I need facts only if possible...

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Originally Posted By: 7777
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: 7777
from what i learned in life,when companies hide their ingredients,obviously they have something to hide and that totally turns me off.

On another note,people who use redline here , are you happy with it?


You're right. I use Redline and couldn't be happier. You know it's an ester, it has lots of moly and lots of ZDDP.

My engine was already spotless under the valvecover using Amsoil ACD (a great oil) since it was new up to 76,000 miles. I switched to Redline and I thought it wasn't possible but it actually looks cleaner now.

People will say it's not worth it but it's your money and at least you know what you're getting with it. It will protect second to none and keep the engine spotless.

Be careful about putting any kind of faith in UOAs for engine wear. In my experience, they don't mean squat for measuring wear.


I agree 100% and most likely going with redline,Ive seen it for 9.45qt 5-30 , can it be found cheaper? Also, will be using my normal wix filter, do you recommend any other filter?Thank you


7777, your climate is similar to mine and I presume you will be driving your car through the winter. I'm familiar with many Red Line products including their 5W-30 grade. It's a very robust oil but their 0W-30 would be much more suitable for winter use, while still providing more high temperature protection than you'll ever need. It's about a buck more per qt.
If that's too dear, then, IMHO, the cheapest (likely GP III) 5W-30 syn you can find on sale would be more than adequate for your Suzuki 4 banger. Driving it hard on the street doesn't mean you'll be generating high oil temperatures and you very likely will not. Therefore the main advantage of a product like Red Line, very high temperature protection, becomes academic.
 
Originally Posted By: tomcat27
cool - I've been eyeing the Suzi...

anyway, what are you trying to accomplish? extended drains? the "best" oil at any cost? I dont know if there is a true reason to go redline unless you are racing it.

I believe that M1 EP is mostly a G4 oil, as is Amsoil (except for their XL line)

I'm sure you know that much of the competitiion is mostly G3.

If money is no object, I would go with Amsoil, M1 EP, maybe Redline.

The next tier is Valvoline Syn, Penzz Plat.


Basically the best oil and piece of mind, from what Ive been reading for years, redline has the best quality ingredients.

BTW, i just bought a case online. I have 500 miles on motor now
(a hard 500 miles,lol)and when i receive my oil ,I'm making the change.I always break in my motors hard,Best way.
 
Originally Posted By: 7777
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: 7777
My question is, I want to know for sure if moble1 EP is a group 3 oil or not?


Let me ask you, why does it matter....at all?
You asked this question like is was as important a question as "is there a G0d?".

I'm pretty shure there are plenty of guys just like you in a parallel universe, with the same exact truck, who run it on dino oil and do just fine, but without the existential issues.


Either your mentally challenged or your flaming.

It matters to me , period!!

BTW, if you bother reading my post,I sold my truck and its for the sx4.Also please don't bother posting on my thread if your gonna be sarcastic.


I missed that one lol. Not sure why people get upset when you state you want to start off with the best base oil. I run Redline in my slow 258hp TL. I guess I'm going to [censored] since it only "needs" a dino grp II oil. Some of us want the best, nothing wrong with that.

Some guys act like no wear takes place as long as you have an average oil in there. However, engines do wear out and a "better" oil will slow the process down.
 
Some of the lowest wear rates are on dino oil. Dr.Hass has even referenced studies indicating a mixed base oil works best. (MaxLife?) No offense to the OP, but thinking you need Redline in a Suzuki is grossly missinformed. One of the most obvious issues with PAO base is seal combatibility. The one main advantage of PAO was pour-point, but that too has become a non-issue with the latest G-III bases like XHVI.

If PAO is the answer, how do you explain the outstanding UOA performance of Pennzoil Platinum and it's amazing cold properties too? Pennzoil does not "hide" the fact it's G-III, that should appeal to you, right? Even plain Pennzoil yellow is amazing on cold, and believe me, there are MANY Suzukis in Upstate NY that start right up on it in winter.

Your theory sounds more like OCD. Some of the best oem oils are now likely G-III, take the examples of BMW Castrol and German Syntec. If they can meet the MOST STRINGENT oem specs on G-III....and it's not good enough for you? Gimme a break.
LOL.gif


http://www.lubrizol.com/EuropeanEngineOils/RelativePerformanceToolIntro.html
 
The only company I know of that uses a base oil over class 3 is Petro Canada. Their base oil 99.7% pure. To get to class 3 you have to be at least 90% and Mobil just hits that mark. Why is that important? By taking the all the contamination out the oil it stays in grade longer and the additives works better. Most of your major oil companies us a Hydrocracking process to bring the oil to higher grade. Only Petro Canada goes to such a high purity. You probably never heard of Petro Canada but they are OEM oil for GM, Ford, Gehl, LinkBelt, Dexron VI, and Mercron V. You can find dealers by going on their web site. ( 83 Buick T Type and then 85 GN wish I still had it!! )
 
All base oils in modern ILSAC certified oils are of outstanding purity. As for Mobil 1 base oil.. it does not matter. It is the overall performance that matters. The best way the everyday consumer has to determine performance is by measuring output (such as MPG's) and wear by performing UOA's. Keep it practical and keep it real.
 
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Some of the lowest wear rates are on dino oil. Dr.Hass has even referenced studies indicating a mixed base oil works best. (MaxLife?) No offense to the OP, but thinking you need Redline in a Suzuki is grossly missinformed. One of the most obvious issues with PAO base is seal combatibility. The one main advantage of PAO was pour-point, but that too has become a non-issue with the latest G-III bases like XHVI.

If PAO is the answer, how do you explain the outstanding UOA performance of Pennzoil Platinum and it's amazing cold properties too? Pennzoil does not "hide" the fact it's G-III, that should appeal to you, right? Even plain Pennzoil yellow is amazing on cold, and believe me, there are MANY Suzukis in Upstate NY that start right up on it in winter.

Your theory sounds more like OCD. Some of the best oem oils are now likely G-III, take the examples of BMW Castrol and German Syntec. If they can meet the MOST STRINGENT oem specs on G-III....and it's not good enough for you? Gimme a break.
LOL.gif


http://www.lubrizol.com/EuropeanEngineOils/RelativePerformanceToolIntro.html



My wallet and i decide whats good enough for me,but since you wanna decide for me ,then you could buy me some m1 ep and ill put it in the wifes ford 05 escape,lol.
 
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Some of the best oem oils are now likely G-III, take the examples of BMW Castrol and German Syntec.

So, GC is now Group III? I don't really care either way, but was just curious if I could read some more on the subject...
 
If there's one thing I've learned since joining this site it's that there really is no such thing as a "magic oil" that will reduce wear and make your rig run longer in a standard application. Paying $9 a quart for oil won't do it.

IMO, the only reason to run a premium oil in a standard application is the "feel good" factor.

And don't get me wrong, if that's your reason for using Redline, great!

Just don't think it's going to make your engine run better or wear longer than most any other modern oil changed at regular intervals.
 
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: 7777
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: 7777
My question is, I want to know for sure if moble1 EP is a group 3 oil or not?


Let me ask you, why does it matter....at all?
You asked this question like is was as important a question as "is there a G0d?".

I'm pretty shure there are plenty of guys just like you in a parallel universe, with the same exact truck, who run it on dino oil and do just fine, but without the existential issues.


Either your mentally challenged or your flaming.

It matters to me , period!!

BTW, if you bother reading my post,I sold my truck and its for the sx4.Also please don't bother posting on my thread if your gonna be sarcastic.


I missed that one lol. Not sure why people get upset when you state you want to start off with the best base oil. I run Redline in my slow 258hp TL. I guess I'm going to [censored] since it only "needs" a dino grp II oil. Some of us want the best, nothing wrong with that.

Some guys act like no wear takes place as long as you have an average oil in there. However, engines do wear out and a "better" oil will slow the process down.


LoL, you ain't kidding, they get bent out of shape because you wanna use the best base stock out, like there going to pay for it or something lol.
 
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Some of the lowest wear rates are on dino oil. Dr.Hass has even referenced studies indicating a mixed base oil works best. (MaxLife?) No offense to the OP, but thinking you need Redline in a Suzuki is grossly missinformed. One of the most obvious issues with PAO base is seal combatibility. The one main advantage of PAO was pour-point, but that too has become a non-issue with the latest G-III bases like XHVI.

If PAO is the answer, how do you explain the outstanding UOA performance of Pennzoil Platinum and it's amazing cold properties too? Pennzoil does not "hide" the fact it's G-III, that should appeal to you, right? Even plain Pennzoil yellow is amazing on cold, and believe me, there are MANY Suzukis in Upstate NY that start right up on it in winter.

Your theory sounds more like OCD. Some of the best oem oils are now likely G-III, take the examples of BMW Castrol and German Syntec. If they can meet the MOST STRINGENT oem specs on G-III....and it's not good enough for you? Gimme a break.
LOL.gif


http://www.lubrizol.com/EuropeanEngineOils/RelativePerformanceToolIntro.html




UOAs are worthless in determining wear.
 
In Nassau,Suffolk L.I a good source for Amsoil is Colvin Motor Parts in Merrick.Iwould really care about the warranty Redline, and Amsoil fall short sometimes.Thats up to you.
 
Originally Posted By: Pablo

OK they aren't doing it for evil reasons, or to screw the customer. It's a competitive business, if a competitor wants to completely reverse engineer a product, well they can, but why should any company just hand out their own formula?


The thing is, EVERY major player has long since reverse engineered the other guys' major products. Hiding behind "it's proprietary" is just a lazy way of saying "trust us!
wink.gif
"

If an oil company doesn't want to tell me what they're selling, that's fine. Just don't go lying to me about how you can't divulge your 'secret formula.' Doing so is disingenuous at the very least, and does constitute, IMO, a deliberate attempt to screw the customer.

7777, if you really need to know what's in a given oil, try contacting Redline and maybe Amsol. They tend to offer refreshingly straight answers to what is a straightforward question.

FWIW, as I understand it, the majority of Redline's base oil is Grp5 POE. There may be a few % of Grp4 and Grp3 oils mixed in as well (for various techinical reasons), but the bulk of the mix is Grp5.

Amsol is supposedly made from "mostly PAO" base stocks.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: hate2work
If there's one thing I've learned since joining this site it's that there really is no such thing as a "magic oil" that will reduce wear and make your rig run longer in a standard application. Paying $9 a quart for oil won't do it.

IMO, the only reason to run a premium oil in a standard application is the "feel good" factor.

And don't get me wrong, if that's your reason for using Redline, great!

Just don't think it's going to make your engine run better or wear longer than most any other modern oil changed at regular intervals.




To tell you the truth, i feel better already ordering red line,lol.

Like i said I'm going to beat on it like a pack mule (In a safe way)
And i like the fact that the base stock is ester based,which is the best out there. 2$ more for piece of mind is cheap.
 
Originally Posted By: ottotheclown
In Nassau,Suffolk L.I a good source for Amsoil is Colvin Motor Parts in Merrick.Iwould really care about the warranty Redline, and Amsoil fall short sometimes.Thats up to you.


Wow, i used to live in Merrick,around the block from colvin,had a
account there,i lived on city ave,lol.

Ive used amsoil in the past, i was a member with good discounts,then switched to M1 EP(found out they use G3),Now trying out redline.
 
LOL^^.

And oils such as redline are acceptable in high performance engines that are turbocharged and modified and require a high performance oil
 
Originally Posted By: Geonerd
Originally Posted By: Pablo

OK they aren't doing it for evil reasons, or to screw the customer. It's a competitive business, if a competitor wants to completely reverse engineer a product, well they can, but why should any company just hand out their own formula?


The thing is, EVERY major player has long since reverse engineered the other guys' major products. Hiding behind "it's proprietary" is just a lazy way of saying "trust us!
wink.gif
"

If an oil company doesn't want to tell me what they're selling, that's fine. Just don't go lying to me about how you can't divulge your 'secret formula.' Doing so is disingenuous at the very least, and does constitute, IMO, a deliberate attempt to screw the customer.

7777, if you really need to know what's in a given oil, try contacting Redline and maybe Amsol. They tend to offer refreshingly straight answers to what is a straightforward question.

FWIW, as I understand it, the majority of Redline's base oil is Grp5 POE. There may be a few % of Grp4 and Grp3 oils mixed in as well (for various techinical reasons), but the bulk of the mix is Grp5.

Amsol is supposedly made from "mostly PAO" base stocks.


I agree geonerd !!
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Originally Posted By: 7777
2$ more for piece of mind is cheap.

You should would get a few more pieces at that price.


Lol peace,typo..this a busy place, hard to keep up.
 
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