M1 V-Twin 20W50

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
May 1, 2003
Messages
9,448
Location
USA
I noticed it has a flash point of 510F ! This is really high. Is this just a product of the viscosity or are other base stocks at work here. THis is the highest flash point I have seen so far for M1 products or any other oil for that matter. Any idea how this would do in a car?
 
JB,

How much is it worth it for you to know...?
wink.gif


Generally a FP of at least 475F means it has a fair amount of ester in the formulation, either diester or polyol-ester ....Way back in the late 1970's the FP of the original Amsoil 20w-50 was up in the 500F range, with their diester formulation. This oil could be 100% diester or perhaps 30% PE like the Redline stuff is. Most likely the latter, I'd suspect ....

BTW, there is not an exact correlation between FP and Noack volatility, as the vaporized esters seem to be harder to light than vaporized PAO fluids. Take a look at the FP's and Noacks for the range of Redline fluids and compare them to the latest Amsoil specs.

..................Flash Point .....Noack Volatility

Amsoil 5w-30: 442F ...............5.1% (from 3/03)
Redline 5w-30: 480F...............6.0%

The particular type of additive chemistry also profoundly influences both these properties. Some of the low vis "carrier oils" for the additive package seem to burn pretty easily ....


Tooslick
Dixie Synthetics
(256) 681-3590

[ January 11, 2004, 08:25 AM: Message edited by: TooSlick ]
 
Just an observation-conventional petroleum oils, particularly monogrades in the higher viscosities, can have high flash points as well, for example, Delvac 1350 with a flash point of 290C or 554F.

Typical Properties

Mobil Delvac 1300 Monogrades
Mobil Delvac 1330
Mobil Delvac 1340
Mobil Delvac 1350
SAE Grade 30 40 50
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40ºC 90 132 202
cSt @ 100ºC 11.5 14.7 19.5
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 117 112 110
Sulfated Ash, wt%, ASTM D 874 1.4 1.4 1.4
Total Base #, mg KOH/g, ASTM D 2896 12 12 12
Pour Point, ºC, ASTM D 97 -30 -21 -18
Flash Point, ºC, ASTM D 92 250 256 290
Density @ 15ºC kg/l, ASTM D 4052 0.889 0.892 0.896
 
Thanks TooSlick. I tried searching the V-Twin oil but did not find much. I might have to try this oil my Camry this summer and see how she does!! I was guessing that it must have some additional esters in the base stock. Nice to know I am not the only one.

AV8R, I know that high vis mongrades have some high flash points but this is not a mono grade. Good point though.

AV8R, Like the handle. What type of equipment are you flying?
 
Comparing PDS and MSDS I noticed that high Flash Point does not always mean high Coking Point.
Sometimes the oil with a non impressive Flash Point (210-220 C) have 20-30 C higher Coking Point then another oil with Flash Point of 230-250 C. Monograde oils is an example. Anybody knows the reason and would clarify the issue ?
 
I've used the M1VTwin 20W-50 as a summer oil in a '74 Triumph TR6 (40K miles, spin-on filter conversion) and haven't had any problems. I also us the M1 MX4T 10W-40 as a Spring-Fall and hibernate for Winter oil.

I haven't had any problems, but this car only does 1-2K miles/year.

I chose these as I wanted a quality synthetic in the original recommended weights, though I have used M1 15W-50 on occasion. They also advertise as being engineered to protect stored engines...but I am sure all oils do to some extent.

The only concern I'd have is catalyst compatibality as these m/c oils are supposed to have higher phosphorus and other additive levels that could affect cat activity. I can't say much more about that, only rumors...but it was on the 'net so it must be true!
dunno.gif
Anyone have any thoughts on that?

Best luck! Regards
 
quote:

Originally posted by AV8R:
Just an observation-conventional petroleum oils, particularly monogrades in the higher viscosities, can have high flash points as well, for example, Delvac 1350 with a flash point of 290C or 554F.

Typical Properties

Mobil Delvac 1300 Monogrades
Mobil Delvac 1330
Mobil Delvac 1340
Mobil Delvac 1350
SAE Grade 30 40 50
Viscosity, ASTM D 445
cSt @ 40ºC 90 132 202
cSt @ 100ºC 11.5 14.7 19.5
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 117 112 110
Sulfated Ash, wt%, ASTM D 874 1.4 1.4 1.4
Total Base #, mg KOH/g, ASTM D 2896 12 12 12
Pour Point, ºC, ASTM D 97 -30 -21 -18
Flash Point, ºC, ASTM D 92 250 256 290
Density @ 15ºC kg/l, ASTM D 4052 0.889 0.892 0.896


AV8R,
I want the U.S. Delvac 1330 down here. we get a V.I. of 95, flash point of 218, pour point of -18, and a TBN of ">10".
 
quote:

Originally posted by TooSlick:


30% PE like the Redline stuff is.

Tooslick
Dixie Synthetics
(256) 681-3590


TooSlick-

How did you find this out? Dave is tight lipped about Red Line's formulation. Oil analysis doesn't show us much either due to calibration issues. Just want to know how you got 30% PE.

THX.
 
JohnBrowning, thanks, PA-32-300T; by the way, I didn't assume this was infomation new to anyone, just thought it interesting, but then I find all this stuff interesting. Also interesting is the fairly high correlation I have observed between flash points and iron (negative, of course) in piston aircraft engines using mineral oils with organic dispersants, no Zn, P, or Ca. Going from SAE 50 to 40 seems to increase Fe about 25%, going to multigrade doubles it. I'm really tempted to try Delvac 1350 for a few hours.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top