Mobil 1 0W30 Advanced Fuel Economy SP/GF-6A Cold Performance

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Mobil 1 AFE 0W30 (SN/GF-5) used to have an impressive MRV of 13250 @ -40C and a pour point of -50C, so I bought some, not realizing I got the newer SP/GF-6A formula. I was very surprised to find out that the new version has a pour point of only -42C (-39C according to the MSDS) and no longer lists the MRV (obviously because its horrible, as it would be measured at almost its pour point). Can a 0W30 oil really perform well in the cold with such a pour point? Wouldn't one of the many 5W30 oils with a pour point around -50C and MRV in the 10000-14000 @-35 range perform better in terms of cold starting? Or is there something I am not seeing here?
 
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Minnesota, Dakotas, Montana, Canada, Alaska are all places that a 0w is useful.

It still has to make the specs for a 0w oil. Ccs has to be less than 6,200 at -35c and MRV is less than 60,000 at -40c. But then, two more degrees less, it no longer pours. Must be a heck of a viscosity curve at that temperature.

I’m in the same boat as you. My 2016 Nissan NV says to use 5w30 and my 2016 f150 5.0l say use 5w20. Van likes to eat oil after 5,000 miles on the oil. Truck is perfect so far.
Both sit outside and truck is only one with a block heater.
Used M1 0w30 afe last winter in both and wasn’t impressed.
Switching to 0w40 castrol at least for the van. Not sure yet for the truck but might just go with 0w20 pennzoil “full synthetic”.
 

AK110

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Interesting do you live in Cananda which is about the only place that can justify that pour point?
I am in Canada. Not really in the cold parts anymore, but that might actually be making the situation worse. Used to live in the prairies, where every parking lot (almost) has a block heater outlet. Not here, so I'd like a good winter oil, for the occasional colder days.
 

AK110

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Pour point is not a reliable indicator of extreme cold-weather performance of an oil. Any oil that has a 0W winter rating will meet the requirements for that rating regardless of any other PDS typical value.

Are you starting at temperatures below -35F or so?
You're right that the CCS will likely be better in the 0w30, but I can't imagine it being much better. I've seen some specs of oil with pour points close to the MRV test temperature and they barely make the CCS and MRV spec for that oil weight. While other oils with lower pour points pass with flying colours.

-35 is rare here, but can happen.
 
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And cranking is only half the story, and it’s somewhat mitigated by a good battery. Pumpability is more important since that is what can potentially destroy the engine. This is why SAE J300 was revised.
 

AK110

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And cranking is only half the story, and it’s somewhat mitigated by a good battery. Pumpability is more important since that is what can potentially destroy the engine. This is why SAE J300 was revised.
I'm thinking that because of it's weak pour point I would expect M1 0w30 AFE to be around:

CCS 6000 @ -35 and MRV 30000 @ -40

So is that really any better than a 5W30 with:

CCS 4000 @-30 and MRV 12000 @ -35

Plus, I'd be certain that the 5w30 give me superior hot temp protection, based on other wear tests.

On top of that the 5w30
 
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Here is a screen shot of the Pennzoil Euro LX 0w30 in my Chevy 6.0 gas engine.
It shows the CCS being 5800 at -35. Like NTA said it has to be less than 6200 to meet the 0w30 specs. You can try dig up your CCS to confirm, and I’m surprised Exxon Mobil left it off their sheet.

A7628644-7CB8-435B-ABF7-AE831EBE691E.png
 
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This has already been discussed.

 

AK110

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Here is a screen shot of the Pennzoil Euro LX 0w30 in my Chevy 6.0 gas engine.
It shows the CCS being 5800 at -35. Like NTA said it has to be less than 6200 to meet the 0w30 specs. You can try did up your CCS to confirm, and I’m surprised Exxon Mobil left it off their sheet.

View attachment 77290
MRV 18900 at 11°C above pour point.
What do you think the MRV would be if the pour point was only 2°C away.
 
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MRV 18900 at 11°C above pour point.
What do you think the MRV would be if the pour point was only 2°C away.
That’s really not predictable because again, pour point isn’t directly correlated to viscosity. It’s directly correlateted to the specifics of the ASTM test which is the problem.

And what are these wear tests you mentioned?
 
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OVERKILL

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I'm thinking that because of it's weak pour point I would expect M1 0w30 AFE to be around:

CCS 6000 @ -35 and MRV 30000 @ -40

So is that really any better than a 5W30 with:

CCS 4000 @-30 and MRV 12000 @ -35

Yes, the 5w-30 would probably be around 8,000cP at -35C (doubling rule).

Also, MRV isn't necessarily linear at that point, depending on wax crystal formation, while one might expect it to double and be 24,000cP, it may not be.

That's the reason, as @kschachn noted, that CCS and MRV were adopted, because pour point did not properly predict oil performance at low temperatures.
 
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Plus, I'd be certain that the 5w30 give me superior hot temp protection, based on other wear tests.


I’d like to see those tests as well.

Both are 30 grade oils so I cannot believe there would be any discernible difference for your situation.
 
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Here is my issue with Mobile….they won’t publicize their ccs or mrv.

Cold starts at -24f just didn’t sound good last year. Of course I have nothing to compare with so I will try something different this winter. (Also on the grid now so I can use the block heater on the truck!)
Plus the Nissan started eating oil close to 4K compared to the Super Tech 20,000 mile 5w30 that is now finally getting consumed at around 6k. (Wished Walmart would publish there specs)

Last winter was my first year up here. Can get down to -40 but last year got down to -25 regularly. Talkeetna area which is not nearly as bad as the interior Alaska.
 
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You're right that the CCS will likely be better in the 0w30, but I can't imagine it being much better. I've seen some specs of oil with pour points close to the MRV test temperature and they barely make the CCS and MRV spec for that oil weight. While other oils with lower pour points pass with flying colours.

-35 is rare here, but can happen.
Jan 15, 2020. Edmonton, Alberta: -36 F, but parts of the city were below -40. This is a city of almost 1 million people. It ain’t no Old Crow, Yukon.
Go Oilers! :D

986EA4C6-06AF-42FB-91A7-26224D073981.png
 
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