German Syntec 0w30 and a blown engine

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26
Location
Toronto ON
Hey guys. I wanted to get your thoughts on this. I recently made it to the track for the first time this year, last minute decision and I was eager to go having just done a cam swap a month earlier. I wanted to change the oil before I went, it was due. I've been running 10W30 Mobil 1 in my car for a while but after reading the advice here, I wanted to try German made Syntec 0w30, so I picked some up at the Walmart just up the street from my buddies garage, did the oil change, and off I went with him to St Thomas dragway in London ON. Car was running well. At the track, car was again running pretty decent, bad night for traction that's all. Last run of the evening, feel the car get sluggish after the 1/8th. Return to the pits to notice an engine knock I didn't hear before. Car was towed home that night. Next morning we found a spun rod bearing on #1 cylinder. Upon tearing the engine right down, we found that all the bearings were in very good shape, infact the main bearings looked in awesome shape, just the one rod bearing decided to go. Engine was running great up until then too. [I dont know] My new engine is done and running good. I'm nearing the time when I can switch back to synthetic. But after my first experience with German Syntec, despite its great specs, I'm leary to try it again. Can anyone offer thoughts to sway me either way? [Frown] [ May 08, 2003, 01:00 AM: Message edited by: Will ]
 
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8,937
Location
SC
What kind of car is this? I seriously doubt the problem was caused by the oil. Edit: I just read your post asking about what oil to use in order to exceed the redline on your engine. Okay...now I'm fairly certain your blown engine wasn't caused by the oil. It no doubt was caused by a loose nut...the one behind the wheel. [Wink] [ May 08, 2003, 01:21 AM: Message edited by: G-Man II ]
 
Messages
263
Location
DFW, TX
If it were me, I'd stay away. I seriously doubt that the oil had anything to do with the failure, but there are too many other good oils around. If you go back to the Syntec, you will (I would) have that spun rod bearing in the back of your mind every time you run down the strip. Now, I wouldn't deter others from using the oil, but the peace of mind would be enough for me to find another.
 

Patman

Staff member
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21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
Will drives a Grand Prix GTP. Sorry to hear about the problem! After you raced that Firehawk I'm sure it didn't help matters either! [Wink] I'm surprised to hear of a problem with any 3.8, these things are usually bulletproof. The problem is definitely not related to the oil switch.
 
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2,095
Location
IL
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: ... The problem is definitely not related to the oil switch.
How do you know? Has anyone done a VOA? Or a UOA? I know of 2 different people that have spun bearings road racing with Tri-syn Mobil-1. And we know that TS was skimpy on the barrier additives. We don't even know what is in this oil. Secondly, the GTP specs a 10w30 min. Why don't they spec a 5w30 like most every other GM engine? Obviously there is more shear stresses or high contact pressures in this engine. Yes the German syntec is supposed to have a high HTHS, at least 3.5 supposedly, since it is A3 rated. But it is still a 0W. I have yet to see one that hasn't sheared in some cases. My vote...the oil is a HIGH probable cause or at least a contributing factor.
 

Jay

Messages
1,607
Location
Idaho Falls, ID
quote:
Originally posted by Will: ...Next morning we found a spun rod bearing on #1 cylinder. Upon tearing the engine right down, we found that all the bearings were in very good shape, infact the main bearings looked in awesome shape, just the one rod bearing decided to go.
Since only one bearing failed, and the rest are in "awesome" shape, I don't think you can attribute the failure to the oil.
 

Will

Thread starter
Messages
26
Location
Toronto ON
I'll have to find that Firehawk again [Wink] That was on my new engine, only 500kms on it but I couldn't resist. G-Man II, I actually never got around to getting the car tuned to run that high. My car is a GTP like Patman said, it had 220,000kms on it but was in great shape. It was shifting at 5800 which is fairly standard, about +300rpms compared to factory, and just about everyone with a modded GTP has a reprogrammed PCM so they're all spinning to the same amount. It sucked cause it was very out of the blue, nothing showed any signs of letting go and I thought I'd get another year+ out of the engine with the racing that I do. When we pulled one main bearing it was mint, it looked out of an engine with 30,000kms on it. At that point we started looking around for other explanations for the paperclip like metal strand in the oil pan thinking the bearings were just fine. The engine shop said the rest were in good shape, everything would have cleaned up at 10 easily. I might try the oil again, its hard to believe it caused it at all, its just such a coincidence its hard to shake in your mind [Frown]
 
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658
Location
EU
I don't see why the 0 weight has anything to do with it--the oil is warm and a 30 weight while running. Unless the implication is that the bearing spun upon startup. Dang, why don't one of you guys who can get it do a VOA? [ May 08, 2003, 11:19 PM: Message edited by: YZF150 ]
 
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96
Location
Mississauga / Ontario
~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dang, why don't one of you guys who can get it do a VOA? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~ I'll do a UOA on the SECOND 6k run, in a 2001 Accord. I just changed over from Dino oil, so I won't bother testing an oil that might show "skewed" results. So far, from what I can tell, the small consumption problem I've had, seems to have gone away. (keeping fingers crossed). I attribute it to the fact that it is a little thicker, but so far I really like it. At this point in the 6k interval, it is also quite cleaner than the conventional oils ever were. I'm being very hopeful. -Paul
 

Patman

Staff member
Messages
21,989
Location
Oakville, Ontario
quote:
Originally posted by Jason Troxell:
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: ... The problem is definitely not related to the oil switch.
How do you know? Has anyone done a VOA? Or a UOA?

I would imagine an oil would have to be completely terrible, or totally the wrong viscosity (by a huge amount) in order to cause a bearing to go like that so very quickly, and we all know this oil is one of Europe's best.
 
Messages
2,095
Location
IL
quote:
Originally posted by Patman:
quote:
Originally posted by Jason Troxell:
quote:
Originally posted by Patman: ... The problem is definitely not related to the oil switch.
How do you know? Has anyone done a VOA? Or a UOA?

I would imagine an oil would have to be completely terrible, or totally the wrong viscosity (by a huge amount) in order to cause a bearing to go like that so very quickly, and we all know this oil is one of Europe's best.

Would you say that TS M1 15w50 is completely terrible or totally wrong viscosity for a road racing BMW?
 
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