Has asphalt quality diminished in recent times
- Thread starter walterjay
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Every asphalt driveway that I have ever owned has been soft when it gets hot out, and this goes back many decades. I have been told that the "hardness" can be upped by adding more aggregate to the mixture, but then it is prone to cracking (and subsequent heaving from freezing water underneath in the winter).
I was told that here in Virginia VDOT changed the asphalt specification to something that is cheaper and doesn't last as long, and that's what they use for driveways because the biggest customer is VDOT and they won't mix up a small batch of something different for a driveway.
They are mixing in old asphalt when making new asphalt.
Are you sure you did not get Millings. There are several seasonal people that come around every year that want to blacktop my driveway with them. I am told they are fine for pathways and light duty surfaces but wont stand up to heavy objects in warm weather.
And if you believe there is only one specification for bituminous (asphalt) paving and the plant can't make something different, you've been misled...
Straight from one of our major suppliers: Each asphalt batch is produced to customer specifications, much like ready mix concrete....
The mix used on each of roadways varies depending on the road design, soils, and traffic load among other parameters
The mixture may have changes, the placement may not have been done as well or compacted as well as your old mix. It may have something to do with the mix your installer used, or how it was installed, etc... Or it may just be the new mix is not as brittle and hard as a weathered old mix was. Unless everyone with an install at the same time as yours has the same problem, its tough to make a blanket statement...
Like anything else, if you buy enough, you can have it made exactly how you want.
Does the average residential driveway require enough asphalt that you can get something different from the standard DOT spec?
You normally get whatever the plant may be running on a particular day. When a plant is running a certain mix for a big paving project, the smaller companies get in line and buy whatever is being produced at that time. The plant isn’t going to stop and make a small batch for one customer.
Yes, and in Virginia, probably more than 99% of the asphalt manufactured in the state is for VDOT projects, since they maintain the majority of the roads in the state, even down to subdivision streets.
Dunno how it is in other states, but VDOT specifications have such high importance here that even the gravel specified for drain tile backfill for my house is a VDOT specification, "VDOT #8 stone".
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Paving and roofing asphalt follows AASHTO and ASTM specs. Roofing asphalt is oxidized to allow it to “weather”. Paving asphalt is straight from the refinery before it’s mixed with aggregate. Asphalt for many road projects has a small amount of used roofing shingles and tires in it - but for a small driveway the rules can be looser.
Recycled asphalt roads around here disintegrate after three years..
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That is often the same stuff NY DOT fills potholes with and does NOT last in our freeze/thaw climate. Used often on the Taconic and usually before winter even ends the potholes are back.
My brother from another mother for the last 20 years owns a mid end construction company that gets a lot of government work (mainly schools) with project budgets 5mil plus that often include paving large parking lots and/or access roads. He told me it depends upon the plant. The closest plant to me is in Cold Spring, NY. They will mix per your order if that order is sufficient enough. He told me that most often when the plant opens in early Spring (usually closes end Nov depending on temps) they are more flexible but once the season kicks in with force and more and more large scale paving of highways and roadways are underway, DOT spec is usually what is available and often cheaper than seeking a cheaper mix for less heavy usage.
He did my driveway about 15 years ago with the DOT mix. I'm on a small mountain with granite underneath that he was concerned about shifting and causing cracks. We had to blast sections for the driveway cut. It has held up well. I was worried as he told me do not seal it. I listened and the only damage I have from one of his machines (CAT 340 excavator) he stores at my house, crossing the bottom of my driveway.
Asphalt is the snigle most recycled substance on earth. It is generally milled up, taken back to the plane , heated, mixed with solvent to get it back to a spreadable consistency and then used. Yes, there are formulas for the asphalt but the base heavy black residue that holds everything together that comes from petroleum refining can be used over and over.
Lots of recycling going on. Charging to dispose of tires, old ashalt, etc. Then charging to put it back down. That's how they make great profits on both ends. Your suplier pays you to take away their product. Your customer pays you to put it back down. Cha Ching best business model available. Plus if it does last now you get to do it all over again. Then you blame government for regulations and recycling mandates.
Asphalt gets heated up at the asphalt plant and laid down while it's still viscous enough.
It stands to reason that the stuff they spread on roads can be thicker, as they have an organized caravan to get it there just in time.
Now for one-off driveway jobs, they need to do "something" to get it to the house and have it still spreadable. Since residential service sees much less traffic, they (feel they) can compromise.
It stands to reason that the stuff they spread on roads can be thicker, as they have an organized caravan to get it there just in time.
Now for one-off driveway jobs, they need to do "something" to get it to the house and have it still spreadable. Since residential service sees much less traffic, they (feel they) can compromise.
Zee09
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Mine is 22 years old and is very good plus shape
I am seeing limited life in newer installs as well.
A bunch of shady characters in that business
I am seeing limited life in newer installs as well.
A bunch of shady characters in that business
My town / county has a mobile recycling unit that grinds the old pavement in the front of the unit and recycles it and puts it right back on at the rear of the vehicle. Thinnest, worst paving job I've ever seen.. And its implemented on almost all the roads here.. One road was worked over last year, and it has been crumpled apart and has massive holes in it. SO friggin cheap, I haven't seen new pavement laid down in years!!
Mine is 22 years old and is very good plus shape
I am seeing limited life in newer installs as well.
A bunch of shady characters in that business
It does make you wonder. About 200ft of my driveway is asphalt. The house is 50yrs old and this driveway surface has to be a good 30-40yrs old and it's still in decent shape. I seal coat it every 2yrs and touch up areas that need it with filler/sealer every year or so.
One of the keys is if you can luck out with a very hard and stable surface under the asphalt. What ever you choose as a top surface over that is going to last a long time. I've had full concrete trucks up/down my driveway, the septic pumper every 2yrs, etc.
