Motorweek @ Mobil 1 R Oil

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742
Location
Lake Anna, VA
Was just watching Motorweek on Speed channel and they were interviewing Rusty Wallace and he was asked about the myth of Nascar using Synthetic 50W oils during racing. Rusty then came on and said many positives about how they run the M1 0W-30R oil and how great it was over the old 50W synthetics. He mentioned that the 0W viscosity really helped the bearings in the motor better than the thicker weight oils. BTW the Motorweek editor was holding a new bottle of Mobil 1R 0W-30 in his hands! Looked like a cool looking bottle! [Big Grin]
 
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11,284
Location
Spring HIll
Not to discount what you've seen or what Rusty Wallace himself has to say, but, Ow is for winter. These guys run these cars in the summer heat. I don't doubt a thinner oil may be able to take the extreme Nascar abuse with the chemistry available nowadays, but 0w? Is that just in case they get the urge to startup the car when it's -30 degrees outside? I don't get it.
 
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22,188
Location
Colorado Springs
Dude, what are you talking about? Just because it's labeled 0w does not mean the oil can not take heat! Some all ester based oils could be labaled 10w-30 or 0w-30 with no viscosity index improvers because the base oils in super high quality synthetic have that much of a natural viscosity index. And, as long as it stays 30 weight at any temperature that these motors will encounter, then all is good. Some oils will not continure to excessivly thin out under extreme heat, and therefore, thicker oil is not needed for viscosity protection. Plus, these guys want every 1/100 of a horsepower they can get. If other teams were succesfully using 10 weight oil and not blowing motors, they will be more fuel efficient and have more horsepower and win more races, and all the other teams would be forced to find a way to make that work.
 
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33,975
Location
Southern NJ
0w-30's are the future. You want the fast cold flow, even in temps. above 0F. It's just better. I can't wait for this oil to hit the market. Mobil is finally giving us oil geeks what we've always wanted from them. I'm sure this oil is top notch. Being able to buy it anywhere will be a huge plus. I just hope they don't fully API it. They said it will have a much more robust additive/anti-wear package. [Smile]
 
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11,284
Location
Spring HIll
quote:
Originally posted by jsharp: After being here a while I have to say I'm less impressed with M1 than I once was...
I used to think that Mobil1 was best available until I read about Amsoil from this board. I might get spammed for my opinion in this thread, but I think M1 15w-50 is one of the best available oils available on the shelf at any store. It doesn't work for every application, but for my Saturn, it worked like a champ! But why would 0w be used for racing and not straight 30W in this formulation? They're not racing in any cold temperatures where cold starting is an important component.
 
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3,593
Location
Outside smalltown, IL
quote:
Originally posted by ToyotaNSaturn:
quote:
Originally posted by jsharp: After being here a while I have to say I'm less impressed with M1 than I once was...
I used to think that Mobil1 was best available until I read about Amsoil from this board. I might get spammed for my opinion in this thread, but I think M1 15w-50 is one of the best available oils available on the shelf at any store. It doesn't work for every application, but for my Saturn, it worked like a champ! But why would 0w be used for racing and not straight 30W in this formulation? They're not racing in any cold temperatures where cold starting is an important component.

I'm not completely disillusioned with M1, but after looking at so many UOA's here the "nothing outperforms Mobil 1" slogan rings a little hollow. I still think it a good oil and I still use it. I'm guessing on this ( someone can come along and correct me ) but the ability of synthetics to act like much thinner dino oils at low temps is well known. If you attempt to formulate a straight 30 weight synthetic it's pretty much always going to end up that it will meet the low temp specs for a 10W, 5W or even 0W oil. Why not sell it that way? What's more, even if it doesn't start as a 0W I suspect it's possible to get those characteristics without much difficulty and without sacrificing much performance in other areas. So again, why not do it. A lot of racing such as drag racing or auto/x start with a stone cold engine and low oil temps. That 0w looks pretty attractive when you just took an engine with water and oil temps under 50 degrees F and hammered holy H%$L out of it...
 
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33,975
Location
Southern NJ
jsharp, I agree for the most part. I do think M1 is a great oil, but it could be better and there are better oils out there. Regarding the R oil, it uses a proprietary base stock that is very advanced. It sounds like a very similar oil to Amsoil's Series 2000, only I have to assume it's much better. My GUESS is that it will be an extremely stable, ester/PAO oil with a strong additive package similar to Delvac 1. Is Mobil playing catch up with Amsoil? Amsoil has had this S2k out for quite sometime and some racing teams have been using it to run qualifying laps while others have been using the 50wt. Mobil 1 oils. Hmmmm. I'm sure this oil will be very impressive as it is used by the best. It's also being used during the entire races, not just the qualifying laps. [Smile] I wish it was out now so we can disect it to death! [Big Grin]
 

Patman

Staff member
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21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
quote:
A lot of racing such as drag racing or auto/x start with a stone cold engine and low oil temps. That 0w looks pretty attractive when you just took an engine with water and oil temps under 50 degrees F and hammered holy H%$L out of it...
That's another reason I like using 0w30. There are many times when I go to the dragstrip and I let my engine cool down for 90min or more between runs, in order to get a better elapsed time.
 
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585
Location
Daytona Beach
OK I understand the W part, what's up with the R? In other words, is this oil designed as a RACING oil? Or is this a marketing ploy currently being tied to NASCR very craftily? The R acing oils of old were of specific design, minimal additive packages, plenty of moly(?), and heavy in grade, usually designed to perform well for about 500 miles. Maybe it's just time for me to forget about the old days!
 
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3,593
Location
Outside smalltown, IL
quote:
Originally posted by Patman:
quote:
A lot of racing such as drag racing or auto/x start with a stone cold engine and low oil temps. That 0w looks pretty attractive when you just took an engine with water and oil temps under 50 degrees F and hammered holy H%$L out of it...
That's another reason I like using 0w30. There are many times when I go to the dragstrip and I let my engine cool down for 90min or more between runs, in order to get a better elapsed time.

I'm with you on this 100%. I pop the hood after each run when autocrossing and try to get as far back in line as I can after every run to maximize the cooling time in between runs. My friends with built up drag cars do the same and keep their electric water pumps and fans running for the same reason.
 
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33,975
Location
Southern NJ
Amsoil advertises their 20w-50 as a racing oil so I'm not really sure of the types of racing oils. It is true that racing oils that Redline makes are different. This R oil is going to be a very strong oil that can go in ANY car as stated by Mobil. It will obviously need the additives required for street cars like most oil. [Smile]
 
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310
Location
Northern California
quote:
Originally posted by ToyotaNSaturn: But why would 0w be used for racing and not straight 30W in this formulation? They're not racing in any cold temperatures where cold starting is an important component.
I belive as one of the above posters thought, the oil because of better basestocks is naturally a 0w-30 without any viscosity modifiers. I can't find the information right now, but Redline used to state their race oil's did not have viscosity modifiers, and even though they were called straight grade, they met multi-grade specs. If you look at the redline site they grade their SAE 50 oil as (15w-50), and 30wt as 10w-30. Cary
 
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43,651
Location
'Stralia
It's funny, and certainly not comparing apples with apples, but Grumpy Jenkins in his book refers to turning OFF the electric water pumps for his last "do or die" "banzai" run at the dragstrip.
 
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5,785
Location
Dixie
Isn't Rusty Wallace the guy with that huge Mobil 1 decal on his car and the smaller decals all over his jumpsuit??? "Not that there's anything wrong with that ..." [Roll Eyes] Most non-professional racers use 15w-50 or 20w-50 synthetics and not 0w-30, since they don't get a new motor delivered every week from their personal engine builder .... Tooslick [ December 04, 2003, 06:53 AM: Message edited by: TooSlick ]
 
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835
Location
Ohio
quote:
Originally posted by Cary: We should probably also distinguish between types of racing. Drag racing involves short runs, where power is essential. Road racing can run between 20 minute sessions and 24 hour endurance races. In the Road race enviroment, oil temps will be higher and heavier oils will be required. Cary
Very true. It has always been that race teams use the lightest oil possible for the application. For long endurance races such as LeMans, a heavier oil is almost always used, since extracting every last iota of hp is not as important as being able to finish the race. I'm not 100% convinced that a 0w30 or 0w40 can be made without any VI improvers. I'd like to see some proof of that. Here's what Redline says about their racing oils: SAE 30 (10W30) - suitable in well balanced racing engines for sustained high-speed use where low internal friction is desired. SAE 40 (15W40) - for use where temperatures may be high and when a wide range in RPMs and speeds will be encountered. SAE 50 (15W50) - for use where extremely high temperatures may be encountered and when engine durability is the primary concern. And finally this: Even though Red Line Race Oils are straight grades, their low-temperature properties make them exceptional multigrades.
 
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3,593
Location
Outside smalltown, IL
quote:
Originally posted by Shannow: It's funny, and certainly not comparing apples with apples, but Grumpy Jenkins in his book refers to turning OFF the electric water pumps for his last "do or die" "banzai" run at the dragstrip.
I imagine he was talking about during the run, but who knows. Jenkins was an interesting guy. Very successful, and with some noncinventional ideas about things. It seemed like he painted everything on his cars white. Engine, exhaust headers, everything. I think I remember him saying he wanted to keep the heat in, not dissipate it... [Confused]
 
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