HT/HS value: specs and reality

Primus · Jun 11, 2004

German tests shows that real HT/HS is higher than that of specs. Good news. Comparing results with specs I would say that around 25 % of tested oils were produced with 0.10 higher HT/HS.

Table:
http://jabr0001.free.fr/BMW/Oeltest/oeltest3.jpg

Full description (click on each part):
http://jabr0001.free.fr/BMW/Oeltest/

If somebody reads German, please clarify what are the comments. Something interesting ? TYI.

quadrun1 · Jun 11, 2004

Thanks for sharing the info!

Some things I found interesting:

-M1 0W-40 HT/HS tested out at 3.9, better than its rated spec of 3.6

-Valvoline Maxlife 10W-40 tested out at 4.2

-Castrol 10W-60 (BMW M3 oil) tested out at 5.8!

-Castrol SLX Longlife II is only part ("teil") synthetic???

[ June 11, 2004, 07:33 PM: Message edited by: quadrun1 ]

WeyounDS9 · Jun 11, 2004

A great link.

Results. testers found that the 0w-30 and 0w-40 oils fared well despite a bit of sceptism going in.
castrol 10w-60 did best in all hard running related tests ( no surprise here).

The economy brand "Gut und Billig" (="Good and Cheap") fared decent expcet failed coldstarts tests

This is by far the cheapest oil in the test at approx 2 and half bucks (1 Euro=slightly more than 1$).

Also testers were disapointed that some of the teilsynetisch marked oils showed no blending in of PAO's but just group III a distinction that they also seem to make.
This was especially the case with the "Gut und Billig"

This is just an off-the cuff summary. But I'll gladly answrr specific questions later.
(Its Friday nite and I gotto cruise)

Fred...

TallPaul · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by quadrun1:
-Valvoline Maxlife 10W-40 tested out at 4.2

But the European Maxlife is not the same oil as the North American Maxlife. To quote from an email reply I received from Valvoline Europe last November:

"To be able to be successfull in the European market with unique products such as MaxLife we've customized the formulation for Europe. We even had to use more synthetic base stocks to meet the more stringent requirements of ACEA in Europe. The unique additives that do give the unique benefits to MaxLife are used in both the American and European formulation."

I called the US Valvoline techs and was told the US Maxlife 10w40's HT/HS is >3.5

Gurkha · Jun 11, 2004

Why isnt the Castrol 1-W-60 marketed elsewhere in the world specially in hotter regions of the earth is beyond my compreshension.

moribundman · Jun 11, 2004

A couple things loosely translated:

Shell Helix Ultra, which is optimized for reduced oil consumption, contains also mineral oils, because oil additives better dissolve better in those (than in synthetic oil).

Castrol SLX Longlife II was the only oil that was close to the critical HTHS limit of 2.9. However, this oil is meant to be used ONLY in specific VW engines with WIV (extended service interval).

nortones2 · Jun 11, 2004

I was reading an article which explained that even fully-synthetic oils contain 10% to 20% base (presumably cheap Group I mineral oil), as the carrier fluid for additives. See http://www.bardahl.ca/faq.html

ekpolk · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by quadrun1:
Thanks for sharing the info!

Some things I found interesting:

-M1 0W-40 HT/HS tested out at 3.9, better than its rated spec of 3.6

-Valvoline Maxlife 10W-40 tested out at 4.2

-Castrol 10W-60 (BMW M3 oil) tested out at 5.8!

-Castrol SLX Longlife II is only part ("teil") synthetic???

Is Castrol SLX Longlife II what we call German Castrol?

ekpolk · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by nortones2:
I was reading an article which explained that even fully-synthetic oils contain 10% to 20% base (presumably cheap Group I mineral oil), as the carrier fluid for additives. See http://www.bardahl.ca/faq.html

I'm not sure about other refiners, but I understand that Mobil moved away from using dino additive carrier oils years ago.

WeyounDS9 · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by moribundman:
Castrol SLX Longlife II was the only oil that was close to the critical HTHS limit of 2.9. However, this oil is meant to be used ONLY in specific VW engines with WIV (extended service interval).

And they felt this was acceptable due to its LL spec mission.

Fred..

WeyounDS9 · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by ekpolk:
]Is Castrol SLX Longlife II what we call German Castrol?

No.

We get castrol SLX.
But not the SLX LL.
(this is whats currently accurate, I guess it could change)

Fred..

buster · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

I was reading an article which explained that even fully-synthetic oils contain 10% to 20% base (presumably cheap Group I mineral oil), as the carrier fluid for additives. See

Primus, thanks for the link.

I believe the main difference between Noak volatility with certain oils that some don't use any or much less mineral oil as the carrier oil. This is why I believe some see excessive burn off with certain brands. Only certain grades though. Just a theory....I have no proof this is the case.

[ June 12, 2004, 11:17 AM: Message edited by: buster ]

Pablo · Jun 11, 2004

Neat article. Finally the high school German kicked in.

As for the Bardahl link:

quote:

According to the API, to be 100% synthetic, an oil must contain 80 to 90% synthetic base stock. The 10% to 20% remaining is base oil used to mix the additives. And, according to the API, the semi-synthetic motor oils must have at least 10% synthetic basic oil. Bardahl XTC 5W-20, 5W-40 and XHD 5W-40 oils are made with 100% synthetic base stocks. They are a mixture of PAO (Group-IV), Group-III and Esters (Group-V).

As for add pack carrier oils, some of this is the stuff of legends. I find it unlikely that the "carrier" oils are 20% in a "Good" synthetic! Nor have I seen the API rules on synthetic. Anyone have these?

So Bardahl is a 3-way blend. Interesting.

I agree with their break in comments....

G-MAN · Jun 11, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by ekpolk:

quote:

Originally posted by nortones2:
I was reading an article which explained that even fully-synthetic oils contain 10% to 20% base (presumably cheap Group I mineral oil), as the carrier fluid for additives. See http://www.bardahl.ca/faq.html

Click to expand...

I'm not sure about other refiners, but I understand that Mobil moved away from using dino additive carrier oils years ago.

They did. Esters are used now in virtually all synthetic oils (even most Group III ones) to carry the additives.

[ June 12, 2004, 11:53 AM: Message edited by: G-Man II ]

Primus · Jun 11, 2004

Castrol SLX II was formulated for newest Audi/VW.
If somebody want to know GC data, look at Veedol Syntron 0W-30, it's Castrol Formula SLX cousin.

buster · Feb 16, 2005

http://www.76lubricants.com/ProductDataSheets/Crankcase.htm

If you look at the 76 Synthetic oils, even their racing oils, none of the 30wts meet A3 and have a HT/HS of around 3.1-3.2. M1R- 3.0. Their is a reason why they make it this way IMO. Flash of the 76 oil is also above 450F.

HT/HS value: specs and reality

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