How Important is it to use Z1 ATF in a Honda?

[heavyhitter]

Originally Posted By: philipsearcy


BTW I do have do have a bachelors, and masters degree, MCSE and CCIA. Not that it matters or makes me any smarter than anyone else on here but would make me more "educated" than most.






What schools did you attend for 6 years to get all of these fancy degree's? You may want to go back and take a grammer class. Philip. [/quote]

University of Nebraska at Omaha. Sure I will go back for grammar class, can PM your info so I can send you the bill.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

Hey how about we get back on topic! What's with the personal attacks?! This isn't a "mines biggers than yours contest". We are discussing ATF. Enough internet tough guy, im smarter than you becuase i have a degree blah blah. And that goes for both of you. People come here to learn and share knowledge. Lets try to keep BITOG an inviting place. Thank you.

 

[ryland]

The thing that really bugs me about z1 is that in my car it would always crash from park to reverse or park to drive. With amsoil it seems to go much smoother. The shifting is a little firmer or maybe not firmer but more precise and faster with the amsoil. The z1 seems to take its time shifting making the shift softer and slower. Whats really better for the tranny and what is causing less wear on clutch plates I dont really know. The next time I change I'm going to use amsoil again. Ig there is a lot of gunk on the magnant than maybe the time after that I'll use z1 but we'll see.

 

[AzFireGuy79]

I have experienced the same issue with Z-1 in my mothers Acura TL. I even did a complete flush a while back just to see if the drain and fills were the culprit. Still was having issues. I have run Amsoil in a few others and just ordered a case this AM for the TL. I am hoping it cures this issue. Other fluids I have used eventually have the same harsh shift issues as the Z-1. Even some very good synthetic ATF's.

 

[gogozy]

Originally Posted By: AzFireGuy79
I have experienced the same issue with Z-1 in my mothers Acura TL. I even did a complete flush a while back just to see if the drain and fills were the culprit. Still was having issues. I have run Amsoil in a few others and just ordered a case this AM for the TL. I am hoping it cures this issue. Other fluids I have used eventually have the same harsh shift issues as the Z-1. Even some very good synthetic ATF's.


probably not that important.
i changed out factory Z1 after 45k(km) because i felt gear is playing catch-up with me, after 2 drain and fill with Z1 and 10k km, that catch-up game is back and so i am done with Z1 at least in this TSX. i am currently running MaxLife in the TSX, (2 drain and fill) for ~2 weeks. it felt a bit firmer and more "sporty". i will switch to Redline or Amsoil after i find the way and time to remove the ATF hose clamp for a cooler line flush. depending on the outcome on TSX, i may flush out Z1 in MDX at 15k. i intend to keep both cars for min 10 years.

 

[MBCLK]

interesting reading here...lots of people have faith with Amsoil ATF. I have a Honda and most mechanics recommend 30k intervals with the Z1...is that correct? Ive got 102,000 miles on the car. If earlier than 30k...why so early?

2nd question is...for those that use Amsoil ATF on a Honda....what interval are u using?

 

[herrhaus]

The reason that most folks who drive 2nd gen ODY's use Z1has more to do with a fear that AHC will not provide "goodwill" in the event of tranny failure......not that they don't have faith in Amsoil ATF.

I don't believe that Honda would actually take a sample of the ATF from the failed transmission and send it off to determine if it's actually Z1 or not. However, when facing the service manager and explaining that you have "maintained" the vehicle, it usually helps to have a record and receipts that back up your claim that the vehicle was properly maintained. That in essence is why most Honda owners with the 4-speed and the 5-speed transmissions (1999-2004) stay with the Z1.

Now with that said, I hardly think that using Amsoil's ATF doesn't constitute "proper maintenance". In my opinion, it is by far a superior product. However, I've been cowed into sticking with Z1 in my ODY.

My Tortoise drinks Amsoil's coolaid.

 

[ryan2022]

Automatic trannys, make me a bit nervous swaying from the factory oil, but there are a lot of compatible fluids on the market now. I beleive I read here that Comptech (Acura hotrodders) recommended Redline for the CL/TL transmissions, and had great results with it. If Redline can preserve the lift of those transmission, there must be something to switching from OEM.

 

[gogozy]

Originally Posted By: MBCLK
interesting reading here...lots of people have faith with Amsoil ATF. I have a Honda and most mechanics recommend 30k intervals with the Z1...is that correct? Ive got 102,000 miles on the car. If earlier than 30k...why so early?

2nd question is...for those that use Amsoil ATF on a Honda....what interval are u using?

if i have a Honda 5 speed AT, i will definitely change it out at 30k miles.
i can feel TSX 5 speed AT shift get very soft at 30k miles with factory ATF, my other Honda, an 4 speed AT Accord did not have such issue at 60k miles with factory ATF. different type of AT may require different intervals, but after join BITOG and learn more about fluid, i will change out Z1 within 30k miles that is for sure.
i recall someone mention 50k for Amsoil.

 

[gogozy]

Originally Posted By: herrhaus
The reason that most folks who drive 2nd gen ODY's use Z1has more to do with a fear that AHC will not provide "goodwill" in the event of tranny failure......not that they don't have faith in Amsoil ATF.

I don't believe that Honda would actually take a sample of the ATF from the failed transmission and send it off to determine if it's actually Z1 or not. However, when facing the service manager and explaining that you have "maintained" the vehicle, it usually helps to have a record and receipts that back up your claim that the vehicle was properly maintained. That in essence is why most Honda owners with the 4-speed and the 5-speed transmissions (1999-2004) stay with the Z1.

Now with that said, I hardly think that using Amsoil's ATF doesn't constitute "proper maintenance". In my opinion, it is by far a superior product. However, I've been cowed into sticking with Z1 in my ODY.

My Tortoise drinks Amsoil's coolaid.

agree, i found it on the 2009 MDX menu.

Quote:
Use only Acura ATF-Z1 (Automatic
Transmission Fluid). Do not mix with
other transmission fluids.
Using transmission fluid other than
Acura ATF-Z1 may cause deterioration
in transmission operation and
durability, and could result in damage
to the transmission.
Damage resulting from the use of
transmission fluid other than Acura
ATF-Z1 is not covered by the Acura
new vehicle warranty.
Quote:

does this means use other than ATF-Z1 will damage AT, or strictly means no warranty on AT if a none-Z1 fluid cause the AT damage (well, of couse, because Honda supply the Z1, whoever supply the fluid shall cover the cost, isnt it?)

 

[tygger]

Mobil 1's description lists its synthetic ATF and multi-vehicle ATF as meeting the Honda ATF-Z1 requirements.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Other_Products/Mobil_1_Synthetic_ATF.aspx

Should I still stick with Z1?

 

[MBCLK]

I would personally change ur ATF at 15k instead of 30k whether it be Z1 or Mobil 1 or Amsoil....especially these big engines that use transmissions made for 4 cylinders. Not sure if the 2007/08/09 Hondas/Acuras have improved their trannys..but the previous ones have known tranny issues with the v6 engines.

Remember, Hondas have bulletproof engines. But their transmissions are their Achilles Heel.

 

[Cooper]

Originally Posted By: AzFireGuy79
I have experienced the same issue with Z-1 in my mothers Acura TL. I even did a complete flush a while back just to see if the drain and fills were the culprit. Still was having issues. I have run Amsoil in a few others and just ordered a case this AM for the TL. I am hoping it cures this issue. Other fluids I have used eventually have the same harsh shift issues as the Z-1. Even some very good synthetic ATF's.


What other synthetic ATF's have you used in a Honda? Just curious as I am going to try Mobil 1's new ATF in my Honda Ody soon.

 

[KBK]

My experience, since I used to use my car for food delivery a lot. I believed my tranny and Amsoil ATF doesn't go that I have expected. Even though It is smoother when I drive but when it comes to shifting gears, it is worse. I don't blame the Amsoil ATF because my tranny was not in a good shape so I can't conclude anything. Lots of people have good experience with Amsoil ATF and some are not because of the way we use cars are so different.

I will try Maxlife ATF by drain and fill 3 times and see if it is suitable for my style of driving

 

[herrhaus]

Many people equate smooth shifting as a +. I will submit to you that is not always the case. Honda transmissions should not shift overly "smooth". Rather, they should be "crisp".....I don't mean like *bang* crisp. You should be able to clearly tell when the transmission shifts. Smooth implies that the there is more clutch slipping between gears which = more clutch wear + more heat. So smooth shifting should not be your judge of whether or not a particular ATF is working well. A crisp shift implies that there is a quick transition between gears and less clutch wear and less heat generated.

The best way to determine whether an ATF is working well in a transmission is the UOA.

There are many members on the ODYCLUB who use Maxlife and have had good results with it. Same can be said of the Amsoil. Wolfshead has had poor results. Dextron III has been so, so (with members complaining about overly harsh shift quality). Of the top of my bald head….that’s all I can remember at this point.

Bottom line, if you feel that you’re far enough out of warranty and you don’t feel that Honda would extend you “goodwill”, then I’d not be afraid of using a product that states that it is a replacement for Z1.

Personally, I will probably switch to Amsoil at some point in the future. I have about a case and half left of Z1 under the bench. I have a Magnefine and a 22,000 GVW Tru-cool (Long) ATF cooler installed on the ODY. We are currently at ~82K miles on her. My overall impression of shift quality with the Z1 is favorable. So, while the stuff is priced like synthetic (or even more expensive…aaaarrrgg

), I’ll continue to use it until my supply runs out. Should my tranny fail, I’ll be able to produce a complete record of my maintenance as well as the receipts for the “proper fluid” for the service manager (or district AHC rep).