Mobil 1: Noiser Engine = More Wear or Just More Annoying?

[Big O Dave]

My '76 C20 (2000 Vortec HD 350 w/AFR 190 Heads) now has about 5,000 miles on the engine. As it broke in I used Havoline 5W-30 and it was mechanically silent. At 3,500 miles switched to M1 5W-30 (same oil filters: PF35L) and since then I've been hearing some prominent ticking.

I've done some searches and found that there are plenty of experiences like mine, where M1 makes an engine mechanically louder.

There does not seem to be any consensus as to whether or not there is any positive correlation between the increased noise and increased wear.

So, my question is: if you are hearing more noise with M1, is there a corresponding increase in wear, or is it simply more annoying?

I guess I have a second question, too: if an oil is quieter, does that mean there's less wear?

Thanks, in advance, for all responses!

 

[buster]

M1 is on the thin side. Try using the new Mobil 1 EP. It's has more PAO and many have said it quieted down their engines. It's more annoying then anything else.

 

[TallPaul]

For now, drain off one quart and top up with Mobil 1 15w50. That'll give you a nice thick 10w30. Save the drained quart if you can for later top ups.

 

[-SyN-]

TallPaul has the idea.

When i used M1 5W-30 in the winter, I would add 1 qt of M1 15W-50. Never had the problem again.

In the summer I would use 10w-30 M1 and mix in 2 qts of 15W-50 M1. {5qt sump}. Nice Mixture.

1988 GmC 350 3/4 ton.

Now I switched to Amsoil. Don't have to worry about that problem.

Good luck.

 

[ex_MGB]

Hmmm...energy rather than being absorbed by wear and frictional losses is converted to sound?

 

[bbcmat]

You will not find an answer here - just fixes to the symptoms.

Looking at the historical wear data for Mobil 1 -it does not look like an issue that needs fixing - (IMO) - and as such is not a problem.

MAT

 

[goodvibes]

Buster, It's the second time you've said that EP has more PAO. M1 is all PAO with a bit of AN. Perhaps you mean Supersyn as in a more advanced PAO. ex_MGB, I think that if the film strength of M1 was coupling bits together better to convert the vibration energy to noise energy and therefore prevent wear, then in higher weights M1 would do so that much better but it gets quiter instead as it dampens better. It will still be louder than other oils with the same rated viscosities. I don't think the better fixing of vibrating bits to a larger mass is the mechanism of the noise increase in this case. I also don't think the noise or the high Fe is anything to worry about but in my car the noise is annoying, in my wifes it's a non-issue. ex_MGB, I see you've simplified your post as I was writing mine. I seem a bit over the top now but I'll let it stand.

 

[1sttruck]

Mobil 1 PCMO produces more engine noise, a symptom of possibly more wear and tear. It's also prone to producing more Fe in UOAs, a symptom of more wear and tear (film disruption aside). If using the stuff what evidence does one have that it's not producing more wear and tear ?

 

[Drew99GT]

quote:

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Originally posted by 1sttruck:
Mobil 1 PCMO produces more engine noise, a symptom of possibly more wear and tear. It's also prone to producing more Fe in UOAs, a symptom of more wear and tear (film disruption aside). If using the stuff what evidence does one have that it's not producing more wear and tear ?

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I tend to agree. I feel like I'm getting ripped off paying 5 bucks for Mobil 1 when it absolutely made my Grand Am sound like a diesel.

 

[MIAMI-DADE]

Tried Mobil 1 in my Caprice a few years back and the engine was making all sorts of weird sounds.Drained it out 1500 miles later and put in a semi/syn and it went right back to normal.It turned me to using any full syntheic.

Yet my neighbor had a '03 civic and mobil 1 works just fine in it with no noise at all.Trying to add a differnt grade oil to get the Mobil 1 quiet dosen't make sense to me.I think your engine is saying get the Mobil 1 outahere now.Just my opinion though.

 

[Blue99]

quote:

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Try using the new Mobil 1 EP. It has more PAO...

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Actually, I like the sound of this phrase, and I think I know what Buster was saying - more or less!

But we'll have to label this as a "Busterism".

Kinda like "It's never over till it's over" by Yogi Bera.

 

[jtn26]

I actually changed the oil on my 4runner from M1 EP to Pennzoil Platinum and suprisingly, the engine is much quieter than before.

 

[Gary Allan]

quote:

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Buster, It's the second time you've said that EP has more PAO.

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(envision crusty/dusty western type getting cranked up with an evil little smile and one of those looks in his eyes)

Let's string him up!! That'll fix `im!

Dave, what's your oil pressure reading between with the M1 compared to other oils??

 

[Eddie]

Based on 100s of UOAs of Mobil 1 I think exMGB and mbbcmat has giving the correct answer. The answer is backed up with real world data.

 

[1sttruck]

"Tried Mobil 1 in my Caprice a few years back and the engine was making all sorts of weird sounds.Drained it out 1500 miles later and put in a semi/syn and it went right back to normal.It turned me to using any full syntheic."

Delvac 1 / Mobil 1 T&S is an excellent oil. I've run across accounts of people using to solve Mobil 1 PCMO wear problems in non-pro racing.

 

[Eddie]

I remember that dealers used to put very heavy oil into worn engines to quiet them for resale. Based on that fact I suspose that a loose engine (new or worn) will sound quieter with a heavy viscosity oil.

 

[Big O Dave]

quote:

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Originally posted by Gary Allan:

Dave, what's your oil pressure reading between with the M1 compared to other oils??

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Gary, all I have is the factory oil pressure guage (and no tach), and I have a Z/28 oil pump (the one with the white spring) AND I have an eight quart Moroso oil pan... having said all that, the oil pressure hovers around 60 psi when cold (SoCal summer morning cold

) and when fully warm (it takes a LONG time) it's around 55 psi (both psi readings are at cruising speeds like 40 mph). At idle when fully warm it is 15-20 psi.

With the Havoline, it was beyond the max reading of the guage when cold, and about the same as M1 at operating temp.

[ June 23, 2005, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Big O Dave ]

 

[Gary Allan]

quote:

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Gary, all I have is the factory oil pressure guage (and no tach), and I have a Z/28 oil pump (the one with the white spring) AND I have an eight quart Moroso oil pan... having said all that, the oil pressure hovers around 60 psi when cold (SoCal summer morning cold

) and when fully warm (it takes a LONG time) it's around 55 psi (both psi readings are at cruising speeds like 40 mph). At idle when fully warm it is 15-20 psi.

With the Havoline, it was beyond the max reading of the guage when cold, and about the same as M1 at operating

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I don't know the characteristics of a Z/28 oil pump. If it subscribes to most SBC's ...then a standard volume/high pressure configuration is desirable. Since your warm pressures are about identical, there appears to be no "thin" aspect to this noise issue. You can see the big difference in cold start viscosity between the dino and the synth, since you exceed the relief's abilty to regulate the pressure.

I would be tempted to go heavier with a synth. You're getting some reduced volume on startup with the dino ...or so I reason due to the evidence that the relief is open (but can't shunt enough to regulate pressure).

 

[Big O Dave]

kcryan, I searched through the M1 FAQ's at Mobil's website and I couldn't find anything about engine noise... if you know where to look, please let me know.

Gary, you are right about the Z/28 pump; it IS standard volume/high pressure. I agree with you about getting reduced volume at startup with dino, so I'm gonna stay with some kind of syn. Maybe GC?

Thanks to EVERYONE for your replies!! I really appreciate it.

BOD

 

[TooSlick]

In any mechanism or piece of machinery, increased vibration increases the wear rate. In fact, wheel bearings on new vehicles transported on car carriers, are actually subject to a phenomenon called "fretting" wear, even when the wheels aren't turning.

If in fact this noise is coming from the valve train components and if in fact the UOA's are showing significantly higher Fe levels, then I'd say there is a strong correlation between the two.

The other way to look at this situation is pretty simple. Have you ever used a lubricant that noticably quieted down an engine and/or transmission - but resulted in significantly increased wear as evidenced by a spectrographic analysis? I'd be hard pressed to think of one....

Any sort of lubricant, attenuates the noise that is generated/transmitted by mechanical components.
Reduced NVH is typically a sign of how effective that lubricant is in performing its' function.