I want to like Tesla...but...

I'd say the fact that the Kia uses troublesome (but cheap, energy dense and easy to package) pouch cells, nestled inside many replaceable modules, tells me everything I need to know. As the Kia can pull off a 10% to 80% charge in 18 minutes, using 800V, I expect problems within a few years down the line. We'd all like to think they have some magic chemistry that makes things right. They don't.


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hyundai-ioniq-5-battery-source-bastro-power-station.webp
Do all 800V architecture vehicles use this arrangement, or just Hyundai/Kia?
 
Push the right button on the steering wheel to activate voice command. Music will pause. Speak your command, like, "Turn up fan". Music will pick up where it left off.
You can also use the touch screen; the climate controls are simple.
Just saw Roger Waters in SF.
Yeah, but I can also click twice on button to turn up a fan or set temperature on auto control and guess what? Music doesn’t pause. And I have that voice button in all three cars. Not sure whether they work all.
It is kind of interesting concept.
 
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having owned and fixed many European cars, basic stuff like wheels, tires, brakes, Etc are the same as any other car. when you have to have a fancy tool to reset the battery monitor, or when you have to pull the timing chain and all it's guides out through the valve covers because there isn't a timing cover, those are the times when euro cars cost more to fix. that is why older European cars are cheaper, because they cost more to maintain. and for that one cranky guy somewhere in this thread, $10,000 is a number i made up. deal with it
 
I get it and agree with your assesment, we expect a certain level of perceived quality. And with legacy manufacturers, we get just that. Perceived quality, as fit and finish can be world class superb. As always, we should ask the deeper question, why don't our vehicles last 50 or even 80 years. Clearly aircraft can do so and still perform as well as they did on the day they were made. The answer is simply that legacy manufacturers don't provide quality, only the perception of quality.

Tesla makes the best electric drivetrains in the world. Their batteries have been honed into a something approaching a quality product, and their controllers, motors and operational software is simply, better than everybody else. Is it good enough to overcome some shortcomings?

Possibly more importantly, Tesla's now look dated. The purchasing public has always purchased the "latest and greatest". For a while, this was good enough to keep Tesla on top.
It's some of that, however. The FAA has rules that on certified aircraft unless you have an A&P you aren't working on your aircraft. An engine rebuild is $20-30 grand. This is why many pilots have gone the homebuilt route.
 
It's some of that, however. The FAA has rules that on certified aircraft unless you have an A&P you aren't working on your aircraft. An engine rebuild is $20-30 grand. This is why many pilots have gone the homebuilt route.
Homebuilt aircraft crash at, and have fatal accidents at 5-6x the rate of type certified aircraft.

There is a reason I fly a type certified aircraft.

Back on topic, the engineering side of me absolutely loves Tesla. The enthusiastic driver in me also loves Tesla. But you guys are right about certain aspects of quality. My Jaguar F-Type is out of Tesla's league with regard to fit, finish, and the all important initial "wow" factor (sex appeal). Is it a better car? Not a chance, but it sure looks it.

Hr1Chv1.jpg
 
And Tesla is just getting warmed up. Everything they have learned about EVs and cost effective manufacturing will enable their everyman's $25K EV. This has been Musk's stated plan from day 1.
I think Tesla has desensitized customers to quality concerns and if they build a $25K EV, the quality will probably be worse then ever before. However being it would be only $25K EV and have a Tesla badge it will run circles around the competition in terms of sales figures.

This whole "Software first design" fell flat with the admission by Musk that HW3 will not have an upgrade path period. Those who paid for FSD basically got shafted, especially if they paid the later asking amounts.
 
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Briefly interrupts to speak/acknowledge.
Does it acknowledge? Not so sure...
Maybe @edyvw will enjoy this short video. Of course there are far more.
After his Pink Floyd post, I was out on interstate 280 going to Menlo Park; 70* out; pushed the right steering wheel button and said, "Play Pink Floyd."
Brain Damage came on; I think most people know about the legendary Tesla stereo quality. Blows the Lexus Mark Levinson stuff in my cars away.

The lunatic is on the grass
The lunatic is on the grass
Remembering games
And daisy chains and laughs
Got to keep the loonies on the path
...
The lunatic is in my head
The lunatic is in my head
You raise the blade
You make the change
You rearrange me 'till I'm sane
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head, but it's not me
 
Homebuilt aircraft crash at, and have fatal accidents at 5-6x the rate of type certified aircraft.

There is a reason I fly a type certified aircraft.

Back on topic, the engineering side of me absolutely loves Tesla. The enthusiastic driver in me also loves Tesla. But you guys are right about certain aspects of quality. My Jaguar F-Type is out of Tesla's league with regard to fit, finish, and the all important initial "wow" factor (sex appeal). Is it a better car? Not a chance, but it sure looks it.

Hr1Chv1.jpg
I love Jag and I've owned many, but it's a very different conversation. There's no getting around it, owning a Tesla has a "but" involved, but it's a very good experience still.
 
Does it acknowledge? Not so sure...
Maybe @edyvw will enjoy this short video. Of course there are far more.
After his Pink Floyd post, I was out on interstate 280 going to Menlo Park; 70* out; pushed the right steering wheel button and said, "Play Pink Floyd."
Brain Damage came on; I think most people know about the legendary Tesla stereo quality. Blows the Lexus Mark Levinson stuff in my cars away.

The lunatic is on the grass
The lunatic is on the grass
Remembering games
And daisy chains and laughs
Got to keep the loonies on the path
...
The lunatic is in my head
The lunatic is in my head
You raise the blade
You make the change
You rearrange me 'till I'm sane
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head, but it's not me

I'm not sure what variation of the Tesla stereo you think is awesome unless there's a difference between the standard Model 3 and others, but I think it sucks. My GTi has the Fender system which is techically rebranded Panasonic and it kills it. If there is a difference in systems then I do stand corrected.
 
Does it acknowledge? Not so sure...
Maybe @edyvw will enjoy this short video. Of course there are far more.
After his Pink Floyd post, I was out on interstate 280 going to Menlo Park; 70* out; pushed the right steering wheel button and said, "Play Pink Floyd."
Brain Damage came on; I think most people know about the legendary Tesla stereo quality. Blows the Lexus Mark Levinson stuff in my cars away.

The lunatic is on the grass
The lunatic is on the grass
Remembering games
And daisy chains and laughs
Got to keep the loonies on the path
...
The lunatic is in my head
The lunatic is in my head
You raise the blade
You make the change
You rearrange me 'till I'm sane
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head, but it's not me
Hey google *ping*...turn on my heated steering wheel.
"Turning on heated steering wheel."
Or turn the drivers side temperature up or down "x" degrees. Or whatever I want my car to do that Id otherwise futz with a screen or button for.
 
I'm not sure what variation of the Tesla stereo you think is awesome unless there's a difference between the standard Model 3 and others, but I think it sucks. My GTi has the Fender system which is techically rebranded Panasonic and it kills it. If there is a difference in systems then I do stand corrected.
Basically, theres Focal, and then everyone else, and then Bose/Meridian/unbranded oem trash.
 
Basically, theres Focal, and then everyone else, and then Bose/Meridian/unbranded oem trash.
I don't know what to make of all that, but I spent many years in the car audio industry and I'm rarely wowed by OEM systems. VW's Fender system is excellent. The Beats system they work with now, not so much. Most of the Bang & Olufsen stuff has been good too.
 
I'm not sure what variation of the Tesla stereo you think is awesome unless there's a difference between the standard Model 3 and others, but I think it sucks. My GTi has the Fender system which is techically rebranded Panasonic and it kills it. If there is a difference in systems then I do stand corrected.
I believe the base car has a different system. Our car is the best I've ever heard. And I've been a stereo nut forever.
 
I believe the base car has a different system. Our car is the best I've ever heard. And I've been a stereo nut forever.

I would hope so. Saying it sucks may be a bit strong. The mids and highs are passable, but the bass sucks. My 2004 GTO's system was better with its Blaupunkt system, but it actually had a hidden gain knob and good speakers. It's probably not fair to compare the standard Tesla system with the premium sound systems I've had in my last 3 vehicles, which have had the top systems possible in each case.

It doesn't sound bad as I've said, it just lacks impact.
 
Hey google *ping*...turn on my heated steering wheel.
"Turning on heated steering wheel."
Or turn the drivers side temperature up or down "x" degrees. Or whatever I want my car to do that Id otherwise futz with a screen or button for.
Our car just executes the command.
 
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The indy often lacks some of the training and tools of the actual dealer, as well as experience in working on newer models that the dealer has. Why would you pay to have something done when you can have it done for free? So the dealer has at LEAST 3/36 experience more than the indy, for newer models.

If you have an older vehicle, the indy might be better, as they are more familiar with how the vehicles age as they go less and less to the dealer.

Warranty work - sure.

Some of the indys I know get the exact same dealer stuff before the guys at the dealerships get it or get trained.
The independent truck guys often more know about them than certain dealers.

Out doubt this will be the case with your new Kia however so completely understand going back to them.
 
Does it acknowledge? Not so sure...
Maybe @edyvw will enjoy this short video. Of course there are far more.
After his Pink Floyd post, I was out on interstate 280 going to Menlo Park; 70* out; pushed the right steering wheel button and said, "Play Pink Floyd."
Brain Damage came on; I think most people know about the legendary Tesla stereo quality. Blows the Lexus Mark Levinson stuff in my cars away.

The lunatic is on the grass
The lunatic is on the grass
Remembering games
And daisy chains and laughs
Got to keep the loonies on the path
...
The lunatic is in my head
The lunatic is in my head
You raise the blade
You make the change
You rearrange me 'till I'm sane
You lock the door
And throw away the key
There's someone in my head, but it's not me
Tesla speakers are made by Lear. There is nothing special about them. Nothing that 2006 base stereo in BMW didn’t have.
It might though tell where Mark Levinson is today.
Word “legendary “ in vehicle of manufacturer that is 10yrs old is really tacky.
And still, you can do that in other cars and increase air without stopping music.
 
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