Any ideas about those HHO generators ?
How bad are those for engine ?
Anyone is running one of thos kits ?
Thank You for all the info
I built a unit and bought the O2 sensor module control kit so as to not create a lean condition and it does work and I did get more mileage but I have to do more experimentation with the unit that creates the HHO because it's just not practical enough and I would have to bring it inside in the winter or else it freezes.
I also have to determine the cost of the catalyst I use in the water...
All things aside it does work and I'm able to get almost 200KM extra out of a tank of fuel, but I don't know what it's doing to my engine and whats a safe level to run it at.
I have to do more research, I just don't have the time with work...
The site I got the ideas from was hydrogentap.com he also has a bunch of youtube videos where he shows him hooking it up to his Honda.
Now I'm doing this for fun not because I think I can out smart an engineer etc...
If you go back to your basic physics where you studied energy balances, you'd find that this goes against the basic energy principles.
In short, you will not develop more energy in your engine with hydrogen, than the parasitic electrical losses from the engine that were used to create the hydrogen.
During peak electrical useage, some power is generated using diesel fuel. How could diesel fuel, converted to electricity, which produces hydrogen, be cheaper than burning the original petroleum? The conversion losses are staggering.
StevieC, you mention the O2 kit so that you don't run lean, but you're injecting a stoich mixture of hydrogen and oxygen, so how would that affect the O2 readings? I went around and around with a guy here at the office about these kits until he mentioned screwing around with the O2 readings, then everything made sense! Gasoline is most efficient at 17-20:1, not at 14.7:1 like most cars run, so by screwing with the O2 readings, you can actually lean the car out and make it more efficient, as well as sending NOx emissions through the roof. I wouldn't suggest taking it in for an inspection if they hook up to the tailpipe where you're at.
As I understand it from reading online, pumping the HHO gas in the engine makes the computer think it's running lean because of excessive oxygen in the exhaust. So it enrichens the mixture. Now it there is still some mileage difference without this gizmo, but with it the results are much better.
You calibrate the Oxygen sensor control unit, by reading the voltages at full warm idle and you average the readings, then you attach the gizmo in between the O2's and the ECU, and tune it back to those average numbers with the HHO feeding into the engine.
It does work because I was only averaging about 50-60KM / tank without this device and just HHO and with both I get 200KM extra per tank.
And yes, I have access to a gas analyzer emission machine at a friends auto-shop and have played with the settings both with/without HHO and both with/without the O2-sensor gizmo to see how things are affected by what settings.
Now I'm not running the HHO unit, but I do have the O2-gizmo connected and leaned out a tad to save me fuel, but not enough to increase the NOX. I'm saving about 30-35KM/tank with this setting so I have left it for now.
I haven't thought about talking about it here for fear of people tearing apart my "for hobby" experiment.
Sounds good Stevie, do you have a scangauge? I wonder what the ECU does with the timing when you are telling the car its running richer than it actually is... The factory lean burn cars advanced the timing alot, but if your ECU thinks things are rich then it would pull timing...
I'm interested if its possible to get the 02 gizmo seperate from the rest of the HHO stuff?
Here is where to get the O2 sensor gizmo: http://www.fuelsaver-mpg.com/doc/EfieInstall.html
I notice no real difference with the timing when leaning it out to the point that I have, although I'm not super leaning it or anything.
They have a 1 or 2 upstream Oxygen sensor control box.
But you could power it on battery power that you charged using your utility at a much cheaper rate than than burning gasoline and running it off your alternator!
Put a deep-cycle marine battery in your car and wire an on-off switch to the alternator's field coil. Charge it up when you're home, and drive around with the alternator turned off. This should be good for at least two hours of driving before you had to charge the battery again (based on a 30-amp draw).