Goodbye Red light cams... Hello to...

[MCompact]

Originally Posted By: Benzadmiral

If we still had brave Americans, those cameras would all be spray-painted (or Vaselined as you suggest) the week they went up. Speed bumps would get pried up and tossed, too.


I always assume that speed bumps are placed in particularly hazardous areas- so when I encounter one(especially in subdivisions late at night) I sound my horn for at least 3-5 seconds to warn others.

 

[MalfunctionProne]

Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: dishdude


The traffic light hasn't changed in over half a century and I think it's time. A timer, a longer yellow or a blinking green before the yellow would give drivers more time to prepare to stop. When I drive in the city here, I always glance over to see the timer on the crosswalk as I approach an intersection so I know if I need to start braking, hit the gas or keep coasting.


When I was very small I remember a few old traffic lights around that worked like this:

Green
Green & yellow for a couple seconds
Yellow
Yellow & red for a couple seconds
Red

If safety is the concern why not return to this?

John


Yeah, safety is not the concern lol! Though it is all about the green...

Cheers and Happy New Year, friend!

 

[MalfunctionProne]

Originally Posted By: MCompact
Originally Posted By: Benzadmiral

If we still had brave Americans, those cameras would all be spray-painted (or Vaselined as you suggest) the week they went up. Speed bumps would get pried up and tossed, too.


I always assume that speed bumps are placed in particularly hazardous areas- so when I encounter one(especially in subdivisions late at night) I sound my horn for at least 3-5 seconds to warn others.


It has been said that roads are left in disrepair around here and speed bumps put in/left up to deter or make impossible street racing. Once upon a time, I guess stolen car joyrides were that common. And, as assenine as this sounds.. people sometimes steal two cars, and "play chase" in them. (Read: Race.) 80MPH down an East Orange or Newark or sometimes Irvington side street could happen. I was in a car - my car, once, actually - when it happened (He was driving, not me.) And out of those three cities, only Irvington and East Orange take their policing seriously. Too seriously. Attitude problems galore; apologies to any good and competent "LEOs," as they call them down south.

I drive over speed bumps at regular speed in the Expedition. One of them snsps it back down with the back wheels before it can even fully go up, like Martin Lawrence and Tim Robbins in the trailer for Nothing To Lose. (Somewhere around midway through, in his 1996 GMC Yukon lol)

 

[Shannow]

Originally Posted By: MCompact
I always assume that speed bumps are placed in particularly hazardous areas- so when I encounter one(especially in subdivisions late at night) I sound my horn for at least 3-5 seconds to warn others.


Love it !!!

 

[grampi]

If these places that are using these cameras were concerned about safety, they would be devising ways to catch people messing around with their cell phones while driving and drinking and driving...both are far more dangerous that merely speeding or running red lights...

 

[bammer5609]

So, people don't like radar, photo radar, or red light cameras. These are devices that police use to catch people breaking the law. If you are speeding, you are breaking the law. Also, this is a user pay system, if you speed, you get a ticket, plane and simple. If people don't like the devices, what are police supposed to do get some kind of control on the road? They can't be everywhere, and people can't be trusted to "do the right thing" on the road. In a perfect world, and people were courteous, followed the rules, didn't run from accidents, do you think the police would still be out there? The main problem is, we, the drivers, can't be trusted, we have proven that, we need to smarten up and quite being [censored] out there. I believe that the people who don't like the rules and regulations are the biggest contributer to the problem. I always thought that having driverless cars would be more a problem, but now i am thinking that getting rid of the main source of the problem, the driver, is now warranted. Until they get rid of the "stupid" in drivers, it will never change, and will only get worse with more out there.

 

[Jarlaxle]

Are you a sock for a regular?

 

[Tdbo]

Originally Posted By: bammer5609
I believe that the people who don't like the rules and regulations are the biggest contributer to the problem.



Seriously? How many times a week do you require watering?

 

[bammer5609]

What dose that have to do with the topic? I have a thought, I contributed it, I was not rude, or offensive to anyone, and get a personal shot like that. How did I offend you?

 

[DBMaster]

Originally Posted By: bammer5609
I always thought that having driverless cars would be more a problem, but now i am thinking that getting rid of the main source of the problem, the driver, is now warranted. Until they get rid of the "stupid" in drivers, it will never change, and will only get worse with more out there.


X2!

 

[dja4260]

Originally Posted By: dparm
We've had them in Chicago (near parks/schools) for a while now. They're well marked.


The offense is a freebie. It was also my last offense....

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: bammer5609
So, people don't like radar, photo radar, or red light cameras. These are devices that police use to catch people breaking the law. If you are speeding, you are breaking the law. Also, this is a user pay system, if you speed, you get a ticket, plane and simple. If people don't like the devices, what are police supposed to do get some kind of control on the road? They can't be everywhere, and people can't be trusted to "do the right thing" on the road. In a perfect world, and people were courteous, followed the rules, didn't run from accidents, do you think the police would still be out there? The main problem is, we, the drivers, can't be trusted, we have proven that, we need to smarten up and quite being [censored] out there. I believe that the people who don't like the rules and regulations are the biggest contributer to the problem. I always thought that having driverless cars would be more a problem, but now i am thinking that getting rid of the main source of the problem, the driver, is now warranted. Until they get rid of the "stupid" in drivers, it will never change, and will only get worse with more out there.


The problem in today's society is many people believe they're entitled to do whatever they want, even breaking the law, without consequence. People think they're entitled to speed, run red lights, use their cell phone while driving, tailgate, or anything else they feel like doing. We now live in a "me first" society, and whatever they are doing is more important than anything you're doing. Manners and politeness are a thing of the past. Nobody's going to buy into any device that holds them responsible for their law breaking actions. Illegal immigrants and people like Michael Brown and his ilk are more examples of what's wrong with today's society...as long as people have this mentality, there will be people whining and moaning about any method used to curtail illegal actions...my problem with these issues isn't that they're going after the law breakers, it's what they're going after them for...they always say these devices are for safety, then why not go after the most dangerous violators? Speeding and red light running are not anywhere close to being as dangerous as using a cell phone while driving, or drunk driving...

 

[Tdbo]

Originally Posted By: bammer5609
What dose that have to do with the topic? I have a thought, I contributed it, I was not rude, or offensive to anyone, and get a personal shot like that. How did I offend you?


I apologize for being inaccurate.

Actually, the comment that I found offensive was the sentence before: "The main problem is, we the drivers, can't be trusted, we have proven that, we need to smarten up and quite (quit?) being (censored) out there."
Therefore, since I am a part of "we the drivers," I take offense to your broad strokes with a wide brush.

I drive over 30K a year just to work. I have been told by family, friends and others riding with me that I am a safe driver. In the three hours a day that I drive to work, I find that the vast majority of drivers drive safely and are courteous. Unfortunately in this world, there are a minority in this world who are self centered and lack common sense. Yes, I agree that those folks can pose hazards and they need to be dealt with in a constructive manner.

To paraphrase the Mayor of Chicago, one should never let a crisis go to waste. IMO, when traffic safety became an issue, it became an opportunity to use technology under the guise of "safety" to develop a source of income. The thought process included using cameras as behavior modification, offer a fine instead of points, bypass the sixth amendment (right to a defense), people write a check, and revenue is generated. People would simply write a check and be happy as clams that they are not getting points on their license and the ramifications of such.

I have observed the program in Columbus, Ohio as I live 15 minutes from there. When the cameras were installed, the babble from the city was it all about the safety and not about the revenue. Once people modified their behavior and the revenue dropped, more cameras were installed. What started as 19 cameras is presently 35. This past summer, as revenue from the state was dropping, and the Mayor/Council was coming off a spending spree, the city felt that it needed to tighten its budget. In addition, a bill was pending in the state legislature to outlaw these cameras. At that point the City Auditor stated that should this law pass the city budget would take a 2.5M hit (he was quoted in the Columbus Dispatch as saying this.) So, no it is not about the safety and it is about the revenue.

Presently the law has passed and is awaiting the Governor's signature (and a ruling from the Ohio Supreme court may complicate implementation.) It was modified to state that cameras could not be used unless an officer was present at the camera.

If the purpose is truely safety, enforcement by officers needs to be more vigorous to insure that the true driving menaces are removed from the road. More specifically, the red light issue could be dealt with by implementing best practices including more thoughtful timing of lights to allow for extended yellows and a dead time where all lights are read in an intersection to allow a dead time for the intersection to clear. As road construction allows, intersections can be designed in a way to eliminate or minimize red light running.

In regard to speed, run radar all day as long as there is a law enforcement officer running it. As long as he is not running an illegal speed trap, I'm okay with that.

Not everyone is okay with the big brother treatment nor are all of us irresponsible thugs. Rant over.

 

[bammer5609]

Ok, then how bout this: get rid of the holes. Make the laws black and white, no middle ground. Example: radar detectors allowed in some states not in others, just outright ban them, can't sell them can't use them, period. How dose that stop anything, people slow down when it goes off, then become stupid after passing trap. If you don't speed, you don't need it. Tinting on front windows, ban it, can't sell it, can't install it. More of a safety issue for police then anything. Dose that sound like a dictatorship, yup. But what else can you do. The days of public trust and good will to others is long gone. Heck, if we have to have black boxes put in vehicles, then do it. They don't lie or try to cheat the system. If you don't do anything wrong, why worry?

 

[grampi]

Tdbo

I'm not sure that these bad drivers are a minority...I too drive around 30K a year for my job...I can tell you the vast majority of drivers I encounter speed, and I'm not talking about 3-5 MPH over the limit, I'm talking about 15-20 MPH over...I also see people running red lights almost on a daily basis, and cell phone use and tailgating are an epidemic...

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted By: bammer5609
Dose[sic] that sound like a dictatorship,[sic] yup. But what else can you do.[sic]


In your case I would suggest moving to China or North Korea. Their law enforcement techniques would be right up your alley...

 

[Tdbo]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Tdbo

I'm not sure that these bad drivers are a minority...I too drive around 30K a year for my job...I can tell you the vast majority of drivers I encounter speed, and I'm not talking about 3-5 MPH over the limit, I'm talking about 15-20 MPH over...I also see people running red lights almost on a daily basis, and cell phone use and tailgating are an epidemic...


Maybe I'm just lucky. On my daily commute (and I deal with quite a bit of traffic from the Honda plants) I don't see that many. And they are usually ones that I can ID by vehicle.

Have I driven in places where there are bad drivers...Yes I have. I think that that is a law enforcement function in that they need to be pulled over, cited, points on their license, the whole enchilada. Then they also have the right to due process and to confront their accuser. No one is going to convince me that OHP does not have the resources to adequately patrol. I average 2-3 sightings/daily on 2 lane road.

I am still old school in the sense that red light/speed/lane changing cameras do nothing but remove due process rights from the accused in an effort to fill someones coffers.

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted By: Tdbo

I am still old school in the sense that red light/speed/lane changing cameras do nothing but remove due process rights from the accused in an effort to fill someones coffers.


Exactly- it is ALL about the money...

 

[spasm3]

Originally Posted By: MCompact
Originally Posted By: Tdbo

I am still old school in the sense that red light/speed/lane changing cameras do nothing but remove due process rights from the accused in an effort to fill someones coffers.


Exactly- it is ALL about the money...


Some towns were caught making the yellow light shorter in order to catch more red light photos. So its not about safety at all.

 

[bammer5609]

So don't give them the chance. It is a user pay system. Don't run red lights, don't fail to signal, don't tailgate, don't go 120 in a 50 zone, don't use your phone while driving, don't drive drunk, stop at a stop sign. These are all things that people do. In the end it comes down to the driver. If the tickets pay for some of the police budget without raising taxes, so be it. I have done very little in the 27 years of me driving to support their budget. As long as we do it, they will be out there.