Motor Oil / Gas Mileage Comparisons

[Basser]

Since November 2004, I have driven 3 different motor oils approx. 750 miles each an the same vehicle in order to see if there was a gas mileage difference between the three. Two were GF4 rated, which supposedly gives better fuel economy, and one was a GF3 oil:

1. Mobile Drive Clean 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.4 mpg

2. Phillps 66 TropArtic 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.3 mpg

3. Supertech(Warren Dist)5w-30 GF-3: avg: 20.1 mpg

All were conventional oils with SuperTech oil filters. Same vehicle, 50/50 very short trips/highway miles. Various brand fuels, same octane, all bought after November(same winter blend).
What does this prove? Performance is nearly identical, I'll be running the SuperTech from now on. I'll let WalMart do the changes too for $13.88, I'll just get the ST oil filter. It also proves there's alot of people on the board who make a big deal out of nothing. Dont lose sleep over motor oil. Get some counseling!!

 

[Al]

You would expect to see zero difference in gas milage with identical viscosity conventional oils. The real important difference would be the condition of the oil and the wear metals after a specific amount of time.

I'd pay the difference to run the TropArtic.

 

[JHZR2]

20.1 vs ~20.35mpg would seem to me to be about right... Provided (which I doubt) you had enough tanks of gas to make the data reliable, not just one or two points.

The fuel efficiency improvements are small fractions of a percent, so thats probably all youll see. Remember, a tiny fraction of a percent times millions of vehicles and millions of gallons of fuel equal lots of fuel saved!

JMH

 

[KW]

Now try 0W20 and 15W40 and see what that brings.

I think the data is good, thought I'm more interested in how weight affects mileage.

 

[edhackett]

Yup, the minimum increase in mileage for a GF-4 vs GF-3 5W-30 is 0.3%. Your data shows up to a 1.5% increase. I'd say the GF-4 lived up to it's specification.

Ed

 

[Ugly3]

quote:

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Originally posted by KW:
Now try 0W20 and 15W40 and see what that brings.

I think the data is good, thought I'm more interested in how weight affects mileage.

---

Well, I can relate this.

The kids were moving and loaded my van (Chrysler T&C) to the gills. The left it full for maybe 3 weeks (too busy to unload) and my MPG went down 2 MPG. I would guess the weight to be maybe 1000 pounds.

 

[Shannow]

I know that the difference between Delo400 and Shell 25W-70 is 3MPG in a 2 litre 4 cylinder front wheel drive.

 

[michaelc80]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Basser:
Since November 2004, I have driven 3 different motor oils approx. 750 miles each an the same vehicle in order to see if there was a gas mileage difference between the three. Two were GF4 rated, which supposedly gives better fuel economy, and one was a GF3 oil:

1. Mobile Drive Clean 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.4 mpg

2. Phillps 66 TropArtic 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.3 mpg

3. Supertech(Warren Dist)5w-30 GF-3: avg: 20.1 mpg

All were conventional oils with SuperTech oil filters. Same vehicle, 50/50 very short trips/highway miles. Various brand fuels, same octane, all bought after November(same winter blend).
What does this prove? Performance is nearly identical, I'll be running the SuperTech from now on. I'll let WalMart do the changes too for $13.88, I'll just get the ST oil filter. It also proves there's alot of people on the board who make a big deal out of nothing. Dont lose sleep over motor oil. Get some counseling!!

---

Only 750 miles on each oil and you're making assumptions? That's no where near enough to really determine which oil does best.

What-maybe 2 tanks of gas? How do you know there wasn't slightly more fuel in the tank with the Mobil Drive Clean? Assumed it filled up to the same spot because the shut off on the pump kicked off? Nope.

How did you determine how full the tanks were? How much temperature variation was there? November to now? I bet there's a big temperature swing, which can affect fuel mileage. Sorry, but your "testing " was flawed. The only way to really determine the difference is to run it long term (several thousand miles each) with similar weather conditions and driving patterns and average the figures.

And let the Wal-Mart kid with a nose ring who just transferred from pets work on my vehicle? Now that's good for a laugh!

 

[Basser]

I am keeping track of the latest fill with TropArtic. If it doesn't show any difference thru the entire OCI, than what the supertech showed AT THE END of its' ~3000 mile interval, then I think there is some useful data there.

Remember I wasn't calculating mpg with the fill-up method, I was using the onboard computer GM OIL LIFE MONITOR, which is ver accurate. Right now it's still showing 20.4 mpg for my combined driving. I didn't reset it since the start of the TropArtic fill.

 

[peterr]

Not try to nitpick, but hey the two exclamation points on

"there's alot of people on the board who make a big deal out of nothing. Dont lose sleep over motor oil. Get some counseling!!"

kinda opens the floor.

Apart from the fact that MPG in 750 mile OCIs is - to my knowledge - not the priority of anyone posting on this board, these sample sizes are way to small and the measured differences way to small and the other potential variables (fuel, temperature, driver actions, conditions, route, hwy vs city vs idle) way too large to get any statistically significant data out of this.

There are some the areas where we are forced to get anecdotal. Sure we are going to have to be subjective with things like Lube Control ("my engine seems to run better.") but mpg statistics are an area where people will get falsely specific way beyond the sensitivity of the measurements.

Usually what people are reporting is the "I got 2 mpg more on this tank" which - while not at a level of a difference of less than half of one percent measured by instruments as precise as a car fuel gauge - still has all the above problems

In this case, small 750 mile sample sizes measured by imprecise instruments, using different gas, different days...

The slight incline of my driveway can make a perceived difference of 2 gallons in my tank as indicated by the gauge. The GM Oil Life Monitor may be a very fancy option but to contend it is sensitive enough to track 0.5% differnces in intervals like 750 miles in different conditions?

One day of bad traffic could generate a difference like this in samples this small (let alone this imprecise). The fuel from one station or later in the month could have more oxygenates, or a more wintery formulation with less potential energy etc...

You see where I am going here. We could spin a dozen factors that are all potentially more real than a 0.5% difference in MPG caused by oil.

So...
"What does this prove?"

Absolutely nothing.

And neither MPG nor cost of oil is the main driving force of most of us here. I will leave it to others with a more detailed knowledge of formal logic to explain how knocking down a straw man really doesn't prove much of anything.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Basser:
Since November 2004, I have driven 3 different motor oils approx. 750 miles each an the same vehicle in order to see if there was a gas mileage difference between the three. Two were GF4 rated, which supposedly gives better fuel economy, and one was a GF3 oil:

1. Mobile Drive Clean 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.4 mpg

2. Phillps 66 TropArtic 5w-30 GF-4: avg: 20.3 mpg

3. Supertech(Warren Dist)5w-30 GF-3: avg: 20.1 mpg

All were conventional oils with SuperTech oil filters. Same vehicle, 50/50 very short trips/highway miles. Various brand fuels, same octane, all bought after November(same winter blend).
What does this prove? Performance is nearly identical, I'll be running the SuperTech from now on. I'll let WalMart do the changes too for $13.88, I'll just get the ST oil filter. It also proves there's alot of people on the board who make a big deal out of nothing. Dont lose sleep over motor oil. Get some counseling!!

---

 

[Basser]

An increase in mpg = less friction, less resistance, better lubriciation. All things being equal, if one oil produces better mpg, it's lubricating better.

BTW, a little birdie told me that in the very near future, the prices of the TropArctic synthetic blend will be going up at Wally World from $1.12 to ?

 

[peterr]

1. The "increase" in MPG in your experiment is not statistically significant. eg 20.3 MPG vs 20.4 given the other variables. Even without the other variables, the instruments are not sensitive enough to make the assertion that 20.3 vs 20.4 is actually different rather than within the margin of the equipment.

2. There is more to motor oil in internal combustion engines than lubrication. As many investigations of the chlorinated additive products indicate, chlorine bleach does a pretty good job at reducing friction on one of those bearing tests, but would you fill you crankcase with it?

Not arguing the point that for many people in many cars, use of a cheap but well formulated oil is a wise choice. I think most engines would have trouble realizing financial or routine performance benefits out of GC. Running ST Dino and regular short OCIs is probably quite a good strategy for many. It just does not gain its justification from a flawed experiment and data too vague to be meaningful.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Basser:
An increase in mpg = less friction, less resistance, better lubriciation. All things being equal, if one oil produces better mpg, it's lubricating better.

BTW, a little birdie told me that in the very near future, the prices of the TropArctic synthetic blend will be going up at Wally World from $1.12 to ?

---

 

[Gene K]

0.3 mpg is not a significant difference unless the test is performed in a controlled enviroment.

You might get a significant enough difference to prove something with a wide viscosity change like 5W-20 to 10W-60.

Gene

 

[Basser]

The Mobil DC was at the end of a 4000 mile run when I started the test. I used the GM onboard mpg calculator, on the odometer. I ran the SupertTech after that for about 3000 miles, and again I used the onboard mpg calculator, computerized on the odometer. The Trop Atic I put in about a month ago, so the calculations were based on the first 750 miles since the oil change. Like I said I used the GM mpg calculator on the Oil Life Monitor.

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, Basser ..I hope that you track it through the entire OCI and keep the data base updated. That is, don't stop compiling the data. At some point you will have enough to be "credible" to our skeptic members here. If the variation holds for the duration of your OCI ..then it might mean something. Even seasonal climate changes are going to impact your results somewhat ...to the point of your differences.

 

[jbas]

"An increase in mpg = less friction, less resistance, better lubriciation. All things being equal, if one oil produces better mpg, it's lubricating better."

Well, thank you, Basser, there is no need to continue BITOG. We can all just use Mobil 0W-20 which will produce "less friction, less resistance, better (sic) lubriciation" that any other motor oil. And you can now buy it at WalMart (saw it there today in fact). For all our vehicles, under all conditions. Case over. Don't know why so many oil companies produce so many other products...what dummies.

I will submit to counseling next week as well.