It could be? They suggested I call my Auto Insurance to put a claim but it won't cover this.
He's Dead Jim! Engine Warranty Denied! Help!
- Thread starter porschepilot
- Start date
- Status
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Also, that doesnt look "collapsed", it looks slightly compressed from being installed into the canister, just like most canister filters pictures I have seen on BITOG.
^^^This!^^^
I too have seen some of the members here post pics with their cartridge filters looking the same way. But, did their engines fail due to a somewhat slightly compressed/collapsed/smashed/pushed down (?????) filter like this? I haven't heard/read it here on the forums, until now. I just don't see it causing the engine to throw a rod. Usually, when an engine throws a rod it's due to oil starvation/bearing score/hydra lock, etc.
Did the dealer bring in a professional (I don't even know what to call such a person) to analyze this? IMHO, I would hire an attorney.
Exactly! Ill need to contact https://www.bar.ca.gov/ to see if we can bring an "Expert"
Originally Posted By: SOHCman
Also, that doesnt look "collapsed", it looks slightly compressed from being installed into the canister, just like most canister filters pictures I have seen on BITOG.
^^^This!^^^
I too have seen some of the members here post pics with their cartridge filters looking the same way. But, did their engines fail due to a somewhat slightly compressed/collapsed/smashed/pushed down (?????) filter like this? I haven't heard/read it here on the forums, until now. I just don't see it causing the engine to throw a rod. Usually, when an engine throws a rod it's due to oil starvation/bearing score/hydra lock, etc.
Did the dealer bring in a professional (I don't even know what to call such a person) to analyze this? IMHO, I would hire an attorney.
Exactly! Ill need to contact https://www.bar.ca.gov/ to see if we can bring an "Expert"
Originally Posted By: PimTac
Was this engine manufactured by VM? While it may not be the same engine with mass failures, there may be some shared critical components like the bearings. The stories of the one engine are astounding with main bearing failures in the 20k mile range.
I hope all goes well for the OP, as it should.
I'm not sure what the VM is? This one is a 6cyl 3.0 Diesel. I believe this is the engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_OM642
Was this engine manufactured by VM? While it may not be the same engine with mass failures, there may be some shared critical components like the bearings. The stories of the one engine are astounding with main bearing failures in the 20k mile range.
I hope all goes well for the OP, as it should.
I'm not sure what the VM is? This one is a 6cyl 3.0 Diesel. I believe this is the engine https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercedes-Benz_OM642
Last edited:
You all have some great points and there is a large consensuses that the filter did not do this.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
Are there two different filters for this engine? I’m finding references to a “long” and a “short”.
It appears wix/NAPA is one brand which is made in Poland.
Who changed the oil and how long before the engine problem?
Oh, and is the plastic end cap deformed? It almost looks like it is convex...
It appears wix/NAPA is one brand which is made in Poland.
Who changed the oil and how long before the engine problem?
Oh, and is the plastic end cap deformed? It almost looks like it is convex...
Last edited:
The dealer does not decide if a warranty is denied or not.
Part of the story is missing here and you should be contacting the manufacturer.
Part of the story is missing here and you should be contacting the manufacturer.
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
This is a perfect example of how a dealer can jerk around a car owner. Did the dealer prove the filter caused the problem? No, he said it did and then refused to do the work under the warranty. Will it get done? Probably after a fight no doubt, and from the way these things usually go, it will be the vehicle owner proving the filter didn't cause the problem, while the van sits unusable. Another option is to spend a lot of money hiring a lawyer to make the dealer prove the filter was bad. The dealer is in the position of power, not the car owner. FTR I seriously doubt the filter was the cause, as do others, will that help? Time will tell. Good luck!
I'd try another dealership and see how that goes.
they are charging $388 so far so I'll have to pay again with another dealer as well LOL. Thanks! Let see how it goes. I was going to also contact the https://www.bar.ca.gov/
Ouch, that's a big hit to have to shell out twice. See where the CA BAR gets you, they might point you in the right direction. As I mentioned before I would also scour the web for any "dirt" on that engine.
It might also be of some benefit to contact the filter maker and get their feedback. If they tell you that is normal, or wouldn't cause the engine failure that have that might be ammo for a court battle. I would consider the comments from the filter company the opinion of an expert, in writing even better. It might be difficult to get, but I think if you word it right you might get lucky.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
This is a perfect example of how a dealer can jerk around a car owner. Did the dealer prove the filter caused the problem? No, he said it did and then refused to do the work under the warranty. Will it get done? Probably after a fight no doubt, and from the way these things usually go, it will be the vehicle owner proving the filter didn't cause the problem, while the van sits unusable. Another option is to spend a lot of money hiring a lawyer to make the dealer prove the filter was bad. The dealer is in the position of power, not the car owner. FTR I seriously doubt the filter was the cause, as do others, will that help? Time will tell. Good luck!
I'd try another dealership and see how that goes.
they are charging $388 so far so I'll have to pay again with another dealer as well LOL. Thanks! Let see how it goes. I was going to also contact the https://www.bar.ca.gov/
Ouch, that's a big hit to have to shell out twice. See where the CA BAR gets you, they might point you in the right direction. As I mentioned before I would also scour the web for any "dirt" on that engine.
It might also be of some benefit to contact the filter maker and get their feedback. If they tell you that is normal, or wouldn't cause the engine failure that have that might be ammo for a court battle. I would consider the comments from the filter company the opinion of an expert, in writing even better. It might be difficult to get, but I think if you word it right you might get lucky.
Using the Wix look up for the 2013 Sprinter 3.0L Diesel I find one cartridge listed, the 57062. That is also what Rock Auto shows to be the correct cartridge. The detailed zoom view on Wix look up does show a coo of Poland.
One thing I wanted to check was if any of spec cartridge applications showed a filter integral center tube cage. Looking at RA manufacturer pics, none that show that view do. So in that respect, same as the Wix.
'If' the correct spec cartridge was installed and used as vehicle manufacturer recommended, then it would/should be covered by filter warranty. Assuming all those things are correct, there would need to be some evidence/proof the cartridge caused the failure. Again, strictly looking at cartridge I'm not convinced it was the cause of the failure.
However worst case, if the wrong cartridge application was installed, then I'm afraid you are SOL. Unless of course a shop provided the cartridge and installed it, in which case it would/should be on them.
One thing I wanted to check was if any of spec cartridge applications showed a filter integral center tube cage. Looking at RA manufacturer pics, none that show that view do. So in that respect, same as the Wix.
'If' the correct spec cartridge was installed and used as vehicle manufacturer recommended, then it would/should be covered by filter warranty. Assuming all those things are correct, there would need to be some evidence/proof the cartridge caused the failure. Again, strictly looking at cartridge I'm not convinced it was the cause of the failure.
However worst case, if the wrong cartridge application was installed, then I'm afraid you are SOL. Unless of course a shop provided the cartridge and installed it, in which case it would/should be on them.
The cartridge looking convex on top does suggest wrong installation. The longer version is also wider, and for Mexico 2.1 L. But if installed wrong, and it was blocking oil flow, the red oil light would have come on before failure. Looking up this engine, it is all aluminum. Maybe it won't be popular to say because people own them, but a truck diesel all aluminum versus cast iron?
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
Using the Wix look up for the 2013 Sprinter 3.0L Diesel I find one cartridge listed, the 57062. That is also what Rock Auto shows to be the correct cartridge. The detailed zoom view on Wix look up does show a coo of Poland.
One thing I wanted to check was if any of spec cartridge applications showed a filter integral center tube cage. Looking at RA manufacturer pics, none that show that view do. So in that respect, same as the Wix.
'If' the correct spec cartridge was installed and used as vehicle manufacturer recommended, then it would/should be covered by filter warranty. Assuming all those things are correct, there would need to be some evidence/proof the cartridge caused the failure. Again, strictly looking at cartridge I'm not convinced it was the cause of the failure.
However worst case, if the wrong cartridge application was installed, then I'm afraid you are SOL. Unless of course a shop provided the cartridge and installed it, in which case it would/should be on them.
Yes, if it's the wrong filter I agree he would be SOL, and then the blame should/would switch to the installer. I was going under the [censored]umption that the filter used was the correct filter. I hope so now.
Using the Wix look up for the 2013 Sprinter 3.0L Diesel I find one cartridge listed, the 57062. That is also what Rock Auto shows to be the correct cartridge. The detailed zoom view on Wix look up does show a coo of Poland.
One thing I wanted to check was if any of spec cartridge applications showed a filter integral center tube cage. Looking at RA manufacturer pics, none that show that view do. So in that respect, same as the Wix.
'If' the correct spec cartridge was installed and used as vehicle manufacturer recommended, then it would/should be covered by filter warranty. Assuming all those things are correct, there would need to be some evidence/proof the cartridge caused the failure. Again, strictly looking at cartridge I'm not convinced it was the cause of the failure.
However worst case, if the wrong cartridge application was installed, then I'm afraid you are SOL. Unless of course a shop provided the cartridge and installed it, in which case it would/should be on them.
Yes, if it's the wrong filter I agree he would be SOL, and then the blame should/would switch to the installer. I was going under the [censored]umption that the filter used was the correct filter. I hope so now.
^^^^ Yeah, many unknowns here so the improper/non spec cartridge was just worst case speculation after a mention of a possible long and short cartridge application. More information will eliminate some of that speculation.
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
You all have some great points and there is a large consensuses that the filter did not do this.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
Yeah it is a pain to deal with. (experiencing it myself) Ultimately decide how much the repair is and see if it is worth your effort in legal battle. They have $$$ for lawyers that makes your end less worthwhile. Document as best you can. Best of luck.
You all have some great points and there is a large consensuses that the filter did not do this.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
Yeah it is a pain to deal with. (experiencing it myself) Ultimately decide how much the repair is and see if it is worth your effort in legal battle. They have $$$ for lawyers that makes your end less worthwhile. Document as best you can. Best of luck.
Get yourself legal help. Tack the legal fees on when you win. Dealer is full of it.
Originally Posted By: Jooksing
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
You all have some great points and there is a large consensuses that the filter did not do this.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
Yeah it is a pain to deal with. (experiencing it myself) Ultimately decide how much the repair is and see if it is worth your effort in legal battle. They have $$$ for lawyers that makes your end less worthwhile. Document as best you can. Best of luck.
Yes but the don't like hearing from the BBB or the State Attorney Generals office. That basically is a phone call.
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
You all have some great points and there is a large consensuses that the filter did not do this.
I love hearing everyone's opinion. At first I thought it was my fault and loss but now I'm seeing that I'm being scapegoated.
Yeah it is a pain to deal with. (experiencing it myself) Ultimately decide how much the repair is and see if it is worth your effort in legal battle. They have $$$ for lawyers that makes your end less worthwhile. Document as best you can. Best of luck.
Yes but the don't like hearing from the BBB or the State Attorney Generals office. That basically is a phone call.
Last edited:
Time to lawyer up. I have a friend who recently returned his WRX back to Subaru under the lemon law (not that your Sprinter is lemon, but it might be). He retained a consumer lawyer specializing in lemon laws. Subaru ended up settling and cutting him a check to buy back his Subaru (pro rating the miles he put on). In addition, Subaru also paid for his attorney fees. If I was in your position, I would at least sit down with a consumer lawyer and discuss your case. Good luck!
-ttvr4
-ttvr4
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: alarmguy
The dealer does not decide if a warranty is denied or not.
Part of the story is missing here and you should be contacting the manufacturer.
This. I'd kick it up a level before hiring lawyer. If that fails, get one.
The dealer does not decide if a warranty is denied or not.
Part of the story is missing here and you should be contacting the manufacturer.
This. I'd kick it up a level before hiring lawyer. If that fails, get one.
I’m wondering if we have been looking at the wrong aspect of the picture (the twisted or wavy pleats) have a look at:
and
http://www.sprintervandiaries.com/2016/06/17/sprinter-oil-change/
and note how much larger in diameter the filters are.
Additionally like sayjac pointed out looking up a 2013 you only get one filter option but it does appear the the 4CYL became optional in the US in 14 and it takes a different filter.
I’m starting to wonder if the wrong filter is installed.
Be nice if the OP gave us additional details perhaps after his meeting at the dealer today.
and
http://www.sprintervandiaries.com/2016/06/17/sprinter-oil-change/
and note how much larger in diameter the filters are.
Additionally like sayjac pointed out looking up a 2013 you only get one filter option but it does appear the the 4CYL became optional in the US in 14 and it takes a different filter.
I’m starting to wonder if the wrong filter is installed.
Be nice if the OP gave us additional details perhaps after his meeting at the dealer today.
Last edited:
Hello again guys. Went to talk to the shop foreman. I don't think they are trying to screw me. They just need to make sure MBZ approves the repair as we know. He basically put the fault to the filter that was after market. BTW thanks for letting it was a Wix. You were right Duck Ryder! I asked them how could the filter cause it when it was in tactic? No real answer lol? I mentioned that the filter was not obstructed? If the oil was restricted, would it not just seize the engine rather then explode? That's what other mechanics I spoke with said. Should I contact Wix and let them know?? Would they step in if the Dealer is blaming thier product?
Here is a pic next to OEM.
Here is a pic next to OEM.
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
If the oil was restricted, would it not just seize the engine rather then explode? That's what other mechanics I spoke with said. Should I contact Wix and let them know?? Would they step in if the Dealer is blaming thier product?
If the rod bearings got starved of oil they can sieze and throw a rod, which is what it sounds like happened with this engine.
Was the right WIX part number filter installed or not?
If the oil was restricted, would it not just seize the engine rather then explode? That's what other mechanics I spoke with said. Should I contact Wix and let them know?? Would they step in if the Dealer is blaming thier product?
If the rod bearings got starved of oil they can sieze and throw a rod, which is what it sounds like happened with this engine.
Was the right WIX part number filter installed or not?
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
If the oil was restricted, would it not just seize the engine rather then explode? That's what other mechanics I spoke with said. Should I contact Wix and let them know?? Would they step in if the Dealer is blaming thier product?
If the rod bearings got starved of oil they can sieze and throw a rod, which is what it sounds like happened with this engine.
Was the right WIX part number filter installed or not?
The number on the top is hard to read? I'm not sure if that is the part number or other number for manufacturing purposes?
Originally Posted By: porschepilot
If the oil was restricted, would it not just seize the engine rather then explode? That's what other mechanics I spoke with said. Should I contact Wix and let them know?? Would they step in if the Dealer is blaming thier product?
If the rod bearings got starved of oil they can sieze and throw a rod, which is what it sounds like happened with this engine.
Was the right WIX part number filter installed or not?
The number on the top is hard to read? I'm not sure if that is the part number or other number for manufacturing purposes?
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked