fuel quality is controlled by the EU to be
Originally Posted By: hajes
In Czech Republic is worst fuel you can buy - TOO MUCH SULPHUR in diesel.


It really is NOT the worst fuel you can buy. Try Russia. Or China. Or India. Or even Turkey. Or countless other countries with mandated but uncontrolled fuel supplies.

And for the record, my source of information is 22 years of engine oil product development, technical support, analysis and training. In my world, an experiment is scientifically planned and implemented, with statistical analysis of multiple data points. Outstanding results sometimes have to be ignored because they are not statistically valid. Home experimenters often forget (or don't know) this and rely on a sample of one to substantiate universal statements.
 
Originally Posted By: hajes
aye aye captain. but what is point of having a car iff you drive like family lost on shopping trip ;-).


Don't buy a car that a family lost on a shopping trip would have and try to drive it like a rally car?

Commuters for commuting. Sports cars for sporting. Otherwise anything you do is a compromise.
 
Originally Posted By: hajes


Don't worry, be happy - said Bob Marley or lets say Don't worry and drive. Or don't worry about e-experts and drive and ask pros ;-)


Bobby McFerrin not Bob Marley. Again, you just need to read more.


About multiple subjects apparently.
 
Actually, Bob Marley sang the song as well. Gotta love that dope smoking hippie, some days I wish my life was that simple.

Don't know if Schaeffers is even available over there, but I know of 3 people that use their 9000 series 5w50 in their sled pulling trucks and have had good results. These are high horse power Cummins turbo diesel engines running 4k rpm. I also use this oil in my 100+ horsepower rotax v twin engine. Very stout oil.

schaeffer 5w50
 
Originally Posted By: hajes
aye aye captain. but what is point of having a car iff you drive like family lost on shopping trip ;-)


This is the (one of the) point.

http://www.eurorap.org/partner-countries/czech-republic/

Since the establishment of an independent Czech State, 21,721 (equivalent to the population of a medium town) lost their lives in road accidents;

In 2001, the number of deaths in road accidents (per million inhabitants) corresponded approximately to the average of EU 27;

The same assessment for 2010 shows that the number of road deaths had grown by more than 20% above the average of EU 27;

Head-on collisions and side impacts at intersection accounted for one-third of all road deaths in the Czech Republic;

Single vehicles running off the road and colliding with dangerous roadside objects took the life of 1,232 people - equivalent to 27% of all fatalities over the last 5 years;

Every 4th victim of a fatal accident on Czech roads is a cyclist or pedestrian.
 
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I like your naive visions :-D

Theoretically, everything is great as Russian preached.

Keynesian theories work as well.

Pigs fly.

We can do anything we want because we live in democracy.

People are intelligent.

Government always do in favour of people.


BOY, I'M NOT SURPRISED THIS SOCIETY IS SO SCREWED UP WITH YOUR BELIEFS.
 
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