"Meets and Exceeds". Let's look at QS for a minute.

[wemay]

Here's Quaker State's newly labeled QSFS motor oil. If you didn't look at the donut, you'd only see "Meets or exceeds the requirements of ILSAC GF-6, API SP and all previous categories".
Same goes for the Manufacturer Specification where the title to that boxed subsection reads, "Formulated to meet or exceed".

Now, if this were Amsoil, Royal Purple, Schaeffers, or Redline etc................

 

[Quattro Pete]

Now, if this were Amsoil, Royal Purple, Schaeffers, or Redline etc................

Yeah, and the TDS is even more confusing:

So, which one is an approval and which one is just a recommendation?

 

[rob1715]

QS is good stuff and I would have no issues using it.

 

[wemay]

QS is good stuff and I would have no issues using it.

Agreed, and neither would we. That's really not in question here.

 

[Kuato]

Here's Quaker States newly labeled QSFS motor oil. If you didn't look at the donut, you'd only see "Meets or exceeds the requirements of ILSAC GF-6, API SP and all previous categories".
Same goes for the Manufacturer Specification where the title to that boxed subsection reads, "Formulated to meet or exceed".

Now, if this were Amsoil, Royal Purple, Schaeffers, or Redline etc................

View attachment 49994

LOL yup if anything not off the shelf that didn't pay for a certification, there would be an anti-xxxx oil party.

 

[Passport1]

What's the flap about? Just like this stuff 'meets and exceeds' the requirements for my pancakes and waffles. Use it and forget it.

 

[kschachn]

Yeah, and the TDS is even more confusing:

View attachment 50002

So, which one is an approval and which one is just a recommendation?

If I’m not mistaken none of those are approvals. Some are licenses and some are specifications.

 

[OilReport99]

Here's Quaker State's newly labeled QSFS motor oil. If you didn't look at the donut, you'd only see "Meets or exceeds the requirements of ILSAC GF-6, API SP and all previous categories".
Same goes for the Manufacturer Specification where the title to that boxed subsection reads, "Formulated to meet or exceed".

Now, if this were Amsoil, Royal Purple, Schaeffers, or Redline etc................

View attachment 49994

What’s your question?

 

[Propflux01]

Yeah, and the TDS is even more confusing:

View attachment 50002

So, which one is an approval and which one is just a recommendation?

Here is my take:
Approved
Approved
Approved

Exceeds SN PLUS, is recommended and approved for all previous categories
Exceeds..

 

[sloinker]

 

[kstanf150]

View attachment 50012

The boutique oils like Redline exceed the base qualifications like QS, Pennzoil and several others
Don’t confuse quality with quantity !

 

[2EHA]

all the manufacturer approvals are legitimate

 

[kschachn]

all the manufacturer approvals are legitimate

Of which there are none. So yes your statement is correct.

 

[wemay]

If I’m not mistaken none of those are approvals. Some are licenses and some are specifications.

Yes, and it's "formulated to meet or exceed" them. The point being that many of us (me included) are quick to critique boutiques for this language when even the majors use it liberally.

 

[kschachn]

Yes, and it's "formulated to meet or exceed" them. The point being that many of us (me included) are quick to critique boutiques for this language when even the majors use it liberally.

Meets or exceeds is correct language for each item on that container except perhaps for the dexos license. But there they give the license number so that is hardly something to condemn them for. Isn't the proper dexos logo also on the front? If so then I wouldn't even criticize the way it's listed on the back. That was my point about language, meets or exceeds isn't appropriate for approvals but this oil has no approvals.

It's unfortunate this seems too complicated for people to understand but I don't see how we have a big mess here. If you want a big mess there are other examples that are a whole lot more messy. You can find them.

 

[zrxkawboy]

It has the donut, and the Dexos license number, so it's not like QS is asking us to just take their word for it.

 

[wemay]

@kschachn
In my opinion "meets or exceeds" has the same meaning regardless if it's approvals or certifications for the average shopper. If you want to be clear with the consumer there's better language than this. You cannot expect the average Joe to understand the distinction you made.

 

[kstanf150]

Meets or exceeds is correct language for each item on that container except perhaps for the dexos license. But there they give the license number so that is hardly something to condemn them for. Isn't the proper dexos logo also on the front? If so then I wouldn't even criticize the way it's listed on the back. That was my point about language, meets or exceeds isn't appropriate for approvals but this oil has no approvals.

It's unfortunate this seems too complicated for people to understand but I don't see how we have a big mess here. If you want a big mess there are other examples that are a whole lot more messy. You can find them.

Meets or exceeds ??

I’ll go with exceeds everyday of the week
Why do you think Redline is still around making a profit since 1979.
They offer a **** GOOD PRODUCT !!!!!
Or they’d be out of business by now !

 

[bbhero]

I take it like this... Say API SP still has the 15 percent noack limit on it.

And say the full synthetic QS oil is at 11.4 percent. Then it exceeds it by being less than that API standard quite obviously. So that language is correct.

 

[kschachn]

@kschachn
In my opinion "meets or exceeds" has the same meaning regardless if it's approvals or certifications for the average shopper. If you want to be clear with the consumer there's better language than this. You cannot expect the average Joe to understand the distinction you made.

That's not how it works. But I guess that is part of the confusion.

Actually there already is good language but it's just that some blenders chose to obfuscate things to their benefit. But that's not what's going on here. Go look at how ExxonMobil lists their approvals, specifications and licenses. They do a good job.