GC vs. M1 (for real this time)

[kcryan]

Im considering switching my 98 Infiniti I30 (same as a maxima) to GC from M1, i usually use M1 or Pure1 filters and go 5k miles, mostly short trips. I currently use M1 5w-30, what advantages and what disadvantages will i get with GC over M1

 

[pscholte]

quote:

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Originally posted by kcryan: Im considering switching my 98 Infiniti I30 (same as a maxima) to GC from M1, i usually use M1 or Pure1 filters and go 5k miles, mostly short trips. I currently use M1 5w-30, what advantages and what disadvantages will i get with GC over M1

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You will--compared to M1 5W-30-- get an A3 rated oil with a higher viscosity at operating temps, a higher HT/HS, a cutting edge chemistry (see Terry's remarks from testing) and a superior UOA track record even in head to head comparisons with M1. Obviously you are not going to do evil to your motor on M1 but if you want the better oil, GC is it.

 

[dkryan]

kc, What kind of gas mileage are you getting, on average, in your I30. Premium unleaded? The reason I ask is I have a 2001 I30 with 50K miles that always had Mobil 1 0W30 or 5W30 in the crankcase, until 42k. I switched to Saab's 0W30 long-life full sythetic turbo oil in April '04 and watched my gas mileage drop from an average of 23 to about 19 mpgs. I blamed the new Turanza LS-H tires, in part, but mechanically, everything on the car is quite sound. I changed it again in October '04 and I'm still running it until mid-May, when I'll switch back to Mobil 1 5W-30, just to see if that changes the mpg average. I'm not knocking GC (I have some of the '05 stuff I wanted to try), but it might be a really thick 30 wt. that is noticeably different from the "thin" Mobil 1 5W30 you're using. I'm interested in hearing how it works out for you if you switch.

 

[Ugly3]

quote:

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Originally posted by dkryan: kc, What kind of gas mileage are you getting, on average, in your I30. Premium unleaded? The reason I ask is I have a 2001 I30 with 50K miles that always had Mobil 1 0W30 or 5W30 in the crankcase, until 42k. I switched to Saab's 0W30 long-life full sythetic turbo oil in April '04 and watched my gas mileage drop from an average of 23 to about 19 mpgs. I blamed the new Turanza LS-H tires, in part, but mechanically, everything on the car is quite sound. I changed it again in October '04 and I'm still running it until mid-May, when I'll switch back to Mobil 1 5W-30, just to see if that changes the mpg average. I'm not knocking GC (I have some of the '05 stuff I wanted to try), but it might be a really thick 30 wt. that is noticeably different from the "thin" Mobil 1 5W30 you're using. I'm interested in hearing how it works out for you if you switch.

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Generally a switch of one grade (30 to 40w) will impace MPG by maybe 1% to 1.5%.

 

[dkryan]

Yeah, I agree, though I'd even concede 2-3 mpgs, not percent, to account for my sudden and sustained drop. It should be an interesting UOA next month, considering it will be the first ever for this car.

 

[LVHospiceRN]

Dont forget in addition to all the neato stuff mentioned in a earlier post, with GC you get the ELVES!!!!! darrell sin city

 

[kcryan]

i believe your 2001 would have the 3.5 right? or was that on the 02's? either way with an auto tranny, M1 5-30 and an S&B cone air filter. i have goten as low as 15 mpg but now i normally get 19-21 but do drive it real hard,and its almost all short trips. also i expect better #'s on summer gas. I always use 93 octane and the car has 77k miles but i expect to get it to 200 or 300 before it goes.

 

[dkryan]

Nah, it's Nissan's 3.0 liter V6. The 3.5's started showing up in 2003, I believe, in the Maxima and the Altima. I'd be ****** with 15 mpg! What kind of ETs are you turning for the quarter-mile? I had a K&N air filter in for about 24 months, took it out and used their filter-charger kit to clean it and re-oil it. When my mileage tanked (no pun intended), I surmised I had over-oiled the filter (I hadn't as it turned out) and replaced it with a Fram paper filter. Still no joy.

 

[Bob The Builder]

Hi dkryan, Since you used a K&N Filter, try cleaning off your mass airflow sensor if you have one. It will be an electrical sensor just after where the air filter is located. (should be) It'll most likely be called an air flow meter or sensor. What I do on my vehicle is I unscrew the housing that holds the air meter in place, gently lift it out (because it is made up of two tiny diodes held together by thin wire) without hitting the sides, and once you have it out, clean the diodes by spraying an electrical contact cleaner on them. You need to use this type of spray cleaner. You cannot use carb, throttle body or brake cleaner for this. These sprays will damage the electrodes. What happens to these diodes is that they get oil on them coming from the K&N Filter. This oil coats them and they can't read the incoming air properly anymore. I've done it, and it works. BtB

 

[MMX]

quote:

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Originally posted by 2x: If you go from a M1 with a cSt @ 100º C of 10 to GC with 12, that is a 20% increase. When I did this switch on my Honda Civic my MPG's cratered and the car felt as if I was towing a trailer. Switched back to M1 and the car got it's MPG's back and it felt like a Ferrari in comparison. Just because an oil is a "great" oil does not mean it will be great in all applications.

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I'm interested in knowing what generation/trim your Civic is. My 2000 SiR has/had been "lubricated" by M1 5W30/10W30 (4800km - 75000km), GC (75000 km - 85000 km), and 0W40 Lubro Moly (85000 km - now). Honestly, I haven't noticed any "significant" difference in terms of mileage or performance (butt-dynoed-wise , though this is totally psychological) among the 3 brands. However, my subjective "start-up" noise level comparison is as follows: M1 > GC > Lubro Moly. [ April 20, 2005, 01:08 PM: Message edited by: MMX ]

 

[2x]

If you go from a M1 with a cSt @ 100º C of 10 to GC with 12, that is a 20% increase. When I did this switch on my Honda Civic my MPG's cratered and the car felt as if I was towing a trailer. Switched back to M1 and the car got it's MPG's back and it felt like a Ferrari in comparison. Just because an oil is a "great" oil does not mean it will be great in all applications.

 

[Russell]

Dkryan, why do you blame the new Turanza LS-H tires on gas mileage drop? I have the same tires 225/60/15 (repalced 205/65/15) on my BMW and thougtt my mileage went down as well by about 1 mpg. I assumed it because of the wider tire (same diameter) and not tread design etc.

 

[kcryan]

Yea the 15 MPG was a bit of a shocker, admittadly i was driving the **** out of it on that tank. honestly i have no clue what my quater mile currently is

 

[dkryan]

kcryan - I was joking about your quarter-mile ET. I just figured you were treating traffic signals like "Christmas trees" at the track and getting your foot into the throttle at each stop light. Bob the Builder - Thanks! I was at a loss as to what to check next. I was thinking the PCV and hose, but I've yet to have one plugged up by 50K, though there is a first time for everything. One clue is that with all variables being equal, i.e, outside temperature, etc., the car seems to take an extra two or three minutes to reach normal operating temperature. I can recognize a t-stat that's stuck open, as 1987-92 Acuras were famous for that problem. I assume that a really thick 30 wt. can cause this? Also, if it is the mass airflow sensor, why do I not get a "check engine light?" And last, but not least, what about the throttle body? Is it possible it needs cleaning and could be part of the problem? I use 20 ounces of Chevron Techron every six months and I always use 93 octane BP, Mobil or Shell gasolines. 2x - I was thinking the same thing. I'm going to change the oil in early June and do a UOA on the Saab 0W30 synthetic turbo oil that's been in there for the last two changes. I was thinking of going back to Mobil 1, but using the GF-4/SM 10W30 instead of the "old" or "new" 5W30. Any thoughts, guys? Russell - No, I don't blame the Turanzas. I had read numerous reviews on TireRack.com that cited a drop in mileage with those tires, but the claimed mpg loss seemed insignificant (1 - 1.5 mpg). I like the Turanzas. They handle well and are quiet and are much better than the Goodyear RSAs that were OEM.

 

[kcryan]

ohh yes *** soon as the light went green i was flooring it, i kinda look at it as an accomplishment getting that bad of mileage.

 

[hannaco]

Your mass air flow sensor will not cause the check engine light to turn on if it is just oil coated. It will still pass the electrical characteristics test, and is still able to respond to changes in air flow. Just not correctly.

 

[dkryan]

That's interesting. I thought that with any problem with the mass airflow sensor, I'd get "driveability" problems such as poor idle, surging, etc. So that bad boy could be oil coated and cause my gas mileage to tank like it did, yet the engine still idle and accelerate as smoothly as it does? The downside is that my Haynes book said not to try and remove the sensor from the housing, claiming it is one integrated unit and doing so will ruin it. I'd really prefer not to have to pony up $375 for a new Nissan mass airflow sensor.

 

[Bob The Builder]

Hey dkryan, I wanted to make a few comments that might help. On my Tacoma, which is 8 years old now, I have never had a check engine light come on either. I believe your problems are twofold. I would check the fuel injectors, but chances are, that even if they are still working, they probably have some build up in them, and are probably not all injecting spray accurately. You might have one or two that are somewhat reduced in their ability to flow fuel, or they might even be stuck open to some degree. This in and of itself will cause up to a 5 to 10 mpg loss, along with the accompanying driveability issues. All this just because of the age of the injectors. Also, check and double check your plugs and wires if you have any wires on that engine. They may be degraded as well. Cheers. This will most likely help solve your problems. I'd bet on it and I don't even gamble. BtB

 

[dkryan]

Bob the Builder: Thanks for the reply! So, are you saying forget about the mass airflow sensor and concentrate on the injectors and plugs/wires? I use Chevron Techron 20-oz every six months and normally BP 93 octane fuel. I've never been a fan of the "105,00 mile tune-up" on those spark plugs and considered replacing them with OEMs at 60k. There are no driveability issues other than the loss in mileage. It starts fine, idles fine, accelerates fine (as fine as 227-hp can get you). All of that caused me to sit up and pay attention to your mass airflow sensor comments. And "hannaco's" post above added to my interest in the MAS as the culprit. I just wish I could take it apart, clean it, and see what happens. I hate "fishing trips," i.e., replacing parts until you find out what was bad. Stay tuned. I'll let you know how this turns out!

 

[2x]

[/qb][/QUOTE]I'm interested in knowing what generation/trim your Civic is. My 2000 SiR has/had been "lubricated" by M1 5W30/10W30 (4800km - 75000km), GC (75000 km - 85000 km), and 0W40 Lubro Moly (85000 km - now). Honestly, I haven't noticed any "significant" difference in terms of mileage or performance (butt-dynoed-wise , though this is totally psychological) among the 3 brands. However, my subjective "start-up" noise level comparison is as follows: M1 > GC > Lubro Moly. [/QB][/QUOTE] 1999 Civic DX Coupe Automatic.