Most Expensive Pad Slap I've Done Yet!

SwampSurvivor

SwampSurvivor

Joined
Apr 9, 2008
Messages
16,471
Location
Central NY
Sometimes you just can't win. I usually have a rule of no pad slaps. Usually I do a minimum of replacing the caliper with the pads. Here in NY, once the pistons extend, the salt spray still works its way in and as soon as you put in a new set of pads you end up with the bakes dragging all the time. Rotors -- usually I can get 4 or 5 years out of them before they need replacing.

So I bought some nice high end pads for the Subaru. Put them in after cleaning up the rotors a bit. Went for a drive. Biiiiiiiiig smoke show. Let the car cool down , verified that the pads were the correct one (I initially thought they were not). Saw that it was some rust around the edge of the rotor that was causing the pads on the LF to drag. So I took the rotors off, Wire wheeled them up, then threw them back on and went for a test drive. A little longer of a test drive.

LOTS of smoke. It got real hot. Ordered new rotors at that point ... not cheap rotors, nice coated / painted ones from Rockauto, with expedited shipping. Still cheaper than anywhere else.

Last night I went to throw the new rotors on. It got so hot, the seal on the LF unit bearing failed and let a lot of grease out. It also melted the caliper boots -- to the point that one piston doesn't even have one any more!

So , calipers are going to be around $140 plus another $10 in fluid.
Timken wheel bearing $122
 
Man that sucks.

My rust belt experience is not quite the same as yours. It's probably been 30yrs since I owned a vehicle long enough to need calipers, but rotors don't last me more than 3yrs tops. Pretty much every one of my new Subarus from 2012 on needed rear rotors and pads at 2yrs/40K miles. Some of my Nissan and FCA products needed rotors/pads all the way around by then.
 
I think the caliper situation is overkill from my experiences with the F350. It's 19 years old and has been through 9 or 10 sets of calipers, but that's a common problem on those trucks.

The rear pads on the Subaru were replaced at 25K miles earlier this year. The rotor seems to build up rust and then it just chews the pad to nothing. With the rears, I was able to get away with running the rotors under a flapdisc; not warping or shaking from them! But my old Focus had 80K on the original calipers when I got rid of it, no issues. I did grease the sliders and stuff every year.

My parents' 2013 and 2017escape gets rear rotors and pads every 18 months. And the first two sets were warrantied on both! Whatever they're using on the roads now is just terrible!
 
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Wowzer, I can't say I've had that experience. On my prior VW the rear calipers needed replacement with every pad slap, but that was every 5yr/125k, give or take. Every other vehicle has done at least one pad slap without issue. Then again, sub-100k lifespan on brake pads is a shock to me, as a rule they go longer than that, and usually fail when they start to delaminate. Maybe that is what keeps my calipers alive.

Somedays I think I could live with "mandatory" snow tires if the powers in charge would half the amount of salt they use.
 
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I hear ya. I don't know if it's what they drop all over the roads, or the auto manufacturers are just using materials or designing brakes to not last as long as they used to.
 
Probably all of the above. Shave a penny here, shave a penny there, and then they can afford to put an 14" LCD into the dashboard.
 
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still had oem calipers on 2010 accent and 2013 outback.

They use all kinds of road treatments here too.. Brine spray, salt, green "salt", calcium chloride coated etc
Its the lake effect snow belt= salt belt.

I too wish they would just require winter tires and use about 1/4 the chemicals.
 
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OP - so what was the root cause? I think it must be more than a rotor issue.

I feel the Subaru vehicles I have had recently (2015 & 2016) have brakes that seem to have more than their share of issues due to rust. And the brake pads are small in size. I recently took off all the brakes on wife's Crosstrek and cleaned & lubed all the proper surfaces. It may need that yearly in the rust belt.
 
Today you really need to pay attention to the calipers, many are aluminum with no sleeves and a prone to bore corrosion (old Corvettes were notorious for this). This tools is for me a must, you can test the caliper pressure, line pressure release reaction time, detect hanging pistons and deteriorating hoses, E brake function on calipers with them built in, etc.
If you look around it can be had for about $150, Made in USA, good quality and will easily pay for itself within a few jobs. If the OP used this he would have saved the cost already.

IMG_0532.JPG
IMG_0533.JPG
Best price anywhere I found on this..

 
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I’ve got an 2003 outback and had similar experiences with calipers up front. Btw calipers from advance auto come with Or without a coating that wears off in 500 miles that show exterior rust while my driver side came from NAPA and it is still has the black paint. I Tried to take my time and rebuild the factory calipers with seals and boots etc but one piston was stuck beyond belief on a Sunday no doubt...hence the need of the advance auto caliper. Side note the core charge on the calipers is generous At NAPA. Back calipers are original and work great fwiw.
 
supton said:
Wowzer, I can't say I've had that experience. On my prior VW the rear calipers needed replacement with every pad slap, but that was every 5yr/125k, give or take. Every other vehicle has done at least one pad slap without issue. Then again, sub-100k lifespan on brake pads is a shock to me, as a rule they go longer than that, and usually fail when they start to delaminate. Maybe that is what keeps my calipers alive.

Somedays I think I could live with "mandatory" snow tires if the powers in charge would half the amount of salt they use.
Click to expand...

Absolutely on the mandatory snow tires thing! It's $400 for a set and way cheaper than having the vehicle rust out when the state doesn't salt as bad.


Donald said:
OP - so what was the root cause? I think it must be more than a rotor issue.

I feel the Subaru vehicles I have had recently (2015 & 2016) have brakes that seem to have more than their share of issues due to rust. And the brake pads are small in size. I recently took off all the brakes on wife's Crosstrek and cleaned & lubed all the proper surfaces. It may need that yearly in the rust belt.
Click to expand...

No issues now with the new rotors. Drove it to work and both front wheels are cool to the touch!
 
I'll be Pad Slapping a 2012 Toyota Highlander front brake pads (oem) without rotors turned this weekend. Leaving the rear alone for now. It still has enough meat left. Will see how it goes.
I did my 2015 RDX two weeks a go with rotors turned and new pads, front and back. Now I have pulsation. Wasted $72 in machining cost. I'll try new rotors for the front (Callahan from Amazon $56/pair) with slightly used pads. If this doesn't solve brake pulsation, I'll cheaping out and get all new Acura parts.
 
Tundragod said:
I'll be Pad Slapping a 2012 Toyota Highlander front brake pads (oem) without rotors turned this weekend. Leaving the rear alone for now. It still has enough meat left. Will see how it goes.
I did my 2015 RDX two weeks a go with rotors turned and new pads, front and back. Now I have pulsation. Wasted $72 in machining cost. I'll try new rotors for the front (Callahan from Amazon $56/pair) with slightly used pads. If this doesn't solve brake pulsation, I'll cheaping out and get all new Acura parts.
Click to expand...
Check the rear rotors. I have noticed that a lot of techs have difficulty with machining solid rotors on bench lathes. Measure the rotor runout using the HF dial indicator.
 
Well, it did it again on the way home from work. Smoke show and all. Pulled it all apart and discovered that the rubber spring on the slider (someone else posted a picture here) had melted and jammed the slider. Took it off and now the car drives fine!
 
The Critic said:
Check the rear rotors. I have noticed that a lot of techs have difficulty with machining solid rotors on bench lathes. Measure the rotor runout using the HF dial indicator.
Click to expand...
Yep, the rear rotors. They messed up machining them or one of them. I bought the dial indicator from HF and tried to use it; curious to see how much warpage that can cause pulsation. I really tried. I couldn't get it to stay firm enough. Both rotors had about 3 mils movement. I put new rotors in the rear with the old pads (sanded smooth). No more pulsation.
 
Based on what is posted here the quality of brake sets has decreased remarkably.

Last year I had the the 240 front and rear Ate calipers rebuilt at PMB and Goldline at 165,000 and 179,000 miles. I’ve pad slapped the rear brakes on these these cars since I was 18. Not the front. Front rotors and pads every 30k. Rear pads only at 30k. Rear pads and rotors at 60k.

I bleed the fluid every year regardless of mileage.
 
Tundragod said:
Yep, the rear rotors. They messed up machining them or one of them. I bought the dial indicator from HF and tried to use it; curious to see how much warpage that can cause pulsation. I really tried. I couldn't get it to stay firm enough. Both rotors had about 3 mils movement. I put new rotors in the rear with the old pads (sanded smooth). No more pulsation.
Click to expand...
I try to clamp the vise grip onto a suspension bolt. It takes some fiddling but you will eventually get it.

I can make a video for you sometime but this is an old video I made:


Ideally, .001” or less. But definitely no more than .002”.
 
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