Mercedes "Disquals" on M1 0/5/10 30

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Since we have seen good UOAs on some of these products anyone know why they didn't meet Mercedes 229.1 or ACEA A2 or A3? I notice a lot of xW-40s in the Mercedes listing for 229.1 and 229.3, but there are some 30Ws there.
 
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Pretty dang interesting that Mobil 1 5W-30 and 10W-30 cannot meet MB requirements. What does this mean? What are people overlooking here in VOAs and UOAs? And if Mobil 1 (in some viscosities) cannot meet MB requirements, and Mobil 1 is considered one of the best motor oils, what about all those conventional and synthetic oils under the Mobil 1? Are European motor oils that much better than American motor oils?
 
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For the most part-yes, the are. Its a little more expensive to make (engineer) a(n) Xw-30 oil that meets MB 229.1/229.3 as one of the variables it must have is an HYHS of at least 3.5 or greater. Most American Xw-30 oils do not meet this as thats not where the bulk of their customer base is. and even so, most of the MB owners are still under the brainwashed spell of changing their oil every 3K miles or 3mos. whichever comes first! So, these oils are very competent to go the 3K mile interval while the MB 229.3 rated oils can not. There are also other requirements of this spec that the ol must meet that i dont feel like going in to right now. anyone else feel like it?
 
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I have to admit that oil products in Germany are of very high quality. I was browsing the shelves of the local Super Wal-Mart in Landau, Germany, just last week and I was amazed that even their cheapy oils were at least ACEA A2 rated. Wally sold a 5 liter container of 15W-40 for 5.89 euro and also offered the full line of Pentosin oils and even had the STP oil treatment (made in the UK though). The complete shockers of this trip were the price of the STP oil treatment which sold for euro 9.98 and the price of Shell Helix Ultra 0W-40 and 5W-40 which sold for euro 17.99 and euro 21.99 PER LITRE. Of course I love going to McDonalds in Germany and getting a beer with my happy meal [Big Grin]
 
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They make STP Oil Treatment in England? It has to be better than the stuff they used to sell here! What is in the stuff, anyway?
 
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While I don't have the required oil viscosity handy, note that Mercedes-Benz AMG engines are factory-filled with M1, and M1 is recommended by name for these engines.
 

pscholte

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Depending on the model, M-B (not AMG models) first fills are: Aral SuperTronic M Elf Excellium 229.5 5W30 Fuchs Titan Supersyn SL MB HiTec Sythetic Motorenöl (DC itself) Mobil SHC Formula MB Motorex Profil M-XL Shell Helix Ultra AB Shell Helix Ultra DC 229.5 Total Quartz 229.5 5W30 Many of these are especially for MB and notice Mobil 1 is not among them
 
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quote:
Originally posted by pscholte: Depending on the model, M-B (not AMG models) first fills are: Aral SuperTronic M Elf Excellium 229.5 5W30 Fuchs Titan Supersyn SL MB HiTec Sythetic Motorenöl (DC itself) Mobil SHC Formula MB Motorex Profil M-XL Shell Helix Ultra AB Shell Helix Ultra DC 229.5 Total Quartz 229.5 5W30 Many of these are especially for MB and notice Mobil 1 is not among them
The page you got this from needs to be updated. MB is putting Mobil 1 0w40 in some of its non-AMG models. Example: in a recent road test I saw of the S600 (twin turbo V12), the Mobil 1 sticker was clearly visible under the hood in the photo of the engine bay. The AMG engines are MB's "cream of the crop" top performance engines. They are hand assembled in their own section of the plant and every single one of them gets Mobil 1 0w40 as the factory fill. Commons sense would dictate that MB is going to put what it considers to be the "best" oil available in those engines.
 
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Originally posted by Mystic: Pretty dang interesting that Mobil 1 5W-30 and 10W-30 cannot meet MB requirements. What does this mean?
What does it mean? It means nothing more than these oils are not DESIGNED to meet those specs. The base line for MB 229.3 and 229.5 is ACEA A3. All Mobil 1 Xw30 oils are designed to be A5 oils, and that's a bandwagaon that MB hasn't jumped on yet. But with the exception of the HT/HS requirements, A5 is just as tough a spec as A3.
 

JB

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Yeah, all depends on how the oil is designed. Just had a look at the spec sheet for Castrol Formula R 5W-30 (available in Australia) and for a 30 weight oil it meets: ACEA A3/B3/B4, MB 229.1 & 229.3, BMW Longlife, VW 502/505.
 
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quote:
Originally posted by FowVay: I have to admit that oil products in Germany are of very high quality. I was browsing the shelves of the local Super Wal-Mart in Landau, Germany, just last week and I was amazed that even their cheapy oils were at least ACEA A2 rated. Wally sold a 5 liter container of 15W-40 for 5.89 euro and also offered the full line of Pentosin oils and even had the STP oil treatment (made in the UK though). ....
ACEA A2-96 is a 1996 spec and the lowest spec of the lot. ACEA A1-02 is a higher spec is some regards. Here's more info from ACEA: Gasoline Sequences A1--Oil intended for use in gasoline engines specifically designed to be capable of using low friction, low viscosity oils with a High Temperature / High Shear Rate Viscosity of 2.6 to 3.5 mPa.s. These oils may be unsuitable for use in some engines. Consult owner manual or handbook if in doubt. A2--General purpose oil intended for use in most gasoline engines with normal drain intervals, although it may not be suitable for some high performance engines. A3--Stable, stay-in-grade oil intended for use in high performance gasoline engines and / or for extended drain intervals where specified by the engine manufacturer, and / or for year-round use of low viscosity oils, and/or for severe operating conditions as defined by the engine manufacturer. A4--Reserved for future use for gasoline direct injection engines. A5--Stable, stay-in-grade oil intended for use at extended drain intervals in high performance gasoline engines designed to be capable of using low friction, low viscosity oils with a HT/HS of 2.9 to 3.5 mPa.s. These oils may be unsuitable for use in some engines. Consult owner manual or handbook if in doubt. --end quote-- So, European oils are made more expensively to a higher spec when needed, A5 is the tough energy conserving spec, A3 is the toughest spec, and Mobil 1 0W-40 and 15W-40 are different formulations than the Mobil 1 xW-30 line of oils, not just different viscosities. Roughly speaking, ACEA A2-96 oil probably compares to the lowest quality API-SL oil on our shelves, with ACEA A1-02 comparing to API-SL "energy conserving" oil. Ken
 
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Anyone who thinks MB Disqualification is a plus these days. Who would give much creatability to a car company who quality has slipped from the top to almost the bottom in 20 years. Very sad but a Mercedes Benz spec doesn't mean anything anymore. Just my humble opinion.
 
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Originally posted by TR3-2001SE: Anyone who thinks MB Disqualification is a plus these days. Who would give much creatability to a car company who quality has slipped from the top to almost the bottom in 20 years.
What are you basing that opinion on?
 
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quote:
Originally posted by TR3-2001SE: Anyone who thinks MB Disqualification is a plus these days. Who would give much creatability to a car company who quality has slipped from the top to almost the bottom in 20 years. Very sad but a Mercedes Benz spec doesn't mean anything anymore. Just my humble opinion.
My last 3 Mercedes have decreased in quality and reliability. My last ( 1997 factory order ) had to have the following items replaced under waranty in the first 4 years. Power steering box. Front crank oil seal ( 4 times till they got it to stop leaking ) All oil seals in rear end. Climate controll computer. Auto trans valve body ( 3 times under waranty ) The trans finally blew up at 60,000 miles and needed replacing out of waranty. The rear end started wining. Now ten years ago, Mercedes would have looked after these sort of problems with great concern. Today they don't rally care and never batted an eyelid when they quoted me $4,700 for the transmission. I use Mobil 1 0w-40 in my new car because I like it , not because Mercedes gets it from Mobil cheap.
 
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If JD Power has any credibility, check out their results that show M-B quality as being pretty dismal. The lates results show M-B even worse than Chevy for long-term dependability.
 
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In a nutshell, M-B specs first need to be A3 oils and then have specs referring to fuel economy requirements and then drain interval requirments. And A5 doesn't cut it not are they part of any M-B spec. That's why the post was correct, the 0-40 is an entirely different formulation and light years ahead of the 0-30/5-30/10-30 lineup. Unless your referring to the European Mobil lineup eg. Euro M-1 0-30. As far as quality, German cars are not Japanese "kitchen appliances"...but, if you need to have thngs replaced 3 times or rear end is wining and leaking because of the incorrect fluid used...I think you need a new garage/mechanic...and I've seen all kinds of garbage work out there....dealer or otherwise.
 
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I think you need a new garage/mechanic...and I've seen all kinds of garbage work out there....dealer or otherwise.
I couldn't agree more on that. All the problems with my car (Audi A4), were caused by poor or incompetent maintenance by a dealer/independent shop. Ever since I've been doing this stuff myself, I haven't had any problems. That incudes fixing the stuff the dealer and independent mechanic couldn't (or didn't want to) fix. [Mad]
 
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