Attaching handouts of my presentation that was mentioned in the L'n'G interview by Tim Sullivan.
More Fuel Economy Headaches
- Thread starter buster
- Start date
Sometime after you left E-ion, didn't you design or create the oil for aproject car? I believe it was something like running the furthest on a litre of fuel? If you don't mind me asking.
Going through the presentation now, thanks.
Going through the presentation now, thanks.
I am almost positive I have read this presentation a couple weeks ago.. Someone linked me it on another site.. I'm going to search through my history to see if it was the same.. so strange! Small world! Thank you for sharing! It all seems like common sense to me!
........ & F1 engines are like pedestrian engines.
Boris has spoken.
.......And the F1 guys aren't going to let you look inside one. At least not theirs.
Yes, it was a part of Shell Eco Marathon 2010 competition. I wouldn't call it a car, though. Agilis Eco Car is a vehicle weighing just 20 kg and equipped by a tiny HCCI engine. Driven by a tiny girl pilot, this marvel is capable of doing 300 miles at 1L of gasoline! It was designed and built at Royal Institute of Technology in Stockholm.
I remember the press release. Didn't know or remember it was so tiny, wouldn't call it a car either.
Just before someone here posted about oil used by the germans in WW2. I'm sure you know, they didn't know about ZDDP yet but used something called VOLTOL. I tried to find out what that was and ended up with Elektrion and it's history. I found the white papers by you and Michel Roegiers, and the press release.
For others who are interested in ionised vegetable oils, There was a company in Belgium making it (Elektrion) but during WWI the germans relocated the machinery to Germany. I believe that became VOLTOL and a very important component in their engine oils.
Just before someone here posted about oil used by the germans in WW2. I'm sure you know, they didn't know about ZDDP yet but used something called VOLTOL. I tried to find out what that was and ended up with Elektrion and it's history. I found the white papers by you and Michel Roegiers, and the press release.
For others who are interested in ionised vegetable oils, There was a company in Belgium making it (Elektrion) but during WWI the germans relocated the machinery to Germany. I believe that became VOLTOL and a very important component in their engine oils.
Correct. Michel Roegiers, Jr., is a grandson of Elektrion co-founder, Michel Roegiers, Sr.
As known, common sense is the least common of all the senses
I visited Gent when I learned about Elektrion aswell, but when I got there they were demolishing the plant. I see however the brand still survives.
I found it very interesting as it's something unique in the oil business, and the vegetable base is definitely a plus. Superlubricity and friction modification is what is needed to go to lower fuel consumption in existing motors and vehicles.
But we also lack knowledge here about coatings and surface preparations, it would be good if you found time to share insights with that once in a while. it will be the future, especially if fuel consumption will be brought down further through lower viscosity oils.
I found it very interesting as it's something unique in the oil business, and the vegetable base is definitely a plus. Superlubricity and friction modification is what is needed to go to lower fuel consumption in existing motors and vehicles.
But we also lack knowledge here about coatings and surface preparations, it would be good if you found time to share insights with that once in a while. it will be the future, especially if fuel consumption will be brought down further through lower viscosity oils.
Yes, the old company went bankrupt. 70 years ago the Elektrion products used to be truly unique, but now there are many competing solutions available. In fact, organic friction modifiers are pretty common in today's lubricant formulations. I can share another presentation about superlubricity additives.
Excellent. The presentation led me to the bizol website aswell which has many interesting articles adressing commonly asked questions here about TBN TAN and viscosity for example. Can I refer people to them, or even better quote some paragraphs? I've been telling people to consider flash points and Noack % to help determine the base oil quality and what influence there could be on shear stability. It would be better if they can read that from an expert though and not from me...
for example: https://www.bizol.com/products/research-development/detail-view/news/viscosity-matters
for example: https://www.bizol.com/products/research-development/detail-view/news/viscosity-matters
Sure, it's a part our customer education effort. No other area has so many hypes and misconceptions as lubricants.
I'd guess I long found most articles on the website with some navigation, but next to no background seemed revealed regarding a use of "ACN PAO" and OSP in the product. Not wanting to hype, but for a few reasons on some slopes some highlighting focus could be especially interesting (albeit a distraction to ask for it in this thread). Even on such complements and base oils sharing insight can only help.
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It's actually easy: To force lubricant blenders to use synthetic base oils, many OEMs approve only 0W-xx grades - simply because it is impossible to get 0W CCS -35C with mineral oil. The cheapest PAO is PAO 4 and 6 whose PP is as low as -60 to -70C. ACN PAO - ie PAO5 and PAO7 have PP "just" -40C. They are pricier than PAO4/6 and have lower volatility and higher VI. Hence, technically, they are superior. However, a product formulated on ACN PAO will always be a niche product because of its price. In fact, one can achieve similar viscometrics even with Group III base oils, for just a fraction of price. Of course, the viscometric properties of oil have nothing to do with its performance, but how many people know what "performance" means?
Thanks for that clarification. To me it hadn't become clear what "alternative carbon number" PAO meant. Been reading up on those methyl paraffins
or capped OSP, (OSP-ester, estolides and more) and therefore thought of modifications finding their way into one oil or two. Not many ever refer to the appetizing OSPs and about this acute choice of PAO I read for the first time there.
Total and DOW in old news – OSP-enhanced oils for a manufacturer around 2018?
Did these materialize? A note from three years ago on second page: https://www.genomatica.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/02/icb-innovation-awards-shortlist.pdf
bobistheoilguy.com
or capped OSP, (OSP-ester, estolides and more) and therefore thought of modifications finding their way into one oil or two. Not many ever refer to the appetizing OSPs and about this acute choice of PAO I read for the first time there.
One can always learn something new, though newer does not necessarily means better. Fitness for purpose is often the key performance indicator. The best racing oil may fail performance requirements for street usage, while top-tier fuel saving motor oil is not necessarily the best choice for track.
His cohort, Natasha, will be next!
Boris has spoken.
Bullwinkle and his thickies have their validated reasons... they are well-represented here.
Note: the flying squirrel was an anomaly...
