Maine's requiring VIN etching onto catalytic converters

The news story says it “ can prevent their theft” but really it just helps if the perps are stopped by the cops suspicious of why these guys have cats in their trunk or back of a truck.
And a lot of stolen cats being brought to the recyclers with big grind marks in them where the VIN was engraved, lol.
 
The news story says it “ can prevent their theft”
Their logic behind that is probably that the thief will see the VIN etching and move on when in reality, they're crawling under cars at night, in the dark, and hacking them off as quickly as possible. Maybe those cats will end up in a garbage can once the thief sees the VIN but I even doubt that. They'll grind it off, weld a bead over it, something...
 
Make it a law that cats can only be brought and sold to the state for recycling, where stringent rules are followed to verify the source of the cat and who's bringing it in
What state does recycling?
Who wants another government appointed official getting his palm greased for turning his head?
Bigger government is not the solution.
Let's just enforce the laws that we already have and fund the police sufficiently to do it!
 
Yep. Just more potential evidence for the prosecutors. Why do the cats in your possession have fresh grind marks on them?
What evidence? If the answer is “I don’t know why” and there is no evidence of them physically removing the markings, like witness testimony, video footage etc. then what exactly can the prosecutors do besides throwing speculations/accusations? And without the markings, they cannot be tied to any specific vehicle.

Or are we starting to move in the direction of “guilty until proven innocent”?
 
What evidence? If the answer is “I don’t know why” and there is no evidence of them physically removing the markings, like witness testimony, video footage etc. then what exactly can the prosecutors do besides throwing speculations/accusations? And without the markings, they cannot be tied to any specific vehicle.

Or are we starting to move in the direction of “guilty until proven innocent”?
We all know perps get sloppy. Nothing is perfect. They may miss a few and that is the start for the prosecution. The alternative is to do nothing.
 
We all know perps get sloppy. Nothing is perfect. They may miss a few and that is the start for the prosecution. The alternative is to do nothing.
You mean like police get lazy and sloppy in their work? So now we pass a law that is supposed to make police work easier and hinges on the criminals being sloppy to be somewhat effective.

No, the alternative is do start doing actual detective and police work, the stuff they get paid by us to do. So that’s where the pressure, funding should go to.

Passing more laws for something that is already covered by law, is simply put wasteful and stupid. But that seems to be the solution to everything these days, just keep passing more laws.
 
What state does recycling?
Who wants another government appointed official getting his palm greased for turning his head?
Bigger government is not the solution.
Let's just enforce the laws that we already have and fund the police sufficiently to do it!
At least come down hard on the recyclers if they don't follow some stringent laws or rules to stop criminals from trying to recycle stolen cats. If criminals know they can't recycle cats without some solid proof it's not stolen, then they won't steal cats. If metal recycling places are taking in cats that can't be verified legitimate (not stolen), then they get penalized hard. People stop doing crime when penalties are big. Half the problem is crooked money hungry recyclers turning their heads and taking in stolen cats.
 
What evidence? If the answer is “I don’t know why” and there is no evidence of them physically removing the markings, like witness testimony, video footage etc. then what exactly can the prosecutors do besides throwing speculations/accusations?
Law/rule for recyclers to not accept any cats with obvious grinder marks that could be from removing any kind of ID markings ... see grinding marks, sorry can't take it in for recycling. And to report anyone bringing in such a cat to police on the spot. If thieves knew that would happen when they brought ground off ID cats in, then they wouldn't.

Of course it wouldn't stop thieves from stealing some of them since they probably wouldn't see any engraved ID markings while sawing them off in the dark, and not seeing engraving until getting them home. Guess the thieves would have to find some other crooked way to sell them.
 
All these stupid laws getting put in place yet I've never seen/heard/read about a law that restricts or forbids the PURCHASE of catalytic converters, at least not without certain conditions being met.
 
Law/rule for recyclers to not accept any cats with obvious grinder marks that could be from removing any kind of ID markings ... see grinding marks, sorry can't take it in for recycling. And to report anyone bringing in such a cat to police on the spot. If thieves knew that would happen when they brought ground off ID cats in, then they wouldn't.

Of course it wouldn't stop thieves from stealing some of them since they probably wouldn't see any engraved ID markings while sawing them off in the dark, and not seeing engraving until getting them home. Guess the thieves would have to find some other crooked way to sell them.
Say what? How could you even make “obvious grinder marks” a law? What would be a precise definition of that? How would an officer of law determine what is “obvious grinder marks” vs road rash, vs a welding repair?
What would stop a competing recycler with some connections to shut down their competitions based on such a law?

That’s how draconian laws get started, all with good intentions, but no details or thought for possible side effects.
 
Manufacturers etch VIN into cat. VIN on cat matches the vehicle registration. Owner has photo ID matching registration.
Nobody but the vehicle owner can get money for recycling their cat. I think this will discourage thieves significantly.
 
What evidence? If the answer is “I don’t know why” and there is no evidence of them physically removing the markings, like witness testimony, video footage etc. then what exactly can the prosecutors do besides throwing speculations/accusations? And without the markings, they cannot be tied to any specific vehicle.

Or are we starting to move in the direction of “guilty until proven innocent”?
Possession of stolen property. If someone is transporting drugs and the response by the driver is "I don't know why my spare tire is full of cocaine" do you think LEO's just let them go?
 
Manufacturers etch VIN into cat. VIN on cat matches the vehicle registration. Owner has photo ID matching registration.
Nobody but the vehicle owner can get money for recycling their cat. I think this will discourage thieves significantly.
The problem is recyclers (foreign/domestic) who couldn't care less about where their product comes from.

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/11/feds-bust-nationwide-545m-catalytic-converter-theft-scheme-with-nj-ties-officials-say.html#:~:text=A New Jersey business knowingly,the alleged nationwide criminal enterprise.

I suppose catalytic converter theft is viewed as a victimless crime under the assumption that insurance will pay for the replacement.
 
At least come down hard on the recyclers if they don't follow some stringent laws or rules to stop criminals from trying to recycle stolen cats. If criminals know they can't recycle cats without some solid proof it's not stolen, then they won't steal cats. If metal recycling places are taking in cats that can't be verified legitimate (not stolen), then they get penalized hard. People stop doing crime when penalties are big. Half the problem is crooked money hungry recyclers turning their heads and taking in stolen cats.

The trouble is that you have large players that have the means and channels to fence this stuff,
The 13 year old thugs doing the deeds are just stupid patsy’s getting a buck, it’s those up a couple levels higher sending them about that are eventually paying for the goods we need to catch because they actually know what they are doing and likely don’t send their stuff through normal channels.
 
The problem is recyclers (foreign/domestic) who couldn't care less about where their product comes from.

https://www.nj.com/news/2022/11/feds-bust-nationwide-545m-catalytic-converter-theft-scheme-with-nj-ties-officials-say.html#:~:text=A New Jersey business knowingly,the alleged nationwide criminal enterprise.

I suppose catalytic converter theft is viewed as a victimless crime under the assumption that insurance will pay for the replacement.
Surely you are right, many view cat theft as a victimless crime. But everyone responsible enough to pay for insurance will pay for the cost of this crime through higher premiums. Insurance companies are in business to make money and they do very, very well.
 
Say what? How could you even make “obvious grinder marks” a law? What would be a precise definition of that? How would an officer of law determine what is “obvious grinder marks” vs road rash, vs a welding repair?
What would stop a competing recycler with some connections to shut down their competitions based on such a law?

That’s how draconian laws get started, all with good intentions, but no details or thought for possible side effects.
It would be required law/rule for recyclers to look for evidence of ground off ID markings. If they think someone ground the ID off, then they say "sorry, can't take this cat" and report anyone trying to move such a cat. Engraved ID markings are not going to be put on top of any existing welds. etc. I think anybody at a recycling center could tell if there were some obvious ground off engraved ID markings.

What's your ideas for preventing criminals bringing stolen cats to crooked recyclers? The recyclers need to have some laws/rules to follow in order to control that side of the equation too.
 
The problem is recyclers (foreign/domestic) who couldn't care less about where their product comes from.
That's why there needs to be some strict rules/laws for money hungry recyclers. If they get caught moving known stolen cats, they get penalized in order to make them think hard about enabling cat thieves.
 
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