HPL Euro PCMO 5w-30 9.5k mi; 2014 Toyota Venza V6 2GR-FE 130k mi

[Patrick0525]

Sample #2 is the VOA
Sample #3 is filter change and added .25qts
Sample #4 final OCI

Changed oil filter at 4k mi and at the end of this OCI. Added 16 oz at 4K into the oil filter.
No oil consumed.

Wear metals: 8+3+1+1=13 ppm
Wear metal rate: 1.38 ppm/ 1K mi

Looks like the sodium is going up at 12 ppm.

HPL is a phenomenal oil with near record BITOG wear metal rate. Switched to Valvoline EP HP 5w-30 due to rear main seal seepage.

 

[dnewton3]

As for the UOAs, I have a few comments:
- sample 2; I assume that is a VOA?
- sample 3; that is 3993 miles of use is from what starting point? (the miles don't add up from sample 1; there's 2928 miles missing between samples 1 and 3. Did you run a short OCI with the same brand/grade to "flush" the previous oil out?)
- sample 4; this must be a continuation of sample 3, given title indication of 9.5k miles
Were all these samples the same oil formulation, or have you been bouncing between brands and formulas? I assume there's been some experimentation here, because sample 1 vis is so different from the other three.

As for sample 4, the K is up, but it's only one data point. The only way to know if there's a problem is to continue to track it and see if it trends upward. Also, the BN seems low for an HPL product with only 9.5k miles on it; this may indicate a coolant leak which is beginning to affect the lube?


*************
My edit ... You edited your title and info as I was typing, so I see you've updated some info.

Where are you getting the "wear metals" counts in your comments? What is the "8+3+1+1=13" supposed to represent???
I see what you did; you took the wear metals and subtracted the VOA points, and then did a LSJr move and added the wear metals up to a "total metals" per 1k mi.
I am not a fan of the "cumulative" wear metal method; it can be very misleading.

 

[himemsys]

Why is the sodium climbing? Baseline is 3ppm. It climbs by 1 at sample 3 and climbs another 8 at sample 4. I don't usually see sodium climb like that.

 

[dnewton3]

Why is the sodium climbing? Baseline is 3ppm. It climbs by 1 at sample 3 and climbs another 8 at sample 4. I don't usually see sodium climb like that.

I tend to ignore when small changes are present. From sample 2 to 3, there is a 1ppm increase. Because the numbers are reported in whole (no tenths), and because some variation is "normal", that shift of 1ppm increase isn't really indicative of a problem.

However, the change from sample 3 to 4, with a gain of 8ppm, is indicative of a change. It could be an error; or not. The increase of K along with the significant degradation of the BN in sample 4 together may indicate an internal coolant leak. It is only 1 data point of change at this point, but certainly something the OP should track, and maybe take samples every 3k miles to get a closer look.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

I tend to ignore when small changes are present. From sample 2 to 3, there is a 1ppm increase. Because the numbers are reported in whole (no tenths), and because some variation is "normal", that shift of 1ppm increase isn't really indicative of a problem.

However, the change from sample 3 to 4, with a gain of 8ppm, is indicative of a change. It could be an error; or not. The increase of K along with the significant degradation of the BN in sample 4 together may indicate an internal coolant leak. It is only 1 data point of change at this point, but certainly something the OP should track, and maybe take samples every 3k miles to get a closer look.

And that's the kind of commentary people should be getting when they pay a lab for a UOA... yet you provide that experience for free! Kudos

 

[Patrick0525]

History and clarification.
Sample #1 was another different oil. An UOA was taken, removed 1qt, added 1qt of HPL EC30 and ran for 2k mi. An UOA was NOT taken @120820 therefore no documentation.
Sample #3 -#4 is the start of the HPL Euro 10K OCI from 120820 to 130270 which is an 9450 OCI with an UOA @124813 and @130270.
Sample #2 is the VOA

The oil was not changed for 9450mi only a filter change + 16oz of HPL Euro added. The two HPL gallons had the same batch code.

The wear metal calculation is the difference betwenn VOA and sample #4.
Sample #3 says no oil change is correct becuase the HPL starting point is 120820.

 

[Patrick0525]

I asked for another UOA for the sodium, potassium.
Crossing my fingers.

 

[Patrick0525]

The UOA re-do is in. K is even higher.
:-(

 

[buster]

The UOA re-do is in. K is even higher.
:-(


View attachment 280655

Do you know the virgin oxidation value?

Is this the same oil?

B

Thread 'HPL Euro C3 5w30 BMW N55 71k miles.'

Mar 5, 2024

I finally got around to send in the UOA on this. A link to the interesting bits I found in my oil filter used for this OCI can be found HERE. Clift notes is that I found some material in the filter. The engine had been fed a constant diet of BMW LL01FE up to this point.

Tin (Bearings?) came in at 2ppm. Viscosity @ 100C came in at 10.8 vs 12.08 per PDS I presume if I kept going it would thicken up a little as I reached 10k miles. Going to do another UOA (LM 5w40) this summer (1 yr mark). I've only put 2k miles on the car since then.

• BMWTurboDzl
• Replies: 13
• Forum: Used Oil Analysis - Gasoline

• 

 

[Patrick0525]

Do you know the virgin oxidation value?

Is this the same oil?

B

Thread 'HPL Euro C3 5w30 BMW N55 71k miles.'

Mar 5, 2024

I finally got around to send in the UOA on this. A link to the interesting bits I found in my oil filter used for this OCI can be found HERE. Clift notes is that I found some material in the filter. The engine had been fed a constant diet of BMW LL01FE up to this point.

Tin (Bearings?) came in at 2ppm. Viscosity @ 100C came in at 10.8 vs 12.08 per PDS I presume if I kept going it would thicken up a little as I reached 10k miles. Going to do another UOA (LM 5w40) this summer (1 yr mark). I've only put 2k miles on the car since then.

• BMWTurboDzl
• Replies: 13
• Forum: Used Oil Analysis - Gasoline

• 

No VOA on oxidation. I think someone posted 20 in the VOA database.

It is the same oil for the 10k OCI.

 

[doublebase]

Good report. You must have a tougher commute than me, I’ve done two analysis’s on this engine with my own car (2016 Avalon) using Mobil1 0W20 EP and Amsoil Signature series 5W30 both for 10,000 mile runs, and my total wear metals came out to 9 ppm on both oils.

Amsoil 5w30 — 5ppm aluminum and 4ppm iron

Mobil1 EP 0W20 — 3ppm aluminum, 5ppm iron, 1ppm copper

These have to be the slowest wearing engines I’ve ever seen.