Is letting the engine idle to cool turbo necessary anymore?

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Coking was primarily an issue with conventional oils, today I do not believe that is an issue if synthetics are used.

I had a twin turbo a few yearsa ago and never bothered to let it idle prior to shut down. But that was my experience
 
Originally Posted By: NoNameJoe

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Curious as to what Passenger Car or light truck have turbo with its own oil and reservoir?

Yup I'm interested in learning myself. I only know of superchargers that have their own oil supply and their own prescribed oil, which makes sense because they don't get as hot, but most turbos I'm aware of come with oil supply and return lines that work with the main oil supply for the rest of the engine.


Not used in any way in an OE application, but Comp Turbo makes a number of oil-less turbos. They're still water cooled, but they use a grease in the center housing instead of oil. The turbo actually has a zerk fitting on it. These aren't little turbos either. Their biggest is a Garret GTX5533R equivalent, good for applications nearing 2,000 HP.

http://compturbo.com/spotlights/oil-less
 
Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
Originally Posted By: NoNameJoe
Curious as to what Passenger Car or light truck have turbo with its own oil and reservoir?

The Porsche Mezger engines have turbos with their own oil tanks to prevent starvation in hard cornering. An oil change consists of four plugs. Sump, tank, left turbo, and right turbo.


It might have its own oil tank but its sharing the engine oil?

Some sort of modified? sump type system with 2 scavenge pumps?

Sounds like a a fairly bizarre race engine setup.
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet
If your drive into the neighborhood is slow, then just shut it off.

If however, you arrive at work in a blaze of turbocharged glory, 100MPH down the perimeter road, to zero in a few seconds, while sliding into your parking spot, then it might be a good idea to let it idle for a bit.

Of course, that idle time gives others a good sized window to find you and chew you out.....relating this for a friend....


Kind of extreme, but a good point, and similar to one I use when people ask me for my opinion on the matter. I'd wager the number of oil-cooled-only turbo-charged vehicles on the road is minuscule. If it's water cooled, then anything short of rallying your car to work, sliding into your spot warrants no cool-down time.

The water will naturally circulate through the turbo to continue to cool it. It's not a nuclear reactor; there is no more heat being generated once the engine is shut down.

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: skyactiv
My wifes Audi and my VW use an electric auxiliary water pump.

My Audi had the same deal, along with blowing air across the injector assembly after shut down when hot.


Makes me wonder if the turbo placement doesn't allow for sufficient natural circulation of coolant. There needs to be a certain height differential between the heat source (engine and/or turbo) and the heat sink (radiator or heat exchanger).

For my previous turbo Subies, it would take some really aggressive driving and then a quick shut-down for any sort of flow noise to be heard under the hood. This happened only really when I would drive to places like the Gunks in NY, where the trail head is right off a very steep roadway. Otherwise, the time to cool-down is exactly 0.000 seconds.

//

Cool-down for your average N/A commuter car!? Absurd. Do what you makes you feel good; however, no one reading this thread should think that any sort of cool-down is required. On the contrary, I've found that soon after stopping the vehicle after a hard drive, the fans stay on nearly constantly to control coolant temps. Stop those mini explosions and the temps go down a lot quicker than by idling and letting the fans run.
 
This is what the owners manual says about idiling for my 2015 RAM 1500 Ecodiesel:


So I guess as far as FCA is concerned idiling to cool a turbo IS still required.
 
After FULL LOAD operation, not normal operation. Are you normally at full chat right before you park?

The manual also says that excessive idling is no bueno. Idling around town and then idling for 5 minutes is just redundant and wasteful.
 
Fortunately most of us don’t live on an interstate exit ramp … so a couple side streets going home, or searching for a parking place in town … should deal with this without any waste …
 
Not necessary. Modern turbo engines are water and oil cooled. At very least coolant and sometimes oil continue to flow by natural but designed convection.
 
Both my Focus 1.0 EcoBoost and MINI Cooper S have aux electric water pumps that run after shutdown when needed. Seems pretty standard nowadays.
 
My garage is at the end of a steep uphill, so I give 30 seconds for my NA cars to let the hot ring pack shove heat to piston skirts and the liners and then not heat stressing the small quantity of oil between the piston rings and its channel, below piston crown and wrist pins.
 
Originally Posted By: 4WD
Fortunately most of us don’t live on an interstate exit ramp … so a couple side streets going home, or searching for a parking place in town … should deal with this without any waste …

Yeah but I'm talking about for when I make long trips fully loaded and stop for fuel and such. Or running empty at highway speeds and stopping as well.
 
To me, you play it by ear like you do now … besides, always need to find a safe spot to check on messages, make a call or two …wait for folks to clear, etc …
I have not owned any diesel 250/2500’s in a while … and Mack’s further back … but run some huge stationary diesels that have pages in the book for “planned” ramp downs … Turbs on these bigger than my son’s whole 1.4T engine … LoL …
Does not hurt anybody/anything to do what you do now …

Safe travels …
 
Originally Posted By: Hammehead
My garage is at the end of a steep uphill, so I give 30 seconds for my NA cars to let the hot ring pack shove heat to piston skirts and the liners and then not heat stressing the small quantity of oil between the piston rings and its channel, below piston crown and wrist pins.
Pseudoscience, with a dash of BITOG virtue signalling. If this were actually needed, normal people would be going through "ring packs" like crazy.
 
How could you know? You´re using Edge 0w40 in there ... There´s scientific study (Jaguar) that we, real Bitogers know, showing that a high rpm wide open throttle, the piston crowns, and top rings go up to 470-490F, and the oil won´t like that after several cycles of heat soak.
 
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As has been mentioned, a lot of this is discretionary, regardless of whether it's warranted. There is a huge difference between prudence and wastefulness (though the line is narrow and vague). Most of the cool-down procedures I hear/read about aren't nearly as bad for the car/environment/etc. as warm-up procedures in the winter. In comparison, a shorter period of cool-down could be considered inconsequential.

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
After FULL LOAD operation, not normal operation. Are you normally at full chat right before you park?

The manual also says that excessive idling is no bueno. Idling around town and then idling for 5 minutes is just redundant and wasteful.


Originally Posted By: 4WD
Fortunately most of us don’t live on an interstate exit ramp … so a couple side streets going home, or searching for a parking place in town … should deal with this without any waste …


Bingo! Most of us don't rally-cross through our neighborhoods, and then Tokyo-Drift sideways into our driveway, with the turbo at full red metal!

Even those who live directly off of the highway or at the top of a (low-grade) hill (I'm not talking about a mountain pass here) are typically driving at VERY LOW LOAD just prior stopping the vehicle.

Specifically, I've logged requested torque and calculated load for my previous turbo Subie while on the highway, even at high speeds, and the numbers are low; I would not consider any additional cool-down required, though engine-braking through the off-ramp and a small bit of low-load driving to my destination should cover even the fraidiest of cats.

I've checked logs after climbing up a steep grade to the Gunks in NY and the numbers weren't nearly as high as making a WOT run to redline in 3rd gear. At 3.5-4k RPM, my engine is making sufficient power without having to use more than a trivial amount of boost. With that said, it was often fun to boost WOT out of some of the corners and reach redline before engine-braking through the next switch-back on our way up. The time it took to pull into the trail head, pay for a pass and find a parking spot (as little as a minute or two) is all that I felt was necessary for cool-down after a more-aggressive climb. I wouldn't cool-down at all if I'd climbed the hill more sedately.

Originally Posted By: Hammehead
My garage is at the end of a steep uphill, so I give 30 seconds for my NA cars to let the hot ring pack shove heat to piston skirts and the liners and then not heat stressing the small quantity of oil between the piston rings and its channel, below piston crown and wrist pins.


What RPM is the engine at for the hill? How long is the hill?

Even 4-5k RPM, especially if the hill is only a short distance, is nothing. Feel free to do as you please with your vehicle, but I doubt any specific cool-down is warranted. If your engine is poorly designed and the oil spray flow to the crown et al. is poorly designed, then I rescind my argument.


Originally Posted By: Hammehead
How could you know? You´re using Edge 0w40 in there ... There´s scientific study (Jaguar) that we, real Bitogers know, showing that a high rpm wide open throttle, the piston crowns, and top rings go up to 470-490F, and the oil won´t like that after several cycles of heat soak.


You're driving WOT directly into your driveway? Was your engine oil temp at peak value just prior to entering the hill? I'm asking sincerely, not sarcastically. You very well could live right at the end of a very long, very steep grade, for which even I would consider your cool-down regiment prudent. If not as extreme as I'm imagining, then I'd say it's not necessary.
 
Originally Posted By: Hammehead
How could you know? You´re using Edge 0w40 in there ... There´s scientific study (Jaguar) that we, real Bitogers know, showing that a high rpm wide open throttle, the piston crowns, and top rings go up to 470-490F, and the oil won´t like that after several cycles of heat soak.


This thread is about turbo cars, I believe the spirit of the thread is "Is there potential for damage if you do not let a turbo car cool down?" My response is I doubt it makes a difference on a water cooled turbo with an auxiliary water pump or evaporative cooling system.

To your scientific study claim, I would still argue that even driving a NA car aggressively you would be hard pressed to get it hot enough to do any damage, especially a modern one. Did you see the thermal management on the new turbo 4 cyl in the GM trucks?

EDIT: 1000th post, not a real BITOGer.....
 
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Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Want to really do your ride a favor? Open the hood before shutting down.


...and set up a fan to blow in to the bay.

*I assume you're being sarcastic too
 
Originally Posted By: SavagePatch
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Want to really do your ride a favor? Open the hood before shutting down.

...and set up a fan to blow in to the bay.

*I assume you're being sarcastic too

It's funny, because this was the OEM solution to vapor lock on the 280ZXT. Vent over the intake manifold and an injector rail blower. Man I love 80's cars.
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Want to really do your ride a favor? Open the hood before shutting down.


I pop my hood before exiting the highway, every day! Works super well!
 
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