K&N micron filtration info conveniently "not available"?

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Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Pinoak, I think based on your responses, we've finally determined the perfect filter for you: a spin-on remote adapter with two hose barbs and a 6" length of hose, since you don't care about filtration.

OP, I avoid K&N because they cost about 3 times what they're worth, especially considering there's no info available.

ly time I bought a K&N was when it was on clearance for $1.50 instead of regular $12.97 price, and that was just so 53' Stude could chop it open!

Not true, I think filtration is necessary to the extent the manufacturers, that spends millions and millions to test, determines it is. The rest is just marketing and babble. They've actually got so many like yourself focused so intensly on numbers that you will choose cheap flimsy cans, cheap flimsy leaf springs, cheap flimsy center tubes even cheap flimsy media and end caps over much better constructed options because of a belief you have bought into. At least they leave you with a smile on your face believing you got a good deal lol
 
Got the links to those OEM filtering specs and all the car manufacturer"s R&D testing results of engine wear vs filtering performance and what their targets are? Obviously there are plenty of SAE type engineering studies of that being done over the years, but where are all the engine manufactures specs and test reports?

Car manufactures also spec thinner and thinner oil for the sake of CAFE credits, and at the expense of admittingly accepting some added engine wear. I wouldn't trust the car manufacturers to have maximum vehicle longevity as their main focus.
 
Originally Posted by Al
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https://www.machinerylubrication.com/Read/30697/choose-oil-filter

Ah yes .... data from the infamous GM filter study ....
What a piece of garbage; has the same half-life of a cockroach after a nuclear event. This attraction to this "study" just won't die.

Just so we're clear here:
- the study was done decades ago in a lab HALT
- the study purposely eliminated OCIs as a controlling factor in sump contamination
- the "wear data" was generated at an equivalent exposure of 570k miles (five-hundred-seventy-thousand) for one OCI
- the oil filters were only changed after they blinded off with a dP of 20 psi
- the study admitted that "normal" field data would never show such a disparity in filtration effects; this is because sumps never get that dirty

If you only change your oil once every 570k miles, and only change filters if they are blinded off at 20 psid, then that "study" has merit to you.
I, for one, don't treat my equipment in such a manner.
 
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Originally Posted by kschachn
Originally Posted by Pinoak
No offense taken. It is preferable that they provide that info to me but I'm not as sold into the efficiency marketing as some people are.
I do appreciate a well mad filter. If it meets or exceeds oe specs, I don't see a real issue.

That part you don't know. Do they meet or exceed the OEM requirement for filtering efficiency?
Using the one known data point for oem efficiencies, for some like the Asian filters, meeting or exceeding wouldn't be difficult. In fact some of the OFs that are frequently flogged here for their published rating, in the same ballpark now.

If there's going to be a demand for a published rating and/or with a standard micron level, should start with the OEMs. However, I'd say the chances of that are slim and none. One would think if it was that important, they would/should lead way.
21.gif


As for topic K&N, seems for spin on at least they are back to being made in the US by Champ Labs. That's a good thing imo. They used to be compared the M1 filters with the saying that M1 favored filtration, while K&N favored flow. At least that was the how the scuttlebutt went before K&N went off shore.

I would agree with the comment, if don't like K&N response or lack of info, simply use something else. While I don't use K&N, I'd be more inclined now to use thier OFs than their AFs. After seeing post use pics of air intake and throttle body area on the AF board, pass on the latter. That and don't want to have do any more than simply replace an AF.
 
Originally Posted by Pinoak
They've actually got so many like yourself focused so intensly on numbers that you will choose cheap flimsy cans, cheap flimsy leaf springs, cheap flimsy center tubes even cheap flimsy media and end caps over much better constructed options because of a belief you have bought into.


I don't see any of that stuff on the filters I use:
What's your babble now, Pinoak?
 
What other OEM filters beside Motorcraft claim that they meet USCAR36 filter testing specs? If an aftermarket filter maker claims their filter "meets OEM specs", and OEM filters are supposedly claiming they meet USCAR36, then wouldn't that mean the aftermarket filter should also meet USCAR36. Wonder what K&N would have said if they were asked if their filters meets USCAR36?
 
Originally Posted by RF Overlord
Originally Posted by Pinoak
Made in the USA again by champion labs.
Can you share where you got this info? I know they were made by Champion a number of years ago, but last I heard they were being made in Korea and Mexico...

Yeah what you said is true but they're back now.
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Originally Posted by Pinoak
Originally Posted by RF Overlord
Originally Posted by Pinoak
Made in the USA again by champion labs.
Can you share where you got this info? I know they were made by Champion a number of years ago, but last I heard they were being made in Korea and Mexico...

Yeah what you said is true but they're back now.
[Linked Image]






That label should say Made for K&N. It's a bit deceiving how it's worded.
 
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:
1. less than $4, which will comprise of clearance or off-brand filters, and if you're buying these you're only concerned about price, not performance
2. $4-8, which hits most of the major players in the cellulose or "enhanced" media category, usually silicone ADBVs, and usually deliver 95-98%@around 25 microns
3. $8+, which gets you synthetic media almost always, wire backing, almost always silicone ADBVs, and most of them deliver 99%+ at 20 microns.

IMHO, if you're spending $12 or more, you're literally just paying for the name, because at the $7.99-$9.42 range you've got a filter that performs better than any of the $12 filters.
 
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:
1. less than $4, which will comprise of clearance or off-brand filters, and if you're buying these you're only concerned about price, not performance
2. $4-8, which hits most of the major players in the cellulose or "enhanced" media category, usually silicone ADBVs, and usually deliver 95-98%@around 25 microns
3. $8+, which gets you synthetic media almost always, wire backing, almost always silicone ADBVs, and most of them deliver 99%+ at 20 microns.

IMHO, if you're spending $12 or more, you're literally just paying for the name, because at the $7.99-$9.42 range you've got a filter that performs better than any of the $12 filters.


THIS!
 
Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:
1. less than $4, which will comprise of clearance or off-brand filters, and if you're buying these you're only concerned about price, not performance
2. $4-8, which hits most of the major players in the cellulose or "enhanced" media category, usually silicone ADBVs, and usually deliver 95-98%@around 25 microns
3. $8+, which gets you synthetic media almost always, wire backing, almost always silicone ADBVs, and most of them deliver 99%+ at 20 microns.

IMHO, if you're spending $12 or more, you're literally just paying for the name, because at the $7.99-$9.42 range you've got a filter that performs better than any of the $12 filters.


THIS!



+1 I agree... That ^^^^^^^^^^^
lol.gif
 
Originally Posted by JohnnyJohnson
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:
1. less than $4, which will comprise of clearance or off-brand filters, and if you're buying these you're only concerned about price, not performance
2. $4-8, which hits most of the major players in the cellulose or "enhanced" media category, usually silicone ADBVs, and usually deliver 95-98%@around 25 microns
3. $8+, which gets you synthetic media almost always, wire backing, almost always silicone ADBVs, and most of them deliver 99%+ at 20 microns.

IMHO, if you're spending $12 or more, you're literally just paying for the name, because at the $7.99-$9.42 range you've got a filter that performs better than any of the $12 filters.


THIS!

I agree. Look at these ridiculously overpriced filters. Does the pink dye cost alot or something lol

[Linked Image]
 
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It helps to read the post before replying, Pinoak. It helps prevent people from correctly assuming you've got an axe to grind:

Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:


Thank you, try again.
 
Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
It helps to read the post before replying, Pinoak. It helps prevent people from correctly assuming you've got an axe to grind:

Originally Posted by SubieRubyRoo
Maybe they're saying the label is made in USA? Either way, they are still overpriced and don't share specs.

The way I see it, there are about 3 tiers to spin-on oil filters:


Thank you, try again.

Uh huh don't even know when your eating your words di ya?
 
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