Mobil1 EP 0W-20 and Mobil1 ESP X2 0W-20 for example...

wemay

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We finally have a euro oil that isn't "better" because of greater HT/HS (both are roughly 2.6). Making this, I believe, a fair comparison for discussion.

We've all read where EP is a fantastic oil because of composition (~70+% PAO) and stellar long drain intervals yet it has fewer approvals, and what many here consider, less stringent specs than the ESP X2 oil which is also highly regarded.

Both are long drain oils and POA based. Would you consider them to be on equal footing?

Regardless of what we drive, if possible to remove from equation.
 
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Depends on what we-all drive.
Your VW sees the ESP as a better fit. My GDI sees the low Calcium preference in Mobil-1 EP.

Our new Soul 2.0 MPI may benefit from either ESP, Rotella T6 Multi Vehicle or a similar Delo XSP in 5w30. No turbo or old-school GDI for the 2020 Kia Soul 2.0's
 
Originally Posted by Triple_Se7en
Depends on what we-all drive.
Your VW sees the ESP as a better fit. My GDI sees the low Calcium preference in Mobil-1 EP.

Our new Soul 2.0 MPI may benefit from either ESP, Rotella T6 Multi Vehicle or a similar Delo in 5w30. No turbo or old-school GDI for the 2020 Kia Soul 2.0's.


Hi Tripple. I edited after you posted, sorry.
 
For the price of either of these oils it makes sense to me to spend slightly more for Ravenol or Red Line. Not dissin' the M1 but if you get on a sale from Jegs or Blauparts the prices are close and the test specs are equivalent or better last I checked.
 
The ESP 0w20 is PAO, GTL and POE.
The M1 EP is PAO/AN.

From what I've seen with the ESP line, viscosity retention is very good. Some of the best Subaru WRX UOA's are from ESP 5w30.

The ESP 0w20 does meet the Porsche C20 spec, so it's definitely high quality.

https://online.lubrizol.com/relperftool/pc.html#

In a DI engine I think it's a great choice. However, for really long drains I'm not so sure.

Here is a VOA of this oil from 2018

VI 175
Moly 77
Boron 317
Mg 11
Ca 1,748
Oxidation 39.3 (ester)
 
The main difference between the two is the ZDDP content. ACEA C5 requires a 700 ppm phosphorus minimum, whereas the non-Euro Mobil 1 0W-XX varieties (excluding high-mileage and racing) are for some reason (to decrease the coefficient of friction and improve the fuel economy?) skimpy on ZDPP with 650 ppm phosphorus. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 probably has 800 ppm phosphorus, which would be 23% higher than the non-Euro M1 0W-XX oils'.

The other difference is the VII content. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 has a lower VII content, which is typical of ACEA C5 0W-20 oils, which are more focused on reducing wear than improving the fuel economy. They also tend to have a thicker base oil but M1 ESP x2 0W-20 doesn't have a particularly thick base oil for a 0W-20.

However, M1 EP 0W-20 has a PAO base oil and probably more antioxidant, which should allow longer OCI's than M1 ESP x2 0W-20.

The final difference is in the lubricity base stock. Non-Euro M1 varieties use Group V alkylated naphthalene (AN) as the lubricity base stock, whereas Euro (ESP and FS) varieties use Group V polyol ester (POE). While POE cleans better than AN, which may perhaps be useful for the European passenger-car diesel engines, it increases the engine wear as it competes with the AW/EP/FM additives, but for the 5-7% POE content used in the Euro M1 oils, the effect is small.

Given the price and availability, I think to go with M1 EP 0W-20 is no-brainer.
 
Given the choice I'd run the ESP. I made the switch over to ESP over a year ago in two of my vehicles. From what I've read and heard "imo" it is a better product.
 
Originally Posted by sloinker
For the price of either of these oils it makes sense to me to spend slightly more for Ravenol or Red Line. Not dissin' the M1 but if you get on a sale from Jegs or Blauparts the prices are close and the test specs are equivalent or better last I checked.


Not slightly more, several times more. I like Ravenol but it's overkill and I've never failed to be underwhelmed by Redline UOA's, not that I put much stock in them. But paying more for higher metal wear doesn't seem to make much sense...
 
Originally Posted by Gokhan
The main difference between the two is the ZDDP content. ACEA C5 requires a 700 ppm phosphorus minimum, whereas the non-Euro Mobil 1 0W-XX varieties (excluding high-mileage and racing) are for some reason (to decrease the coefficient of friction and improve the fuel economy?) skimpy on ZDPP with 650 ppm phosphorus. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 probably has 800 ppm phosphorus, which would be 23% higher than the non-Euro M1 0W-XX oils'.

The other difference is the VII content. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 has a lower VII content, which is typical of ACEA C5 0W-20 oils, which are more focused on reducing wear than improving the fuel economy. They also tend to have a thicker base oil but M1 ESP x2 0W-20 doesn't have a particularly thick base oil for a 0W-20.

However, M1 EP 0W-20 has a PAO base oil and probably more antioxidant, which should allow longer OCI's than M1 ESP x2 0W-20.

The final difference is in the lubricity base stock. Non-Euro M1 varieties use Group V alkylated naphthalene (AN) as the lubricity base stock, whereas Euro (ESP and FS) varieties use Group V polyol ester (POE). While POE cleans better than AN, which may perhaps be useful for the European passenger-car diesel engines, it increases the engine wear as it competes with the AW/EP/FM additives, but for the 5-7% POE content used in the Euro M1 oils, the effect is small.

Given the price and availability, I think to go with M1 EP 0W-20 is no-brainer.


Good information, thank you.
thumbsup2.gif
 
Originally Posted by Gokhan
The main difference between the two is the ZDDP content. ACEA C5 requires a 700 ppm phosphorus minimum, whereas the non-Euro Mobil 1 0W-XX varieties (excluding high-mileage and racing) are for some reason (to decrease the coefficient of friction and improve the fuel economy?) skimpy on ZDPP with 650 ppm phosphorus. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 probably has 800 ppm phosphorus, which would be 23% higher than the non-Euro M1 0W-XX oils'.

The other difference is the VII content. M1 ESP x2 0W-20 has a lower VII content, which is typical of ACEA C5 0W-20 oils, which are more focused on reducing wear than improving the fuel economy. They also tend to have a thicker base oil but M1 ESP x2 0W-20 doesn't have a particularly thick base oil for a 0W-20.

However, M1 EP 0W-20 has a PAO base oil and probably more antioxidant, which should allow longer OCI's than M1 ESP x2 0W-20.

The final difference is in the lubricity base stock. Non-Euro M1 varieties use Group V alkylated naphthalene (AN) as the lubricity base stock, whereas Euro (ESP and FS) varieties use Group V polyol ester (POE). While POE cleans better than AN, which may perhaps be useful for the European passenger-car diesel engines, it increases the engine wear as it competes with the AW/EP/FM additives, but for the 5-7% POE content used in the Euro M1 oils, the effect is small.

Given the price and availability, I think to go with M1 EP 0W-20 is no-brainer.


Thank you Gokhan...and buster. The explanation was easy to understand and makes sense. Today my "service" light went off (not the oil one but the inspection). So I took it in and realized it's just a way to get you into the dealership. Anyway, in the service bay, there was a gentleman who brought his own oil. It was M1 EP 0w20 for his GTi....they used it without hesitation. I didn't bring it up in conversation but the Tech did mouth..."great oil". That's what got me thinking.
 
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