Most "robust" 20W50 dino...

[fuel tanker man]

What 20W50 dino (or blend, if any) is considered the sturdiest on the market?

I'm looking for a very limited amount of moly, but gobs of ZDDP, and good shear resistance.

If I could find a good group III 20W50 I could beef up the add pack with the Valvoline Syn-Power. Right?

Dan

 

[drive it forever]

The best thing going for a 20w50 with lots of zinc and no moly would be a motoycycle oil.

 

[TallPaul]

Unlike the other Synpower grades, the 20w50 MSDS shows 1-DECENE HYDROGENATED HOMOPOLYMER, 68037-01-4, 65.0- 75.0%. If you search that CAS # on this site it is said to be PAO. Mistake? Who knows, but if the Synpower 20w50 is PAO, that would be pretty decent stuff.

 

[fuel tanker man]

I would be using it in a Harley Davidson motorcycle, but the "resources" in the car forum here seem a bit richer, if you get my drift.

I just don't want to pay extra for a repackaged oil with a motorcycle on the bottle when I can get as good, or perhaps better, in the standard offerings.

Dan

 

[penzdude]

valvoline racing vr1 20-50?

 

[TomH]

Castrol GTX? That'd be my best guess.

 

[Buzzsaw]

I would look at one of the high mileage 20w50 oils.

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

---

Originally posted by fuel tanker man:
...If I could find a good group III 20W50 I could beef up the add pack with the Valvoline Syn-Power. Right?
Dan

---

If you found Valvoline Syn-Power, you found a good group III. Do they not market a 20W50?

 

[haley10]

What is the application? Are you trying to create a special motorcycle oil or something?? Need to know.

 

[Rob Taggs]

Havoline 20w-50 maybe?

 

[rugerman1]

Anyone here use PENNZOIL GT PERFORMANCE 25w-50 RACING OIL?

 

[fuel tanker man]

Rugerman,

I called the Pennzoil folks (you'll get a Shell tech these days

) about the 25W50.

It's a very sturdy oil, it seems, and it's supposedly loaded with moly. They wouldn't say how much, but the tech (and I do believe he was a genuine tech, not just some pimply-faced cardigan, argyle sock and tassled loafer wearing college kid) pointed out the horsepower gains the 25W50 Pennzoil showed in testing over other racing oils, and remarked this was owing mostly to the high moly content.

For my application, I'm a little unsure if the 25W50 racing oil would keep my engine clean in the long term.

I wish Chevron would put out a 20W50 Delo. That would solve all of my problems!

Dan

 

[JohnBrowning]

If it is in a Harley why do you car about Moly?? Moly is only an issues on motor cycles that share the oil with their transmission. Harleys have a seperate transmission. If it has to be a 20W50 I would use Cenpeco. I would actualy recomend Delo 15W40 though instead of a 20W50. Lube Control would be a huge help to a Harley!!!

 

[fuel tanker man]

The moly isn't a concern to me, but I thought I'd share the info on the 25W50 Pennzoil just for folks who may be interested.

I make a practice of not using anything I can't readily go to Wally World, Autozone, or Advance Auto and purchase off the shelf. This has admittedly narrowed my horizons.

I've just finished looking at Pennzoil's standard 20W50 data, and comparing that to Havoline 20W50. For the record, it appears that Chevron Supreme 20W50 and Havoline's 20W50 are the same product; numbers are virtually identical.

As far as being robust, the Havoline product seems to edge out the Pennzoil product; this in the normal 20W50 offerings.

Pennzoil offers a viscosity of only 17.9, which may shear early to a 40 weight. Its flash point is an advertised 418 degrees.

The Havoline 20W50, on the other hand, shows 19.0 cst @100 degrees C, so it's a thicker oil. And the Havoline's flash point is a significantly higher 482 degrees.

Both of these oils are readily available.

The Havoline indicates .094 Phosphorous, and .103 Zinc content. I don't know how this equates to ppm--can anyone convert those numbers for me? Please?

Since I'm going with 2500 mile OCI's I'm considering going with something like the Havoline product and just "tweaking" it a bit with some Valvoline Synpower, about an ounce per quart, and another ounce on any top-up which may be needed.

Any thoughts on that plan?

Edited to add:

Mobil DC 20W50 shows FP of 392, vis of 18.1 @ 100C.

Kendall GT-1 20W50 shows FP of 446, vis of 18.6, TBN of 7.5 (nearly the same TBN of the Havoline). Kendall appears to be a Conoco Phillips product. I'm sure you guys mostly all knew that, but it was news to me.

Looking like Kendall GT-1 versus Havoline 20W50 at this point...

Dan

[ February 26, 2005, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: fuel tanker man ]

 

[rugerman1]

I'm lucky to have a Pennzoil distributor locally where I can get the 25w-50 for less than $2 a quart.My Buell owners manual allows 15w-40 in certain applications.Terry has posted that he's seen certain 40 weights perform very well in Harleys.
If you want to buy at wally and don't like Pennzoil,look at the Valvoline Max Life 20w-50.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Fuel Tanker Man, Please consider Delo 15W40!!! You should at least look at it's data sheet or the VOA on this site. IF you get the CI-4+ spec. Delo it even has moly inaddition to lots of Zink!!! Most 20W50 are really pathetic in the additive department compared to modern 15W40!! I know I know you want a 20W50 but I could not help but throw in the Delo!!!!! It has been my experince with long term Castrol GTX 20W50 that it is prone to varnishing!

 

[fuel tanker man]

John,

I see what you mean about the Delo. I mentioned above I wish Delo was made in a 20W50. My concern is the 40 weight rating not being thick enough in extremely hot situations (idling in traffic on a 90 degree day, etc.) The HD Evolution engine runs really low oil pressure already; around 5 psi at idle. Now it's possible that the Delo 15W40 would do just fine, as I'm aware that low oil pressure dosen't necessarily mean low oil flow--in fact I've read the contrary, that often high oil pressure is indicative of restricted flow--and that makes sense...

I really wish Mobil hadn't discontinued the Redcap at 4 bucks a quart (when bought in 5 quart jugs at Walmart). But now that they have, I'm just stubborn enough not to take their bait (the higher priced 15W50EP or whatever they're calling it).

I may check into just how much viscosity can be improved on the Delo with some Synpower or (horrors) STP or such. I fully realize that many of the 50 weight oils shear early (the Harley Davidson 360 stuff seems notorious for this) and after doing so they'll be less effective than a relatively shear stable 15W40 such as Delo--I realize that.

However, if I can beef up the ZDDP of a conventional 20W50 (such as the Havoline) with a little additive I think I may have the robust additive package and the viscosity as well.

All this said, if I could find some compelling research into the long term feasibility of an 15W40 HDEO in the Harley Davidson evolution engine I may consider the Delo a bit more so than I am now. I just haven't seen such info as of yet.

Dan

 

[fuel tanker man]

Somebody help me out here...

I think the Havoline is a group II oil, correct? Or is it a II+?

But what about the new Kendall products? Group I, II, or what?

Thanks,

Dan

 

[Bror Jace]

I also think a very shear-stable 15W-40 is going to give you better service and a heavier, more consistent hydrodynamic film than shear-prone 20W50s.

Last I heard, Chevron-Texaco used their Group II+ base oils only in 5W-30 and 10W-30 (and probably 5W-20 as well) using 'lesser' base oils for generally obsolescent 10W-40 and 20W-50 oils ... but that info is very dated (2001).

If you buy Chevron Delo400, look for the little yellow flag on the bottle which says "new low wear formula" as I believe that signifies the new molybdenum additive package.

--- Bror Jace

 

[Racerjk]

I picked up 8 qts of Havoline 20w50 at Wal-Mart for 50 cents a piece. I also purchased 5 quarts a week or two ago for $1 a qt.

I also bought 8 qts of 50 w Valvoline VR1 Racing at 50 cents a pop also.

Phase-outs are cool.